Would the "Ginyu Force at King Kai's planet" filler make sense if...

[dragonball0900]

...it took place during the ending of Tien, Yamcha and Chiaotzu's training 130 days after, instead of the during the Frieza arc? We know that filler didn't make sense in the original series because only 6 days passed. But what if we imagine that this scene took place before they were revived, or at least before Yamcha was revived since he was revived first. Obviously we would have to ignore Tien being divived by two and still being able to fight Burter and Jeice with that, but it could also be interpreted as that being Tien's power after his whole 260 days of training were completed, and it won't contradict anything since they can still be weaker than Krillin (specially since his strenght was increasing, and probably increased more than 75,000 between the time he was revived and the time Tien and Chiaotzu's revived). They also promised to train harder than Goku, and we also know the big gains they made in just one year of training with Kami back in the Saiyan arc, and those gains were bigger than Goku's, who trained for a much longer time. Who says that they can't also make bigger boosts than Goku with King Kai's training?

Thoughts about that?

[LightBing]

Taking into account Piccolo's ridiculous gains in that time-frame, the filler is actually faithful to the manga.

[DanielSSJ]

I don't necessarily have a problem with the dead earthlings beating up the dead Ginyus, but the fight couldn't take place at all. Keeping your body after you die is supposed to be a special reward for the super heroic. Bad guys like the Ginyu Force would just be little soul wisps, incapable of fighting. This would also render the "bad guys running amok in hell" part of the Other World Tournament filler impossible, too.

[Gray Riders]

...it took place during the ending of Tien, Yamcha and Chiaotzu's training 130 days after, instead of the during the Frieza arc? We know that filler didn't make sense in the original series because only 6 days passed. But what if we imagine that this scene took place before they were revived, or at least before Yamcha was revived since he was revived first. Obviously we would have to ignore Tien being divived by two and still being able to fight Burter and Jeice with that, but it could also be interpreted as that being Tien's power after his whole 260 days of training were completed, and it won't contradict anything since they can still be weaker than Krillin (specially since his strenght was increasing, and probably increased more than 75,000 between the time he was revived and the time Tien and Chiaotzu's revived). They also promised to train harder than Goku, and we also know the big gains they made in just one year of training with Kami back in the Saiyan arc, and those gains were bigger than Goku's, who trained for a much longer time. Who says that they can't also make bigger boosts than Goku with King Kai's training?

Thoughts about that?

I'd agree that them becoming strong enough to beat the Ginyu after 130 days would have felt more believable. Goku got about 20 times stronger and I think he was there for a comparable amount of time. The earthlings have sparring partners. Not learning Kaioken or Genki-dama might mean more time doing power training, too. I'd find them getting, say, 30X stronger in that time plausible from what we've already seen, and that would be enough of an increase to beat the Ginyu quartet (the split form part seems less so).

[Gaffer Tape]

I don't necessarily have a problem with the dead earthlings beating up the dead Ginyus, but the fight couldn't take place at all. Keeping your body after you die is supposed to be a special reward for the super heroic. Bad guys like the Ginyu Force would just be little soul wisps, incapable of fighting. This would also render the "bad guys running amok in hell" part of the Other World Tournament filler impossible, too.

But didn't Kaio say he requested Enma to send them to his world? So I can see it working in that case.

[precita]

I don't necessarily have a problem with the dead earthlings beating up the dead Ginyus, but the fight couldn't take place at all. Keeping your body after you die is supposed to be a special reward for the super heroic. Bad guys like the Ginyu Force would just be little soul wisps, incapable of fighting. This would also render the "bad guys running amok in hell" part of the Other World Tournament filler impossible, too.

King Kai said he requested them to come to his planet to help train Yamcha/Tenshihan/Chiaotzu. Otherwise they would have been sent directly to Hell.

[Gaffer Tape]

I think the only continuity snafu is a filler scene where Gohan flies past the Ginyu battlefield and spies their corpses. If they were given their bodies in the afterlife, they shouldn't still be on Namek.

[precita]

I think the only continuity snafu is a filler scene where Gohan flies past the Ginyu battlefield and spies their corpses. If they were given their bodies in the afterlife, they shouldn't still be on Namek.

Hm, I don't think so, Yamcha and Tenshihan's bodies were still on Earth when they died yet they were still in the afterlife. Chaiotzu was the only one who has his body completely destroyed when he blew himself up.

[DanielSSJ]

Hm, I don't think so, Yamcha and Tenshihan's bodies were still on Earth when they died yet they were still in the afterlife. Chaiotzu was the only one who has his body completely destroyed when he blew himself up.

