In defense of Goku in Smash bros
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Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
The Super Butoden games were killing it on the Super Famicon plus tons of video games (mostly fighting games) have been biting Dragon Ball's material including Street Fighter and Sonic, especially through Goku so it's not like he hasn't earned the right to be considered a video game character.
fadeddreams5 wrote:Goku didn't die in GT. The show sucked him off so much, it was impossible to keep him in the world of the living, so he ascended beyond mortality.DBZGTKOSDH wrote:... Haven't we already gotten these in GT? Goku dies, the DBs go away, and the Namekian DBs most likely won't be used again because of the Evil Dragons.
jjgp1112 wrote: ↑Sat Jul 18, 2020 6:31 am I'm just about done with the concept of reboots and making shows that were products of their time and impactful "new and sexy" and in line with modern tastes and sensibilities. Let stuff stay in their era and give today's kids their own shit to watch.
I always side eye the people who say "Now my kids/today's kids can experience what I did as a child!" Nigga, who gives a fuck about your childhood? You're an adult now and it was at least 15 years ago. Let the kids have their own experience instead of picking at a corpse.
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Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
Because Smash isn't popular enough? I don't think Nintendo worries about the series' popularity. Look at how hyped people were from just the teaser in the last Direct.AnimeNation101 wrote:Without that stupid rule, Smash would be WAY more popular just with Goku alone.
Michele Knotz has never voiced Ash.Pantalones wrote:and before anyone tries to say otherwise... no, the "Pokémon Trainer" from Brawl was not Ash, despite the fact that they randomly gave him Ash's voice.
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Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
Yeah, Burt without the rule, Smash could be rivaling games like Call of Duty, Battlefield, etc.The S wrote:Because Smash isn't popular enough? I don't think Nintendo worries about the series' popularity. Look at how hyped people were from just the teaser in the last Direct.AnimeNation101 wrote:Without that stupid rule, Smash would be WAY more popular just with Goku alone.
Michele Knotz has never voiced Ash.Pantalones wrote:and before anyone tries to say otherwise... no, the "Pokémon Trainer" from Brawl was not Ash, despite the fact that they randomly gave him Ash's voice.
I called it that Gogeta, Bardock, and something Broly related would be in the movie before it was even announced that it was a Broly movie.
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Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
Huh! I never looked up who did the voice used for him in Brawl, but I could've sworn it was one of the Ash voices (he's had at least two different voice actors over the years, right?) just by the sound of it.Michele Knotz has never voiced Ash.
Still, even if it's not the same person that voiced Ash, it's definitely an "Ash voice." Like when the direct-to-video movie sequel can't get the original voice actor for whatever reason, so they get someone who (...if they're good at it) does such a close imitation that the kids don't suspect anything.
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Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
I just don't understand this logic.AnimeNation101 wrote:Yeah, Burt without the rule, Smash could be rivaling games like Call of Duty, Battlefield, etc.The S wrote:Because Smash isn't popular enough? I don't think Nintendo worries about the series' popularity. Look at how hyped people were from just the teaser in the last Direct.AnimeNation101 wrote:Without that stupid rule, Smash would be WAY more popular just with Goku alone.
Michele Knotz has never voiced Ash.Pantalones wrote:and before anyone tries to say otherwise... no, the "Pokémon Trainer" from Brawl was not Ash, despite the fact that they randomly gave him Ash's voice.
Smash does phenomenally for a first party title which only releases one installment per generation. While it's not even in Nintendo's top 5-selling properties, Halo and Grand Turismo are the only first-party titles outside of Nintendo which have sold more. It's also a completely different genre and markets to a completely different user base than any of those games.
Not to mention, I don't think putting one anime character in the game will cause the game to suddenly sell millions more units.
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Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
I didin’t say just adding Goku. I mean getting rid of the rule entirely so that any character could get in. Like Superman, Goku, etcThe S wrote:I just don't understand this logic.AnimeNation101 wrote:Yeah, Burt without the rule, Smash could be rivaling games like Call of Duty, Battlefield, etc.The S wrote:
Because Smash isn't popular enough? I don't think Nintendo worries about the series' popularity. Look at how hyped people were from just the teaser in the last Direct.
