Is Dragon Ball GT canonical?

[LowRyder2005]

«Hey, forum of Kanzenshuu, I have a question: is Dragon Ball GT canonical? ... If you answer "yes" you are, like, totally wrong though, because it obviously isn't, jerks!».

With that being said, I'm curious to see if the fanbase will implode in case some incongruous plot device (i.e. the notorious Spider-Man's "One More Day" deus ex machina) is used to ultimately make GT and Super fit in the same timeline.
I wouldn't exactly put such a feat past Toei, although it needs to be said that recent material (Xenoverse) tends to treat DB GT as its own thing, unrelated to what happened in Z/Kai + Super.

[dbs fanboy]

For me it is. Both GT and Super are canon but alternative dimensions or things like that.

[ABED]

For me it is. Both GT and Super are canon but alternative dimensions or things like that.

Canon isn't a matter of personal preference.

[dbs fanboy]

For me it is. Both GT and Super are canon but alternative dimensions or things like that.

Canon isn't a matter of personal preference.

Headcanon, then? However, since Toriyama doesn't care that much about that, i feel a little bit free with this.

[ABED]

There's no such thing as headcanon. Why did anyone feel the need to make up that word. Is it that hard to say something like, "In my imagination..."?

[sintzu]

There's no such thing as headcanon. Is it that hard to say something like, "In my imagination..."?

Aren't they the same thing ?

[coola]

What is canon can be changed over time too: Disney flushed down the toilet all Star Wars Expanded Universe, Saint Seiya Movie Overture was supposed to be manga continuation, but Kurumada ultimately erased it from canon, and Omega and Soul Of Gold ignored that movie entirely.

[ABED]

There's no such thing as headcanon. Is it that hard to say something like, "In my imagination..."?

Aren't they the same thing ?

They're supposed to be, but its needlessly confusing, especially since so many don't understand what canon is. And lastly, the term lumps two opposing concepts together.

[Robo4900]

Ultimately, I don't think GT's canon status is worth discussing. Right now, Super is still going on, and they still haven't reached the end of Z tournament; we won't truly know if GT is canon until they go after the end of Z, although it is likely they'll do something else, given Xenoverse literally already established the movies and GT as alternate timelines...
Of course, they might end up going past the end of Z, and redoing GT's storylines in a new anime... Which would be a terrible idea in so many ways.

Anyway, I think Toei need to clearly just come out and say "GT and the movies are alternate timelines. We already said this in Xenoverse, but maybe you guys weren't listening. "

[MR.Mark]

In a future episode of Super, GT will be reveled to be a horrible nightmare Goku had after eating expired food out of Beerus's fridge.

Until that happens, that will be my head canon.

[Cipher]

I still feel like it's the proper ending to the similar-but-distinct world that was the original run of the anime.

But it's as canonical as you want it to be.

Just like if it were a loin cloth and carried a sword, it'd be as Conanical as you want it to be.

[ABED]

But it's as canonical as you want it to be. Just like if it were a loin cloth and carried a sword, it'd be as Conanical as you want it to be.

That's not how canon works.

[rereboy]

Canon doesn't need to be explicitly stated. There is a canon for DB. I have NO idea where that idea comes from.

Simply, official canon is not defined by the fans. Without any official word what exactly is canon and what isn't, it's undefined and a guess for the fans.

They're supposed to be, but its needlessly confusing, especially since so many don't understand what canon is. And lastly, the term lumps two opposing concepts together.

People are free to use to use the term if they want to and they might not agree with it being confusing. In thar case, other people disliking it or ignoring what's its meaning is irrelevant.

[sintzu]

Canon doesn't need to be explicitly stated. There is a canon for DB. I have NO idea where that idea comes from.

Simply, official canon is not defined by the fans. Without any official word what exactly is canon and what isn't, it's undefined and a guess for the fans.

It's safe to say that at the very least, the volumes of the manga are unquestionable canon.

[rereboy]

Canon doesn't need to be explicitly stated. There is a canon for DB. I have NO idea where that idea comes from.

Simply, official canon is not defined by the fans. Without any official word what exactly is canon and what isn't, it's undefined and a guess for the fans.

It's safe to say that at the very least, the Kanzenban volumes of the manga are unquestionable canon.

