Kai vs. Z Dub

[SaintEvolution]

Nostalgia can make some people blind.

[SaintEvolution]

I mean, how can anyone say that Funimation Z is better?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEncqyKH9M4

Nostalgia is the only answer.

[GreatSaiyaJeff]

I mean, how can anyone say that Funimation Z is better?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEncqyKH9M4

Nostalgia is the only answer.

I partially agree, The Kai dub is better handled and you can tell Sean has come a long way compared to when he did the original scene. However, I do enjoy that original scene as well, I think it's playful. Goku doing a few grunts is kind of amusing.

While I agree that some can be blind to nostolgia, I don't think the original dub (outside of season 3) is bad dub. Playful yes but I like to think of it like the original sailor moon dub. It may not be as loyal to the original but it wasn't afraid to be a little goofy here and there.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

Nostalgia can be a factor. There can also be a tribal aspect to it. However, I do believe that there are some people who genuinely (if uncritically) enjoy thee Funimation casts original performances more. I've definitely softened to it as time has gone on as well, though it's certainly never my first choice.

Either way, to write a product's continued success up to nostalgia is disingenuous. This is 2017, it's been over a decade since Dragon Ball Z was the flagship for English anime. It's obviously done something right, as it continues to draw in more and more new fans after all this time, many of whom are even in the habit of watching anime subtitled, but who make an exception for this particular show.

[Bajosexto]

Nostalgia can be a factor. There can also be a tribal aspect to it. However, I do believe that there are some people who genuinely (if uncritically) enjoy thee Funimation casts original performances more. I've definitely softened to it as time has gone on as well, though it's certainly never my first choice.

Either way, to write a product's continued success up to nostalgia is disingenuous. This is 2017, it's been over a decade since Dragon Ball Z was the flagship for English anime. It's obviously done something right, as it continues to draw in more and more new fans after all this time, many of whom are even in the habit of watching anime subtitled, but who make an exception for this particular show.

Every time I hear, "I watch all my anime subtitled except for Dbz", I think "Really, you watch all your anime subbed except for one show?" I mean, it's one thing to prefer the FUNi dub of Z over the Japanese version, but to say that you watch everything subbed except for one show just doesn't make sense to me. I feel that what these people are really trying to say is that, even they (who are so used to watching anime subtitled) can't enjoy dbz in Japanese because it's so bad.

[XanatosVanBadass]

While I agree that some can be blind to nostolgia, I don't think the original dub (outside of season 3) is bad dub. Playful yes but I like to think of it like the original sailor moon dub. It may not be as loyal to the original but it wasn't afraid to be a little goofy here and there.

The old Sailor Moon dub is generally considered bad. In fact, it's often argued that SM has had FAR worse treatment in the US than Dragon Ball.

Speaking of, it's funny how things change. Little over a decade ago you'd never see anyone online caught dead defending the DBZ dub. The popular consensus was it was an utter embarrassment, yet here we are in the past several years people coming out of the woodwork defending it to the death.

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

While I agree that some can be blind to nostolgia, I don't think the original dub (outside of season 3) is bad dub. Playful yes but I like to think of it like the original sailor moon dub. It may not be as loyal to the original but it wasn't afraid to be a little goofy here and there.

The old Sailor Moon dub is generally considered bad. In fact, it's often argued that SM has had FAR worse treatment in the US than Dragon Ball.

Speaking of, it's funny how things change. Little over a decade ago you'd never see anyone online caught dead defending the DBZ dub. The popular consensus was it was an utter embarrassment, yet here we are in the past several years people coming out of the woodwork defending it to the death.

The majority of the fanbase for the original Z dub are old enough to talk on forums like this, that wasn't the case over a decade ago. Its the same reason the Faulconer score wasn't well regarded during Z's US run but it now has a cult following. It will be interesting to see in years to come when the people who grew up on Kai are that age and talk about their nostalgic memories of watching it on Nicktoons.