Michele Knotz has never voiced Ash.
Smash does phenomenally for a first party title which only releases one installment per generation. While it's not even in Nintendo's top 5-selling properties, Halo and Grand Turismo are the only first-party titles outside of Nintendo which have sold more. It's also a completely different genre and markets to a completely different user base than any of those games.
Not to mention, I don't think putting one anime character in the game will cause the game to suddenly sell millions more units.
I called it that Gogeta, Bardock, and something Broly related would be in the movie before it was even announced that it was a Broly movie.
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Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
Could be a rights issue. Not as simple as just putting him in, unless you want Nintendo to get sued.AnimeNation101 wrote:Smash’s rule of only having characters who have originated from video games is a real limiter for the series. Goku has broken the smash ballot beating out many other voted characters several times but due to the rule, he never got put in. Without that stupid rule, Smash would be WAY more popular just with Goku alone.
Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
Well, Ash was mentioned in a SSB4 trophy from what I remember. He's the one anime character they could kinda let appear in the series somewhere.Pantalones wrote:(and before anyone tries to say otherwise... no, the "Pokémon Trainer" from Brawl was not Ash, despite the fact that they randomly gave him Ash's voice.
Still, I'd love to see Internet the day Goku actually makes it in
Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
I would not mind him being included but i can see why they don't.
The reason he was named 'Pokemon Trainer' is because he is just an avatar for the person playing the game not a character,which is why he has 0 personality and does not speak or emote.
Both Red from the pokemon manga and Ash from the anime(or Satoshi if you want to be accurate)are just different reincarnations of this 'empty shell'.
Red(just like Satoshi) is just one of the default names you could give the trainer avatar you are using.Pantalones wrote:
(and before anyone tries to say otherwise... no, the "Pokémon Trainer" from Brawl was not Ash, despite the fact that they randomly gave him Ash's voice. It's Red, the main character of the first-generation games and their remakes, who also appeared as the final optional boss in Gold/Silver/Crystal. I'm still annoyed that they didn't give him his actual name instead of "Pokémon Trainer.")
The reason he was named 'Pokemon Trainer' is because he is just an avatar for the person playing the game not a character,which is why he has 0 personality and does not speak or emote.
Both Red from the pokemon manga and Ash from the anime(or Satoshi if you want to be accurate)are just different reincarnations of this 'empty shell'.
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Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
Speaking of Ash, have you seen his recent makeover?Whatever wrote:I would not mind him being included but i can see why they don't.
Red(just like Satoshi) is just one of the default names you could give the trainer avatar you are using.Pantalones wrote:
(and before anyone tries to say otherwise... no, the "Pokémon Trainer" from Brawl was not Ash, despite the fact that they randomly gave him Ash's voice. It's Red, the main character of the first-generation games and their remakes, who also appeared as the final optional boss in Gold/Silver/Crystal. I'm still annoyed that they didn't give him his actual name instead of "Pokémon Trainer.")
The reason he was named 'Pokemon Trainer' is because he is just an avatar for the person playing the game not a character,which is why he has 0 personality and does not speak or emote.
Both Red from the pokemon manga and Ash from the anime(or Satoshi if you want to be accurate)are just different reincarnations of this 'empty shell'.
[spoiler][/spoiler]
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Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
Goku would never work in Smash. License characters can never work due to multiple issues bumping in. I remember they wanted Golden Eye James Bond in Melee, but they find out that they would have too much issues to deal with putting him in the game.
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Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
Then, how about, Sun Wukong?Hellspawn28 wrote:Goku would never work in Smash. License characters can never work due to multiple issues bumping in. I remember they wanted Golden Eye James Bond in Melee, but they find out that they would have too much issues to deal with putting him in the game.
[spoiler][/spoiler]
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Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
Monkey from Enslaved: Odyssey to the West would be a fun Sun Wukong character for Smash. I could get behind that.
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Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
There's also SonSon from "SonSon" made by Capcom, a game loosely based on Journey to the West and was also in Marvel vs Capcom, so there can be a potential moveset pool available.