Kami-sama was dead too, so maybe it took a while for them to get their bodies from Earth.

[precita]

Either way, I do like to think Yamcha reached Recoome level of power eventually. Tenshihan fighting off both Burter/Jeice at the same time would mean he was as strong as Goku was when he landed on Namek, which is a bit hard to swallow. But you have to remember they didn't beat them "fully" either, they just knocked them off King Kai's planet and they were unable to bypass the clouds from Hell to get back up there. So if they fought to the end, then the good guys may not have won.

[Gaffer Tape]

I think the only continuity snafu is a filler scene where Gohan flies past the Ginyu battlefield and spies their corpses. If they were given their bodies in the afterlife, they shouldn't still be on Namek.

Hm, I don't think so, Yamcha and Tenshihan's bodies were still on Earth when they died yet they were still in the afterlife. Chaiotzu was the only one who has his body completely destroyed when he blew himself up.

Yeah, and Chaozu was the only one whose presence Goku questioned precisely BECAUSE his body blew up. As in, he would have needed his body to train with Kaio. So clearly at some point, Yamucha, Tenshinhan, and Piccolo's bodies were returned to them. And that rule was already established when Goku's body followed him to the afterlife.

[Dragon Sponge]

I think the only continuity snafu is a filler scene where Gohan flies past the Ginyu battlefield and spies their corpses. If they were given their bodies in the afterlife, they shouldn't still be on Namek.

Maybe it could be possible that the bodies they have in the Afterlife, aren´t their real ones, instead that could be magical replacement bodies they got from Enma Daio, which look and work just like the real ones but are just half as strong as them. For example i consider the base Power Levels of those 4 Ginyus to be:

* Jeese: 55000

* Barta: 50000

* Recoome: 45000

* Guldo: 10000

So if we devide this by 2 we get:

* Jeese: 27500

* Barta: 25000

* Recomme: 22500

* Guldo: 5000

So with their Power Levels being halved we don´t have to assume anymore that the Humans got too massivly stronger on just 6 days. Let say Tenshinhans Power rose to 35000, Yamchas got to 22000 and Chiaotzus reached 5500 (and Piccolos got to 50000 without weights). So if we say they got atleast this strong on Kaios Planet in 6 Days, than it should be pretty believable that they defeated the weakened ghostbody Ginyus. Stuff like the two devided Tenshinhans (which would have a Power of 17500 each) being able to fight Jeese and Barta could be explained by incorparating the Fantheory/Headcanon that Piccolo and the Humans learned the Kaioken on Kaios Planet and mastered it later to the point that they could use it without an Red Aura. For example: before Tenshinhan beat Jeese and Barta, he did power up with an white Aura, and when Son Goku was destroying stones on Kaios Planet back when he was there, he also had an white Aura. Now let say this white Aura is an pre version of the Kaioken that is below the multiplier of 2x, let say its an 1,5x increase (which would increase Tens Power to 52500). This underlevel of the Kaioken would be less straining on the Body and be perfect in training the technique in the beginning. Yes I know Tenshinhan has no Aura at all when he splits and fights Jeese and Barta afterward, but let say he uses there an even lower level of the Pre-Kaioken which dosen´t have any Aura. A Pre-Kaioken of 1,3x (PL: 22750) or 1,4x (PL: 24500) should boost the two Tenshinhans enough to fight evenly with Jeese and Barta.

[dragonball0900]

Taking into account Piccolo's ridiculous gains in that time-frame, the filler is actually faithful to the manga.

Yeah, but we don't really know how much Piccolo improved. All we know is that he is stronger than someone that is supposedly "stronger than Vegeta". And even if Piccolo did make good gains and is stronger than Nail, it would also make the humans stronger like Piccolo too, and probably surpassing Krillin in strenght in the other 130 days they stayed in (260 days in Tien and Chiaotzu's case).

Either way, I do like to think Yamcha reached Recoome level of power eventually. Tenshihan fighting off both Burter/Jeice at the same time would mean he was as strong as Goku was when he landed on Namek, which is a bit hard to swallow. But you have to remember they didn't beat them "fully" either, they just knocked them off King Kai's planet and they were unable to bypass the clouds from Hell to get back up there. So if they fought to the end, then the good guys may not have won.

Yeah, that would make some sense. Although I always saw that scene as Tien being indeed able to defeat them, though again it could be interpreted in another way, as you said.

I think the only continuity snafu is a filler scene where Gohan flies past the Ginyu battlefield and spies their corpses. If they were given their bodies in the afterlife, they shouldn't still be on Namek.