[cRookie_Monster]

We are actually into the second decade where I've seen a lot of people who love the dub. I started noticing them back in 2006/2007. 1999/2000 was pretty much pure hate

But going forward more and more people won't even know the Faulconer score existed since it's getting harder and harder to access.

[Scsigs]

We are actually into the second decade where I've seen a lot of people who love the dub. I started noticing them back in 2006/2007. 1999/2000 was pretty much pure hate

But going forward more and more people won't even know the Faulconer score existed since it's getting harder and harder to access.

I wouldn't say it's getting harder & harder to hear it, it's only on Z releases & iTunes. \

Nostalgia can be a factor. There can also be a tribal aspect to it. However, I do believe that there are some people who genuinely (if uncritically) enjoy thee Funimation casts original performances more. I've definitely softened to it as time has gone on as well, though it's certainly never my first choice.

Either way, to write a product's continued success up to nostalgia is disingenuous. This is 2017, it's been over a decade since Dragon Ball Z was the flagship for English anime. It's obviously done something right, as it continues to draw in more and more new fans after all this time, many of whom are even in the habit of watching anime subtitled, but who make an exception for this particular show.

I remember a few weeks ago I got into a full-blown hate-filled (from his side) argument with some dude who's DEFINITELY a nut for the original Z dub, Falconer music & all. It was on my YouTube video talking about the whole TFS debacle. This guy started spewing a TON of vitriol about Kai. How it "didn't have the original music," "doesn't have a good dub," & how it's a bad version of Z, especially compared to the original & its dub. Being the DB fan I am, I had NO idea he was referring to the Falconer score because he didn't point out that it was that score he was referring to & spewed a lot of hate. I tried to tell him about my reasons I love Kai & prefer it & its dub, bu he was having none of it. He wasn't even trying to be civil in his arguing, just spewing hate, not giving any reasons, just saying "it's better" over & over again to the point where I blocked him just so I wouldn't have to deal with him anymore. I've dealt with idiots who think they're tough enough to say I'm wrong for my preferences of pop culture, see the comments sections of my Super Sentai & Power Rangers DVD videos to see a perfect example of that, but not one so persistent, illiterate, short tempered, & just blatantly stupid in all my years of being on the internet. He even brought up a lot points that can easily be chalked up to his nostalgia from watching Z as a kid trying to prove why his opinion is superior, that's how bad he got.

Point of this story is that nostalgia brats definitely exist. I'm willing to bet most people who love Dragon Ball that are my age, or slightly older (20), come from the time when Z was the #1 anime in the country & can't separate nostalgia from judging something without the filter. The Falconer score is separate, but it's the same thing. While I'm not one to knock the quality of the tracks by themselves, I just prefer to watch my dubs with the original Japanese scores, plain & simple & just don't see Z with the score of Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. I also love my dubs to be as well-translated & acted as possible & I just don't get that from Z a majority of the time, which is why I prefer Kai. I won't knock you for liking Z's dub, but it's a long way from perfect. I have the same sort of backlash against Mighty Morphin versus later entries in the Power Rangers series that do everything better in a lot of ways. People just have to understand that others get into franchises through later installments, then go back to the earlier stuff & don't see what the deal is & may even despise what they see & hear to some degree for whatever reason they have. That's all I'll say for now.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

Nostalgia can be a factor. There can also be a tribal aspect to it. However, I do believe that there are some people who genuinely (if uncritically) enjoy thee Funimation casts original performances more. I've definitely softened to it as time has gone on as well, though it's certainly never my first choice.

Either way, to write a product's continued success up to nostalgia is disingenuous. This is 2017, it's been over a decade since Dragon Ball Z was the flagship for English anime. It's obviously done something right, as it continues to draw in more and more new fans after all this time, many of whom are even in the habit of watching anime subtitled, but who make an exception for this particular show.