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Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
Bond couldn't get into due to actor likeness rights and multiple studio rights with Bond. Goku would be slightly easier than getting Bond.Hellspawn28 wrote:Goku would never work in Smash. License characters can never work due to multiple issues bumping in. I remember they wanted Golden Eye James Bond in Melee, but they find out that they would have too much issues to deal with putting him in the game.
Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
You could always use this Son Goku:
Also, up till now, I've just kinda been snarking and dropping little references, but I'd like to say this:
No, I don't think Goku should be in Smash. Certainly he has a history of games, but I agree that he doesn't belong there.
However, I think he does belong there more than someone like Cloud (seriously, that just screams pandering to me). My recommendation? Drop Cloud, and replace him with Crono. Have an alternate color scheme for Crono that gives him Goku's pallette.
That way, you get a character who's exceptionally well-known who thematically fits in with the "history of Nintendo" stuff, and you get your (sorta) Goku, without feeling like they shoved in a character simply because easy money.
Also, up till now, I've just kinda been snarking and dropping little references, but I'd like to say this:
No, I don't think Goku should be in Smash. Certainly he has a history of games, but I agree that he doesn't belong there.
However, I think he does belong there more than someone like Cloud (seriously, that just screams pandering to me). My recommendation? Drop Cloud, and replace him with Crono. Have an alternate color scheme for Crono that gives him Goku's pallette.
That way, you get a character who's exceptionally well-known who thematically fits in with the "history of Nintendo" stuff, and you get your (sorta) Goku, without feeling like they shoved in a character simply because easy money.
Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
Chrono would be a cool addition as one of the best acclaimed RPG'S getting some shine in there, but I'm not seeing the point of not wanting Cloud or thinking he doesn't deserve to be a guest.
He's essentially the main icon of Final Fantasy, and is the main character of the most popular and acclaimed title of the franchise, no one else could fill the role of the whole series status wise like he can.
He's essentially the main icon of Final Fantasy, and is the main character of the most popular and acclaimed title of the franchise, no one else could fill the role of the whole series status wise like he can.
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Combat is craft. What matters most is not raw power, but the skill by which you hone it."
Combat is craft. What matters most is not raw power, but the skill by which you hone it."
Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
Because as far as I can tell, Smash has always represented characters from Nintendo history beating the tar out of each other, and he's kinda an antithesis of Nintendo history. Yeah, he's iconic to the Final Fantasy series, but the entry in the series that made him iconic was one of the titles that lead to the N64 getting curb-stomped by the PS1. The most he's ever really had on a Nintendo console amount to basically little more than cameos.Logania wrote:Chrono would be a cool addition as one of the best acclaimed RPG'S getting some shine in there, but I'm not seeing the point of not wanting Cloud or thinking he doesn't deserve to be a guest.
He's essentially the main icon of Final Fantasy, and is the main character of the most popular and acclaimed title of the franchise, no one else could fill the role of the whole series status wise like he can.
It'd be kinda like considering Miku Hatsune as a Persona character just because she had an appearance in Persona 4 Dancing All Night.
No matter how I look at it, it just screams shoving him in there because he's easy money, rather than any sort of meaningful representation. He's a boring, lazy choice as a Final Fantasy/Square-Enix rep, and as a character representing the history of Nintendo, he's pretty much the polar opposite. May as well have Kurt Irving from Valkyria Chronicles 3 in there and Alisa from God Eater in there, since both were in Project X Zone on the 3DS.
Mind you, this is all my personal opinion.
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Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
Cloud is also the star of a long-awaited super-hyped remake coming up in the (supposedly) near future. The Smash 4 Cloud DLC announcement came out the same year as the remake announcement. It seems clear to me that has more to do with anything than whatever cameo Cloud has been in, or whether or not he represents the Final Fantasy series. I'm surprised no one has mentioned that yet.
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Re: In defense of Goku in Smash bros
Sakurai acknowledged Goku and Spongebob requests. He did said that they have the Mii Fighters for those of type of characters.
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