Skill and Intelligence in Dragonball is highly overrated

[Lord Beerus]

I think people who are able build time machine, robots stronger than Super Saiyans, fully re-purpose an alien spaceship and create a flying drone with literally scraps of metal would come across as more than bright by our world standards.

[TheMikado]

Examples of skill / intelligence in Dragonball
Piccolo vs Goku piccolo takes control of the fight by using Tien as a human shield essentially takes control of the fight by crippling Goku
Piccolo vs Goku Goku allows piccolo to grow enough to dive down his throat and retrieve kami
Radditz vs Goku Goku grabs radditz tail twice
Sneaks up with full Nelson ends fight
Goku vs frieza Goku gets sent under water and charges up two powerful blasts to distract frieza long enough to nail frieza with a powerful kick
Goku vs cell warp Kamehameha
Gohan vs cell Vegeta delivers a blast that distracts cell long enough for Gohan to finish things
Buu saga Buu absorbs everyone basically and transforms vegito into candy

None of that is particularity clever nor signs of higher IQ.

Red Ribbon Army
Bulma
Dr. Gero
Dr. Myuu
Several of the Movie Villian Scientists.
Frieza Army Scientists
Trunks
Gohan
etc.
etc.

Remember in Trunks apocalyptic future a really smart guy killed all the Saiyans and most of the earth with his scientific creations.
Then a really smart lady named Bulma came up with a pretty bright idea to build a time machine that fits in a capsule so that she could send her pretty bright son to the past for help.
But than that original really smart scientist also created a pretty smart creation that killed Trunks, stole his time machine, and had the good sense to hide out until it could properly become perfect through absorbing
those really smart androids made by that really smart guy.

Pretty much the entire Future Trunks arc came about because a couple of really smart people came up with varying plans and executed them. The fighters were just the pawns not the brains of the operations.

[Kaiza_Toshiyuki]

Examples of skill / intelligence in Dragonball
Piccolo vs Goku piccolo takes control of the fight by using Tien as a human shield essentially takes control of the fight by crippling Goku
Piccolo vs Goku Goku allows piccolo to grow enough to dive down his throat and retrieve kami
Radditz vs Goku Goku grabs radditz tail twice
Sneaks up with full Nelson ends fight
Goku vs frieza Goku gets sent under water and charges up two powerful blasts to distract frieza long enough to nail frieza with a powerful kick
Goku vs cell warp Kamehameha
Gohan vs cell Vegeta delivers a blast that distracts cell long enough for Gohan to finish things
Buu saga Buu absorbs everyone basically and transforms vegito into candy

None of that is particularity clever nor signs of higher IQ.

Red Ribbon Army
Bulma
Dr. Gero
Dr. Myuu
Several of the Movie Villian Scientists.
Frieza Army Scientists
Trunks
Gohan
etc.
etc.

Remember in Trunks apocalyptic future a really smart guy killed all the Saiyans and most of the earth with his scientific creations.
Then a really smart lady named Bulma came up with a pretty bright idea to build a time machine that fits in a capsule so that she could send her pretty bright son to the past for help.
But than that original really smart scientist also created a pretty smart creation that killed Trunks, stole his time machine, and had the good sense to hide out until it could properly become perfect through absorbing
those really smart androids made by that really smart guy.

Pretty much the entire Future Trunks arc came about because a couple of really smart people came up with varying plans and executed them. The fighters were just the pawns not the brains of the operations.

Your logic is sound. I don´t get how people see these guys as not smart or even clever.

[Kataphrut]

Characters like Bulma, Dr Gero etc are "comic book scientist" smart, but in terms of combat, there's not a lot to it. Characters like Piccolo, Krillin, Tien, etc are considered the "smart" fighters because they have gimmicky techniques, but even then most of those techniques just come down to finding different ways to shoot energy blasts. Outside of characters like Buu and some of the more gimmicky tournament fighters, most Dragon Ball characters are all on the same skill tree with little room for variation. You don't get the same variety of powers and creative potential that comes with it from other shounen.

The one rule the series is actually good at when it comes to battle smarts is that Goku is a really strategic fighter despite being an idiot outside of that. I think that's just because he's the protagonist, he's allowed to be more dynamic in fights.

[Hulk10]

Characters like Bulma, Dr Gero etc are "comic book scientist" smart, but in terms of combat, there's not a lot to it. Characters like Piccolo, Krillin, Tien, etc are considered the "smart" fighters because they have gimmicky techniques, but even then most of those techniques just come down to finding different ways to shoot energy blasts. Outside of characters like Buu and some of the more gimmicky tournament fighters, most Dragon Ball characters are all on the same skill tree with little room for variation. You don't get the same variety of powers and creative potential that comes with it from other shounen.

The one rule the series is actually good at when it comes to battle smarts is that Goku is a really strategic fighter despite being an idiot outside of that. I think that's just because he's the protagonist, he's allowed to be more dynamic in fights.

I'd actually say that many of the fighters in the show are strategic fighters.

[RandomGuy96]

Probably the biggest case of intelligence and skill mattering was the blundering of Freeza's goon on Namek. Observe how Dodoria the cocky, careless, fatass is totally unable to leverage his overwhelming power to accomplish his goals, whether that be obtaining information, protecting his scouter, catching two runts, or putting up any kind of fight against the slightly stronger Vegeta. Contrast Vegeta repeatedly outwitting Freeza, sneaking around to ambush or steal, destroying two warriors nearly on par with him (and who together, per Freeza, would have been able to beat him no problem), defeating a guy implied to be slightly stronger than him, and putting up good fights against both Recoome and Zarbon despite being severely outmatched.