I remember a few weeks ago I got into a full-blown hate-filled (from his side) argument with some dude who's DEFINITELY a nut for the original Z dub, Falconer music & all. It was on my YouTube video talking about the whole TFS debacle. This guy started spewing a TON of vitriol about Kai. How it "didn't have the original music," "doesn't have a good dub," & how it's a bad version of Z, especially compared to the original & its dub. Being the DB fan I am, I had NO idea he was referring to the Falconer score because he didn't point out that it was that score he was referring to & spewed a lot of hate. I tried to tell him about my reasons I love Kai & prefer it & its dub, bu he was having none of it. He wasn't even trying to be civil in his arguing, just spewing hate, not giving any reasons, just saying "it's better" over & over again to the point where I blocked him just so I wouldn't have to deal with him anymore. I've dealt with idiots who think they're tough enough to say I'm wrong for my preferences of pop culture, see the comments sections of my Super Sentai & Power Rangers DVD videos to see a perfect example of that, but not one so persistent, illiterate, short tempered, & just blatantly stupid in all my years of being on the internet. He even brought up a lot points that can easily be chalked up to his nostalgia from watching Z as a kid trying to prove why his opinion is superior, that's how bad he got.

Point of this story is that nostalgia brats definitely exist. I'm willing to bet most people who love Dragon Ball that are my age, or slightly older (20), come from the time when Z was the #1 anime in the country & can't separate nostalgia from judging something without the filter. The Falconer score is separate, but it's the same thing. While I'm not one to knock the quality of the tracks by themselves, I just prefer to watch my dubs with the original Japanese scores, plain & simple & just don't see Z with the score of Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. I also love my dubs to be as well-translated & acted as possible & I just don't get that from Z a majority of the time, which is why I prefer Kai. I won't knock you for liking Z's dub, but it's a long way from perfect. I have the same sort of backlash against Mighty Morphin versus later entries in the Power Rangers series that do everything better in a lot of ways. People just have to understand that others get into franchises through later installments, then go back to the earlier stuff & don't see what the deal is & may even despise what they see & hear to some degree for whatever reason they have. That's all I'll say for now.

Oh, of course they exist. However, I've noticed that since very popular figures who shall remain unnamed have begun pushing the original version and Kai dub, a new crop of anti-Z dub, anti-Faulconer fans with the same intolerable problems as the dub community have begun sprouting in legions. Not everyone has developed critical thinking skills, whether they be children or adults, it's always worth keeping in mind that they're everywhere.

[Scsigs]

Oh, of course they exist. However, I've noticed that since very popular figures who shall remain unnamed have begun pushing the original version and Kai dub, a new crop of anti-Z dub, anti-Faulconer fans with the same intolerable problems as the dub community have begun sprouting in legions. Not everyone has developed critical thinking skills, whether they be children or adults, it's always worth keeping in mind that they're everywhere.

I see. That's hype &/or fan backlash for ya. It's also why I don't care for Frozen. It's just not that good of a movie in my opinion, but that's a different matter. Backlash can be strong & it's definitely a poison in fandoms.

[Ripper 30]

Oh, of course they exist. However, I've noticed that since very popular figures who shall remain unnamed have begun pushing the original version and Kai dub, a new crop of anti-Z dub, anti-Faulconer fans with the same intolerable problems as the dub community have begun sprouting in legions. Not everyone has developed critical thinking skills, whether they be children or adults, it's always worth keeping in mind that they're everywhere.

I see. That's hype &/or fan backlash for ya. It's also why I don't care for Frozen. It's just not that good of a movie in my opinion, but that's a different matter. Backlash can be strong & it's definitely a poison in fandoms.

There is no point in arguing with those nostalgia Elitists Z Fans, they are just too close minded and ignorant saying that Faulconer music made dbz "Better" or "DBZ is one of the Few animes where the Dub surpasses the sub by a big margin" and all that made up facts and they keep on hating Kai Dub for lack of Faulconer and insulting Collen Clinkenbeard's Gohan voice and telling how Linda Young is the Best Freeza Voice because they grew up listening to it and Also they seem to not Like the New Vegeta Voice from Kai onwards which is actually more refined and less raspy than Z one but the Dub Fanbase of Z is hopeless specially on Facebook or YouTube Comments it's as if the Kai Dub,Manga and Japanese Version is non existent for them

[cRookie_Monster]

We are actually into the second decade where I've seen a lot of people who love the dub. I started noticing them back in 2006/2007. 1999/2000 was pretty much pure hate

But going forward more and more people won't even know the Faulconer score existed since it's getting harder and harder to access.