Is it? What if Toriyama said that, in light of what happens in Super, the last chapters of the Kanzenban aren't canon?

In any case, it really doesn't matter how safe we think our guess is regarding what is official canon and what isn't, the point is that it's still a guess. We, as fans, don't define official canon. So, yeah, assuming or guessing that the manga is part of the official canon is a pretty safe bet but it doesn't really matter because once we start discussing things like that we just end up discussing which is the safest guess or assumption, nothing else.

[sintzu]

Is it? What if Toriyama said that, in light of what happens in Super, the last chapters of the Kanzenban aren't canon?

Once we start discussing things like that we just end up discussing which is the safest guess or assumption, nothing else.

We've been told that Super is leading to the manga's ending (weather there are changes made remains to be seen) so as of now, the entire manga is unquestionable canon because all the stories that took place in it are taken into account within every part of the franchise's media (anime, games, etc.).

Is anyone going to argue that a certain part of the manga or a certain arc isn't canon ? I think every DB fan (and everyone involved officially with it) can agree that the manga is the life blood of the franchise.

[rereboy]

We've been told that Super is leading to the manga's ending (weather there are changes made remains to be seen) so as of now, the entire manga is unquestionable canon because all the stories that took place in it are taken into account within every part of the franchise's media (anime, games, etc.).

And all that wouldn't matter at all if tomorrow Toriyama said officially that, in light of what happens in Super, the last chapters of the Kanzenban aren't canon.

What you are saying is "unquestionable canon" is just your best guess regarding what is official canon, which would immediately shatter when contradicted by an official statement like the one I suggested from Toriyama.

Is anyone going to argue that a certain part of the manga or a certain arc isn't canon ? I think every DB fan (and everyone involved officially with it) can agree that the manga is the life blood of the franchise.

Every fan in the world agreeing that the manga should be part of the official canon doesn't change the fact that the fans don't define canon. So, they would all just be agreeing on what a safe bet it is to think that the manga would be part of the official manga.

Look, I also agree that the manga should be part of the official canon and, honestly, that's basically a 100% sure bet. However, the point is that it doesn't stop being a deduction/assumption/guess just because it seems to be a basically 100% sure bet. We, the fans, aren't the ones who actually define the official canon.

[sintzu]

And all that wouldn't matter at all if...

Every fan in the world agreeing that the manga should be part of the official canon...

We're not talking about what ifs, we're talking about the here and now.

It's not about what fans want, as of now, the manga is the only unquestionable canon, the current new material picks up where the last arc in the manga left off and one of the creators said it's leading into the manga's ending.

[ABED]

Is it? What if Toriyama said that, in light of what happens in Super, the last chapters of the Kanzenban aren't canon?

Then the canon changes.

We, the fans, aren't the ones who actually define the official canon.

That sentence is redundant. Canon is official by definition.

[rereboy]

We're not talking about what ifs, we're talking about the here and now.

The here and now is that there's no official source detailing what is canon and what isn't, and only official sources have the power to do that, not the fans.

The "if" is an example to demonstrate how a fan has no power to define it, and even his most safe assumptions or guesses about official canon could be contradicted by the official sources if they wanted to.

It's not about what fans want, as of now, the manga is the only unquestionable canon, the current new material picks up where the last arc in the manga left off and one of the creators said it's leading into the manga's ending.

You, like me, are merely a fan and yet, in this post, you are basically trying to dictate part of what is or should be considered "unquestionable canon" based on what you know and think. You don't have the power to do that, no matter how safe you think your assumption regarding the manga is. And this is not an issue of me even disagreeing with you because I also agree that the manga should be part of the official canon since, honestly, that's basically a 100% sure bet. However, the point is that it doesn't stop being a deduction/assumption/guess just because it seems to be a basically 100% sure bet. We, the fans, aren't the ones who actually define the official canon.

This is the problem with canon discussions in a franchise that hasn't defined its canon... Usually fans start to confuse how sure they are about how something should be (like all the manga being part of the official canon) with the power and ability to actually tell others how it should be. And this also why I don't dwell in these discussion more than enough to point out what I've been pointing out in these last few posts. There's hardly any useful point to discuss about canon besides being aware that we really have no power to define it.