But seriously, how did the Falcouner soundtrack even make it to air?

[ABED]

I keep forgetting that not everyone was there when DB first aired on Toonami back in the late 90's. DBZ was definitely already popular before season 3. Hell, it's why we got season 3. The idea that the music had to be changed to THAT in order for DBZ to become popular is not merely asinine, it's historically untrue.

[Bullza]

If anything, it's the Faulconer score that's dreary.

Nah the Japanese music is boring to tears. Not only does it all sound mostly the same from track to track but I keep hearing the same few tracks over and over and over again.

It makes the show a bit of a snoozefest actually. Replacing the music was the best thing they ever did to it. Same with Kai.

[SylentEcho]

It was needed at the time, because Funi's target audience was a lot younger than the ages most people/kids become Dragon Ball fans. Thus, fast trance-like fighting music was preferred to have been constantly playing in the background, instead of the more dramatic Kikuchi score, which needed one to be a little older and have developed an ear for better music than that.

Where did this idea come from that kids are not only stupid but have zero taste? You don't need to be older to appreciate good music or recognize bad music.

Someone from Funi mentioned before, that they needed to add extra dialogue and fast-paced music, in order for kids to stay entertained throughout. What they were implying, was that, kids had short attention spans and wouldn't be as hooked onto the show, if it didn't have music constantly playing.

What constitutes proper song structure?

Sorry, not song structure, I actually meant good musicianship.

[ABED]

I was more referring how its all low and ominous much of the time. That's on top of being lifeless and unmemorable.

Nah the Japanese music is boring to tears. Not only does it all sound mostly the same from track to track but I keep hearing the same few tracks over and over and over again.

It makes the show a bit of a snoozefest actually. Replacing the music was the best thing they ever did to it. Same with Kai.

That's pure hyperbole. The tracks are all distinct and memorable. Yeah, they play over and over, but the score changes over time. It also has the benefits of fitting the show and not sounding cheap.

Someone from Funi mentioned before, that they needed to add extra dialogue and fast-paced music, in order for kids to stay entertained throughout. What they were implying, was that, kids had short attention spans and wouldn't be as hooked onto the show, if it didn't have music constantly playing.

I find that to be pure BS. Just like adults, kids love a story that pulls them in. They don't need something playing for every single second.

[SylentEcho]

I find that to be pure BS. Just like adults, kids love a story that pulls them in. They don't need something playing for every single second.

True. When I was a kid, some of my favourite OST music was from movies like Ben-Hur and others from that era. I also loved watching Mightor, Space Ghost and other stuff from The Power Zone and none of those had techno music constantly playing in the background.

I keep forgetting that not everyone was there when DB first aired on Toonami back in the late 90's. DBZ was definitely already popular before season 3. Hell, it's why we got season 3. The idea that the music had to be changed to THAT in order for DBZ to become popular is not merely asinine, it's historically untrue.

I've noticed that quite a few people think like this. People who grew up in the mid 2000s or after seem to think that the Fualconer score put DBZ on the map or something.

It was actually the Ocean dub, but mainly that amazing Goku vs. Vegeta fight and the mad hunt for the Dragon Balls on Namek, that made DBZ such a huge hit worldwide. People couldn't wait for the episodes to stop looping at episode 53 and finally get a new one. I remember everyone in school was so excited, that they'd even watch every single rerun hoping to find some clue about episode 54 and if it was going to air.

[VegettoEX]

In May 1999, when I received those "Captain Ginyu" VHS tapes in the mail, I legitimately thought FUNimation was going to be laughed out of Cartoon Network headquarters when they delivered that material as the intended product to air on Toonami that fall. I wrote this on my website.

The music was a huge part of that analysis.

I know the orange bricks have blinded people in the years since, and I know that redubs of certain lines throughout "season three" have clouded some memories, and I know there was the later hiring of other musicians to add to said replacement score, and the later incorporation of approximately seventy-three additional replacement scores have further clouded some memories...

But pop "Captain Ginyu - Assault" back in if you still have it.

[TheBigBoy]

Faulconer score is proper shite, mate

[Bardo117]

I think there might be a severe disconnection between us fans and how we grew up watching the show....


I believe this forum is divided into two groups. Those who were older than 17 when DB first aired, and those of us who were less than 10 years old when it aired. Unfortunately, being a children's show, it was tailored to us 10 year olds. You older folk were much more critical of the show because you were at an age were you noticed details that us kids did not, while we absolutely ate it up. We loved the show. And now, looking back on it, us fans who were so young when the show first came around remember everything very fondly(nostalgia?)