I wouldn't say it's getting harder & harder to hear it, it's only on Z releases & iTunes. \

Sorry, I should have clarified. There are no versions in stores with the Faulconer score anymore and it isn't available from the Funimation site. You have to order specially order old version of the web to hear it. Someone who has no idea wouldn't stumble on it like they used to.

I wanted to watch some episodes the Faulconer score a few weeks ago and I had to resort to pirated versions on the internet because my Funimation subscription was useless and I couldn't find anything in stores. I was going to have to wait for specially ordered DVDs to come in otherwise.

[Deathbringer]

The worst thing is whenever I see people listing the old DBZ dub as an example of one of the best English anime dubs of all time alongside shows that actually have good dubs like Cowboy Bebop, Death Note or Baccano, especially Cowboy Bebop because that show aired in English around the same time that DBZ was airing and it was in a complete different league of quality and accuracy, proving that the DBZ dub isn't even that much of an endearing "product of its time" it's just bad acting.

Actually no, the worst thing is whenever I see people saying they only ever watch anime in Japanese except for DBZ which is just so confusing to me, because these people clearly don't care about or may even have a dislike of English anime dubs but for some reason they enjoy watching a dub that has most of the problems that an English anime dub can have.

Having said all that I still think the English voices have a lot of good things to write home about, but these qualities didn't become fully apparent until the dub of DBK, fans of the DBZ dub should be celebrating Kai because of how it shows that (most of) the English dub cast from DBZ are good actors that understand the characters they're playing.

[8000 Saiyan]

The worst thing is whenever I see people listing the old DBZ dub as an example of one of the best English anime dubs of all time alongside shows that actually have good dubs like Cowboy Bebop, Death Note or Baccano, especially Cowboy Bebop because that show aired in English around the same time that DBZ was airing and it was in a complete different league of quality and accuracy, proving that the DBZ dub isn't even that much of an endearing "product of its time" it's just bad acting.

Actually no, the worst thing is whenever I see people saying they only ever watch anime in Japanese except for DBZ which is just so confusing to me, because these people clearly don't care about or may even have a dislike of English anime dubs but for some reason they enjoy watching a dub that has most of the problems that an English anime dub can have.

Having said all that I still think the English voices have a lot of good things to write home about, but these qualities didn't become fully apparent until the dub of DBK, fans of the DBZ dub should be celebrating Kai because of how it shows that (most of) the English dub cast from DBZ are good actors that understand the characters they're playing.

The people that hate the Japanese version of Dragon Ball Z dislike it because of these reasons: They think Masako Nozawa is unfitting for adult Goku, they think the Kikuchi score is good for DB, but not for DBZ, or they simply are too used to the Funimation dub.

If Nozawa had been replaced with a male voice actor like Kappei Yamaguchi or Nobuyuki Hiyama for adult Goku, I'm sure that there wouldn't have been any complaints about Goku's Japanese voice sounding odd. I'm probably one of the few people here on Kanzenshuu who never had a problem with Nozawa voicing adult Goku or even Bardock and Turles. It's not really necessary for Nozawa to play those two I mentioned, but those two performances show how great of an actress she is.

[Ripper 30]

The worst thing is whenever I see people listing the old DBZ dub as an example of one of the best English anime dubs of all time alongside shows that actually have good dubs like Cowboy Bebop, Death Note or Baccano, especially Cowboy Bebop because that show aired in English around the same time that DBZ was airing and it was in a complete different league of quality and accuracy, proving that the DBZ dub isn't even that much of an endearing "product of its time" it's just bad acting.