[Hulk10]

Probably the biggest case of intelligence and skill mattering was the blundering of Freeza's goon on Namek. Observe how Dodoria the cocky, careless, fatass is totally unable to leverage his overwhelming power to accomplish his goals, whether that be obtaining information, protecting his scouter, catching two runts, or putting up any kind of fight against the slightly stronger Vegeta. Contrast Vegeta repeatedly outwitting Freeza, sneaking around to ambush or steal, destroying two warriors nearly on par with him (and who together, per Freeza, would have been able to beat him no problem), defeating a guy implied to be slightly stronger than him, and putting up good fights against both Recoome and Zarbon despite being severely outmatched.

Oh yeah your right. I'd forgotten about that case. But yeah your right. Dodoria was an idiot and Vegeta used his intelligence to great effect.

[ruler9871]

This is pretty much true. A lot of people tend to over-exaggerate to importance of skill & strategy in DB (especially Early DB), when in reality literally every single major battle in the franchise was determined by raw power & willpower in one form or another.

[Tsufuru]

you are not smart for not understanding it.

obviously some1 way more powerfull , power is gonna decide who wins in the end of the day.
thats how the show was made and still doing.
base goku hitting Hit is a signe of battle smart.
what you mean is goku saying fuck it and going ssb kaioken to straight up ignore time skip.

[ruler9871]

you are not smart for not understanding it.

obviously some1 way more powerfull , power is gonna decide who wins in the end of the day.
thats how the show was made and still doing.
base goku hitting Hit is a signe of battle smart.
what you mean is goku saying fuck it and going ssb kaioken to straight up ignore time skip.

You are actually proving the thread's main point.

[Hugo Boss]

Indeed, Roshi defeated Goku, Hit defeated Vegeta, Goku defeated Kafla, all because of overwhelming power. Goku nearly defeated Jiren because of power too. Piccolo also has been taught Gohan to always have confidence in his power, that it will do everything for him.

[ruler9871]

Indeed, Roshi defeated Goku, Hit defeated Vegeta, Goku defeated Kafla, all because of overwhelming power. Goku nearly defeated Jiren because of power too. Piccolo also has been taught Gohan to always have confidence in his power, that it will do everything for him.

1. Roshi and Goku were evenly strong & matched in the 21st TB. Roshi only won (after all of his techniques and strategies failed) due to having longer limbs in their last clash.

2. Hit beat Vegeta because he had no idea about Hit's Timeskip abilities (this wouldn't happen again in a rematch between the 2). The same thing would have happened to Goku if he fought 1st instead of Vegeta.

3. 2nd Omen Goku beat SSJ2 Kefla purely do to having better speed. "Skill" had nothing to do with it.

4. When the hell did Goku nearly defeat Jiren without UI?

5. Piccolo & Goku did mainly teach Gohan to always have confidence in his power. Little-to-nothing about "skill".

[Hugo Boss]

Alright, I guess they were lucky then. And Piccolo is a bad teacher too. He proved a false point to Gohan after blasting him from his blind spot.

Goku beat SSJ2 Kefla purely do to having better speed. "Skill" had nothing to do with it.

Better “reaction”. The skill has a name. Ultra Instinct.

[ruler9871]

Alright, I guess they were lucky then. And Piccolo is a bad teacher too. He proved a false point to Gohan after blasting him from his blind spot.

Goku beat SSJ2 Kefla purely do to having better speed. "Skill" had nothing to do with it.

Better “reaction”. The skill has a name. Ultra Instinct.

Reaction speed is a thing bro. It has nothing to do with how "skilled" or smart you are. Many wild animals have better reactions than humans do for example.

[Hugo Boss]

Reaction speed is a thing bro. It has nothing to do with how "skilled" or smart you are. Many wild animals have better reactions than humans do for example.

That probably makes them more powerful than humans, I suppose.

[ruler9871]

Reaction speed is a thing bro. It has nothing to do with how "skilled" or smart you are. Many wild animals have better reactions than humans do for example.

That probably makes them more powerful than humans, I suppose.

Who said anything about power?

[MainJPW]

Sad thing is that I do believe there is potential with the techniques of the show. We just never see any of it get taken past a rudimentary standard of utilisation. Take Piccolo's magical abilities. I think in the Daizenshuu it's described as an ability that enables the person to create any physical substance they can imagine. Do you know the kind of potential such a power would have if used properly? Weapons creation (obviously but it shouldn't be limited to just swords or spears), biologics, particle manipulation, bodily reconstruction (could remove a lot of the need for sensu), physics exploitation, ect. Any character that such a technique like that would be one of the most dangerous in the series, provided their creativity and intelligence was up to par for using it properly. If you want to go for just standard fisticuffs and power then use this magic to do something that enhances your physical stats. For example, strengthen the bonds and arrangement of your body's carbonic atoms to increase the hardness of your body to the point that it surpasses katchin (manga). Build up your reflexes by increasing myelin in your nervous system (think that's how it's done). Right there you have a way for increasing your strength in terms that exist outside of basic ki supplementation.

Come to think of it, Piccolo easily could have used that ability to create a container and a demon sealing O-fuda so that he can use the Mafuba on enemies.

We've seen that it works near instantly:



So instead of relying on basic energy attacks and fisticuffs in the harder fights, he could have saved everyone the trouble by materializing the gear needed for the Mafuba. Some of his plans should have included it at least as a backup.

[mfwlegend3]

you are not smart for not understanding it.

obviously some1 way more powerfull , power is gonna decide who wins in the end of the day.
thats how the show was made and still doing.
base goku hitting Hit is a signe of battle smart.
what you mean is goku saying fuck it and going ssb kaioken to straight up ignore time skip.

You are actually proving the thread's main point.

You may as well say “you’re proving MY main point.”

[Melee_Sovereign]

In terms of combat, Whis is pretty damn smart.