There is a lot of separation between those who were kids, and those who first watched the show as an adult. I've noticed the older crowd is much more critical of the FUNImation Dub....

[ABED]

We're adults now, but most of weren't then. I was 13 when I first saw the Captain Ginyu tapes and even then I thought it was awful. Even when I was younger, perhaps my tastes weren't as develped or discerning, but I still had things I disliked, even about DBZ.

[Bajosexto]

LOL "literally", huh? As someone who has these consoles sitting right next to me while being a huge fan of them and have listened to their music on a daily basis, you are giving their hardware specs too much credit. I know sub fans love hating on the Faulconer OST, but this takes the cake.

I'm just going to assume you really don't know what you're talking about and just dislike the OST for other reasons.

Please don't generalize. Not every fan of the Japanese version hates the Faulconer score. Don't know why some FUNi dub fans think that if you're a fan of the Japanese version, you must automatically hate anything related to the FUNi dub.

I'm midway through the Namek Saga right now and I'm counting down the episodes until the Bruce Faulconer music starts.

I can't bare to listen to this dreary Japanese music anymore. I don't think the show would have been nearly as popular in the West without the Faulconer score.

Actually it was very popular in the West without the Faulconer score. It still is. The "West" isn't just English speaking countries. Dragon Ball aried with its original OST in Latin America and till this day it's still massively popular. I mean, in Mexico Dbz is still aring on primetime tv. And with no Faulconor.

While is true that some kids back in the early 2000s might of watch dbz purely because they liked the soundtrack, most kids just don't really care for that kind of thing. At least personally I didn't. I honestly can't remember the soundtracks of the majority of cartoons I used to watch as a kid. I used to love Avatar as a kid, but I don't remember any song from ist OST. Same with Ben 10. The reason I used to watched those shows was because they were cool. Not because of their music. I'm not saying that music isn't important in kids shows, or that kids don't notice good or bad music, but the majority of kids will watch a show with good or bad music. If the show is good, they will watch.

[Gaffer Tape]

I think there might be a severe disconnection between us fans and how we grew up watching the show....


I believe this forum is divided into two groups. Those who were older than 17 when DB first aired, and those of us who were less than 10 years old when it aired. Unfortunately, being a children's show, it was tailored to us 10 year olds. You older folk were much more critical of the show because you were at an age were you noticed details that us kids did not, while we absolutely ate it up. We loved the show. And now, looking back on it, us fans who were so young when the show first came around remember everything very fondly(nostalgia?)


There is a lot of separation between those who were kids, and those who first watched the show as an adult. I've noticed the older crowd is much more critical of the FUNImation Dub....

Like ABED said, I feel that's a bit reductive. While it's probably fair to say the majority of those hating the score in 1999 were older fans who were already long familiar with the show, they certainly weren't the only ones, and they definitely aren't the only ones 18 years later. I was 12 when I got into Dragon Ball and 13 when season 3 began. For the first two seasons, I didn't mind the music, but it didn't leave much of an impression on me. When I bought the tapes of the 1995 Dragon Ball dub, I thought the music was catchy enough. The original score aired with Z movies 1 and 2 at the beginning of 1999, which I didn't know was the original score at the time, and it left a HUUUUUUGE impression on me. I loved it immediately. And when I first heard the season 3 music... I thought it was terrible. I stopped watching the dub entirely after season 4, and the music was a big part of why I left.

But while I agree in a general sense that tastes refine as one grows older, I think it's silly to say that kids don't notice this stuff entirely. It's a circular line of reasoning, really, because if that was the case, why bother to replace the score in the first place? You can't say "American kids in the '90s expected a certain sound" in the same breath as "Kids don't notice this stuff." We do know that American kids in the past seven years were watching Dragon Ball Kai with the Kikuchi score. We've gotten to the point where those kids who were introduced to the series that way are now posting on this forum. And somehow they were either fans of that score, or it didn't turn them off to the show to the point that they aren't still fans a decade later, just like it didn't turn people off when the movies aired in 1999.

[DragonBallKing]

Even though I like a few tracks(ginyu transformation, super vegeta piano, SSJ3), overall it doesn't create the dramatic atmosphere that Kikuchi's music does and having music constantly playing utterly kills the show for me. It feels like it's trying to hard to make every single moment epic, unlike the JPN OST which knows how to use silence effectively. I can see why people would prefer it though, the Faulconer score is fast and intense and it's closer to the music you hear in Naruto and Bleach which people seem to think is better for a action show. For fast pased action music I would even take Yamamoto over Faulconer, his music is faster than Kikuchi and IMO better for some action scenes.