Actually no, the worst thing is whenever I see people saying they only ever watch anime in Japanese except for DBZ which is just so confusing to me, because these people clearly don't care about or may even have a dislike of English anime dubs but for some reason they enjoy watching a dub that has most of the problems that an English anime dub can have.

Having said all that I still think the English voices have a lot of good things to write home about, but these qualities didn't become fully apparent until the dub of DBK, fans of the DBZ dub should be celebrating Kai because of how it shows that (most of) the English dub cast from DBZ are good actors that understand the characters they're playing.

The people that hate the Japanese version of Dragon Ball Z dislike it because of these reasons: They think Masako Nozawa is unfitting for adult Goku, they think the Kikuchi score is good for DB, but not for DBZ, or they simply are too used to the Funimation dub.

If Nozawa had been replaced with a male voice actor like Kappei Yamaguchi or Nobuyuki Hiyama for adult Goku, I'm sure that there wouldn't have been any complaints about Goku's Japanese voice sounding odd. I'm probably one of the few people here on Kanzenshuu who never had a problem with Nozawa voicing adult Goku or even Bardock and Turles. It's not really necessary for Nozawa to play those two I mentioned, but those two performances show how great of an actress she is.

I am also one of those Few People here on Kanzenshuu who didn't really Mind her Role for Bardock and Turles infact I liked both the Performance and again,like you said Its not that someone else could not have voiced them but Nozawa did a good job on those two and I think when the dub fans actually watch from Original Dragon Ball to Z in Japanese then they get used to Nozawa's Voice for Teen/Adult Goku as well and the only excuse these Dub fans give for not Watching Subbed Version is that,"Everyone in Subs of DBZ Sound high pitched and like little Girl's" when that's not even the case infact it's the FUNimation Dub where characters like Fat Boo and Android 19 Have a Squeaky Baby voice also Kaiō in Dub sounds like his mouth is stuffed and has a very lispy way of Speaking and in my opinion it totally ruins the Sage Nature of him as he does have some serious moments but with the Kind of Voice Sean Gives its impossible to take him seriously though I like Kaiō Voice in Big Green Dub and Bang Zoom Dub but JPN voice is my Favorite specially in Z and GT when Jōji Yanami was in his Prime not now though I don't mind the new Recast in Super so I think the most Z Dub fans Who think Dub is Better have Double Standards and are hypocrite most of the time or simply nostalgia blinded ,I even Saw comments about how they found the subbed Version Of DBZ as Bad as Big Green Dub and they were liteally comparing Subs with That Dub and speaking as if FUNimation Dub is the Ultimate Gift of God and made it "BETTER"

[Kokonoe]

I mean, how can anyone say that Funimation Z is better? Nostalgia is the only answer.

Continue to undermine others opinions and do whatever you can to reassure yourself you are 'correct' here. While you do that, I'll keep watching the dub I think is the better variant and not make excuses for why someone might like a different variant more than myself.

[thaman91]

Sorry, I should have clarified. There are no versions in stores with the Faulconer score anymore and it isn't available from the Funimation site. You have to order specially order old version of the web to hear it. Someone who has no idea wouldn't stumble on it like they used to.

I wanted to watch some episodes the Faulconer score a few weeks ago and I had to resort to pirated versions on the internet because my Funimation subscription was useless and I couldn't find anything in stores. I was going to have to wait for specially ordered DVDs to come in otherwise.

Both the Season Blu-rays and Orange Brick DVDs contain the Faulconer score. Although, the versions on those seem to have possibly come from a pre-final cut because some of the music placements (and even dialogue) is different to how you guys originally mixed it on the original DVDs.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

There are no versions in stores with the Faulconer score anymore...

That's not true. The Orange Bricks and Season Blu-rays both have the American replacement score, and you can find them in stores all over the place.

[cRookie_Monster]

The orange bricks aren't in stores anymore. I used to be able to find them. No longer.

The Blu Rays do not have Faulconer. At least the ones I could find didn't have it. I drove all over town looking for something that had it. They aren't easy to find or I would have bought some.