Maybe it could be possible that the bodies they have in the Afterlife, aren´t their real ones, instead that could be magical replacement bodies they got from Enma Daio, which look and work just like the real ones but are just half as strong as them. For example i consider the base Power Levels of those 4 Ginyus to be:

* Jeese: 55000

* Barta: 50000

* Recoome: 45000

* Guldo: 10000

So if we devide this by 2 we get:

* Jeese: 27500

* Barta: 25000

* Recomme: 22500

* Guldo: 5000

So with their Power Levels being halved we don´t have to assume anymore that the Humans got too massivly stronger on just 6 days. Let say Tenshinhans Power rose to 35000, Yamchas got to 22000 and Chiaotzus reached 5500 (and Piccolos got to 50000 without weights). So if we say they got atleast this strong on Kaios Planet in 6 Days, than it should be pretty believable that they defeated the weakened ghostbody Ginyus. Stuff like the two devided Tenshinhans (which would have a Power of 17500 each) being able to fight Jeese and Barta could be explained by incorparating the Fantheory/Headcanon that Piccolo and the Humans learned the Kaioken on Kaios Planet and mastered it later to the point that they could use it without an Red Aura. For example: before Tenshinhan beat Jeese and Barta, he did power up with an white Aura, and when Son Goku was destroying stones on Kaios Planet back when he was there, he also had an white Aura. Now let say this white Aura is an pre version of the Kaioken that is below the multiplier of 2x, let say its an 1,5x increase (which would increase Tens Power to 52500). This underlevel of the Kaioken would be less straining on the Body and be perfect in training the technique in the beginning. Yes I know Tenshinhan has no Aura at all when he splits and fights Jeese and Barta afterward, but let say he uses there an even lower level of the Pre-Kaioken which dosen´t have any Aura. A Pre-Kaioken of 1,3x (PL: 22750) or 1,4x (PL: 24500) should boost the two Tenshinhans enough to fight evenly with Jeese and Barta.

The thing is, I don't think it was ever stated it was that way, no implication that the Ginyu Force got their powers divided.

[Dragon Sponge]

I think the only continuity snafu is a filler scene where Gohan flies past the Ginyu battlefield and spies their corpses. If they were given their bodies in the afterlife, they shouldn't still be on Namek.

Maybe it could be possible that the bodies they have in the Afterlife, aren´t their real ones, instead that could be magical replacement bodies they got from Enma Daio, which look and work just like the real ones but are just half as strong as them. For example i consider the base Power Levels of those 4 Ginyus to be:

* Jeese: 55000

* Barta: 50000

* Recoome: 45000

* Guldo: 10000

So if we devide this by 2 we get:

* Jeese: 27500

* Barta: 25000

* Recomme: 22500

* Guldo: 5000

So with their Power Levels being halved we don´t have to assume anymore that the Humans got too massivly stronger on just 6 days. Let say Tenshinhans Power rose to 35000, Yamchas got to 22000 and Chiaotzus reached 5500 (and Piccolos got to 50000 without weights). So if we say they got atleast this strong on Kaios Planet in 6 Days, than it should be pretty believable that they defeated the weakened ghostbody Ginyus. Stuff like the two devided Tenshinhans (which would have a Power of 17500 each) being able to fight Jeese and Barta could be explained by incorparating the Fantheory/Headcanon that Piccolo and the Humans learned the Kaioken on Kaios Planet and mastered it later to the point that they could use it without an Red Aura. For example: before Tenshinhan beat Jeese and Barta, he did power up with an white Aura, and when Son Goku was destroying stones on Kaios Planet back when he was there, he also had an white Aura. Now let say this white Aura is an pre version of the Kaioken that is below the multiplier of 2x, let say its an 1,5x increase (which would increase Tens Power to 52500). This underlevel of the Kaioken would be less straining on the Body and be perfect in training the technique in the beginning. Yes I know Tenshinhan has no Aura at all when he splits and fights Jeese and Barta afterward, but let say he uses there an even lower level of the Pre-Kaioken which dosen´t have any Aura. A Pre-Kaioken of 1,3x (PL: 22750) or 1,4x (PL: 24500) should boost the two Tenshinhans enough to fight evenly with Jeese and Barta.

The thing is, I don't think it was ever stated it was that way, no implication that the Ginyu Force got their powers divided.

Thats right, my idea is just a "WMG" that would fit pretty well on Tv Tropes, but i still think that it would make a good explaination for how the Humans could beat the Ginyu Force. There is also nothing really that speaks against it, so for all what we know, it could be possible.