[Hellspawn28]

I believe this forum is divided into two groups. Those who were older than 17 when DB first aired, and those of us who were less than 10 years old when it aired. Unfortunately, being a children's show, it was tailored to us 10 year olds. You older folk were much more critical of the show because you were at an age were you noticed details that us kids did not, while we absolutely ate it up. We loved the show. And now, looking back on it, us fans who were so young when the show first came around remember everything very fondly(nostalgia?)


There is a lot of separation between those who were kids, and those who first watched the show as an adult. I've noticed the older crowd is much more critical of the FUNImation Dub....

I was 8 when Season 3 of DBZ aired on Toonami in 1999 and I thought it was garbage too. I hated DBZ as a kid in 1999 and the music made it sound even worst. When I got into DBZ when I was 9-10 in 2001, I really like the Japanese more because it feel more natural to me. It felt like how it was originally made and not some music that belongs in Power Rangers.

[GreatSaiyaJeff]

I admit it's partial nostalgia but overall the Faulconer score is enjoyable. Like all soundtracks there are hits and misses. Pikon's theme and Trunk's Story hit an emotional core of what the series can be. I do agree some of the Freeza score is kind of a miss, but by the time of the Trunks saga, it hit it's stride.

[Dbzfan94]

I admit it's partial nostalgia but overall the Faulconer score is enjoyable. Like all soundtracks there are hits and misses. Pikon's theme and Trunk's Story hit an emotional core of what the series can be. I do agree some of the Freeza score is kind of a miss, but by the time of the Trunks saga, it hit it's stride.

I'll agree here. Early Freeza stuff has a few gems but it's mostly filler. By Trunks it's definitely hit a stride and by Buu it's near flawless save for the constant playing.

[Dbzfan94]

I was more referring how its all low and ominous much of the time. That's on top of being lifeless and unmemorable.

Nah the Japanese music is boring to tears. Not only does it all sound mostly the same from track to track but I keep hearing the same few tracks over and over and over again.

It makes the show a bit of a snoozefest actually. Replacing the music was the best thing they ever did to it. Same with Kai.

That's pure hyperbole. The tracks are all distinct and memorable. Yeah, they play over and over, but the score changes over time. It also has the benefits of fitting the show and not sounding cheap.

Honestly it's funny that you call his statement hyperbole; yours can easily be said to be hyperbole as well.

[Duo]

They could have used fart noises on repeat for the soundtrack and the show would still have succeeded. It was already huge before Falcouner.

[Hellspawn28]

I can't bare to listen to this dreary Japanese music anymore. I don't think the show would have been nearly as popular in the West without the Faulconer score.

I hate when people say this because it's not true. DBZ did well without Faulconer's score in 1998 and was one of the most popular CN show at the time. If Toonami never play re-runs of the Saban era dub then it's unlikely that Funimation would have dub the rest of the series. I think if DBZ still had the original Japanese music in the dub at the time, it would still do well on TV.

[Bullza]

I can't bare to listen to this dreary Japanese music anymore. I don't think the show would have been nearly as popular in the West without the Faulconer score.

I hate when people say this because it's not true. DBZ did well without Faulconer's score in 1998 and was one of the most popular CN show at the time. If Toonami never play re-runs of the Saban era dub then it's unlikely that Funimation would have dub the rest of the series. I think if DBZ still had the original Japanese music in the dub at the time, it would still do well on TV.

I never said it wouldn't have done well, so I don't know why a bunch of people have replied to me saying so.

But the Faulconer score is the more popular score with fans in the United States, significantly so. So of course without it it would not have been as popular as it now is.

Getting rid of the dull, dreary, outdated and repetitive score and replacing it with a more suitable one was the right thing for them to do.

[Boo Machine]

I don't know. I find it a little hard to believe that the Faulconer score is one of the major factors that made DBZ popular in the states. It's just never one of the things I hear when people talk about how much they like the show here.

I hate to play the nostalgia card, but how many of the people who like the score now, like it because they grew up with it? I hear all the time that people who grew up with it eventually loving the original score better, but I rarely, if ever, hear people who mainly watched the show with the original Japanese score say they like Faulconers tracks.

Friends who grew up with me watching the show, barely even remember the music, aside from Vegetas piano theme, or sometimes Cells theme. And my cousin who wanted to get into the series when he was 9 didn't have a single issue with the the Kikuchi score and in fact pointed out that he loved this particular track - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TFGY-PciwFU .
So I feel like the show would have been just as popular with it.

But out of curiosity since I'm no music expert, what makes the Faulconers score more suitable than Kikuchi's?