Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Thread: "Super Hero"

[WittyUsername]

I would be very surprised if this movie makes anywhere near as much money as Broly. That movie had basically everything going for it: a flashy new art style, Toriyama’s take on a popular villain, the long awaited “canon” appearance of Gogeta, and for good measure, Bardock was also there.

This movie seems to have very little going for it in comparison, unless you’re one of those people who wishes that Gohan got to be the main character of the Boo arc. That’s not to say it’ll be bad, but there doesn’t seem to be much commercial appeal in this premise. It actually sounds better suited for one of those slice of life episodes from the DBS anime.

[Koitsukai]

Broly was also riding the DBS anime hype train, while this movie will be riding... DB Breakers'.

[HeroR]

This will not have the success that previous movies have had.

I don't think it'll come close to Broly since that performed better than BoG and RoF combined. It might be something that's difficult to replicate since that included some of the most popular characters in the franchise in one movie. I don't know how well it would do but I'd still be interested enough to watch it in theaters if it's playing nearby. It depends if I have to drive more than an hour then I'll probably wait to stream it after a few months.

Edit

Yes and him writing the movies has always been a major selling point. It's literally the same as the One Piece movies. Part of the reason the Super manga is largely ignored in Japan is because they see it as Toyo Dragon Ball and not Toriyama.

Just curious but where would you get that kind of information? Is there a poll that concluded the majority of Japanese fans considered it Toyo's Dragon Ball? I think it would sell worse if that's the case. It's not breaking records but I'm pretty sure it was the best selling sequel and only original first time franchises were higher on the list.

Mostly from people who lived in Japan. I followed games like Dokkan and Legends who have a lot of people who lived in Japan, studied Japanese so they can read Japanese forums, or know people who live in Japan. That is how they know what units are major sellers, like how the Super Saiyan 4 as super popular and will sell like hotcakes, but everything outside of them from GT is not very hype. Those who followed the manga noted that it isn't very popular because it isn't seen as a Toriyama product. The anime avoided this because the anime was aimed at the newer generation since the older, hardcore fans aren't really big on Dragon Ball after the Namek Saga. Which is probably why the manga gets almost no merch even for something simple as Super Saiyan Black (like seriously, why don't we have Super Saiyan Black merch instead of that ugly Super Saiyan 3 Rose).

It's still sells because at the end of the day, it's still Dragon Ball and the Super name is really that powerful in Japan. It actually replaced the 'Z' label over there. So even Heroes products gets put under the Super label. It's kinda like how Boruto is still fairly popular. But I feel what really hurt the Super manga is the lack of an anime.

Broly was also riding the DBS anime hype train, while this movie will be riding... DB Breakers'.

Broly also came out the same year as FighterZ funny enough.

But it is something that both the movie and game are experimental. It's like they feel the Dragon Ball name is strong enough to do different things. All I have to say about Breakers, Black better be in it. He was made for this kind of game.

[Alruneia]

As far as the fanbase at large is concerned, I doubt the CGI style will be a very big dealbreaker, and I think seeing Gohan get back in action will be a selling point, or at least it's something that could potentially be used as one, because people do like Gohan. I think the most tangible point towards DBSSH not necessarily breaking the box office is the fact that it's coming out three and a half years after DBS Broly with no "mainline" content in between. Sure, there's the manga and Heroes and other games, which do help maintain some interest, especially among more hardcore fans, but I think it's safe to say that the anime is the part of DB that has the biggest global reach, so now that the Super anime has been gone for so long, it is a real possibility that a portion of the fanbase might consider Dragon Ball to have "gone cold", and have moved on to other franchises and don't care enough to come back for this movie. In that case, it wouldn't be that DBSSH doesn't have much hype, but that DBS as a whole doesn't have much hype anymore. It's all speculative though.
(Personally I don't think DBSSH will do poorly, I just don't think it'll do as well as DBS Broly.)

New illustration by Chikashi Kubota - DBS Super Hero Character Designer

Spoiler:

That's a nice setup for a Masenkosappo... Huh. That would be an interesting inclusion in the movie, considering how it's from the Moro arc (and one video game according to the DB wiki, but that's the DB wiki so I don't know).
...Masenko Beam Cannon? Special Masenko Cannon? I dunno, Funimation translation pending I guess. Demon Flash of Death if you ask Viz.

[Skar]

Mostly from people who lived in Japan. I followed games like Dokkan and Legends who have a lot of people who lived in Japan, studied Japanese so they can read Japanese forums, or know people who live in Japan. That is how they know what units are major sellers, like how the Super Saiyan 4 as super popular and will sell like hotcakes, but everything outside of them from GT is not very hype. Those who followed the manga noted that it isn't very popular because it isn't seen as a Toriyama product. The anime avoided this because the anime was aimed at the newer generation since the older, hardcore fans aren't really big on Dragon Ball after the Namek Saga. Which is probably why the manga gets almost no merch even for something simple as Super Saiyan Black (like seriously, why don't we have Super Saiyan Black merch instead of that ugly Super Saiyan 3 Rose).

It's still sells because at the end of the day, it's still Dragon Ball and the Super name is really that powerful in Japan. It actually replaced the 'Z' label over there. So even Heroes products gets put under the Super label. It's kinda like how Boruto is still fairly popular. But I feel what really hurt the Super manga is the lack of an anime.

I'm not sure how many people you've spoken with but I don't think that sample size would reflect the entire casual Japanese audience. This is the largest DB forum online and has fans from all over the world but it's brought up how opinions here don't reflect the casual audiences of their countries. I'm pretty sure it far outsells other DB spin-offs by volume so I think it's selling as good as it can for something not drawn by Toriyama himself but still supervises it.

[ObnoxiousNamek]

This will not have the success that previous movies have had.

I don't think it'll come close to Broly since that performed better than BoG and RoF combined. It might be something that's difficult to replicate since that included some of the most popular characters in the franchise in one movie. I don't know how well it would do but I'd still be interested enough to watch it in theaters if it's playing nearby. It depends if I have to drive more than an hour then I'll probably wait to stream it after a few months.

I disagree they need to take a page out of the old 90s movies and go back to team up movies with the popular characters vs the one big bad of the movie. You can only do Goku and Vegeta for so long

[Xeno Goku Black]

DB movies IMO should have continued to follow the “Broly formula” which is Keep it mostly action (let’s be honest with ourselves the large majority of people go to see these movies for the action) ABSOLUTELY keep it 2-D hand drawn,keep it fun, hit key moments/scenes hard, the rest can be whatever as long as its serviceable.

That's exactly what they should have done. Battle of Gods was too light hearted for most casual fans.

Resurrection F took things more in the direction that casual fans do want from the series.

Broly near perfected that.

Now they're straying when there was no need. Broly was well liked and successful and they should have just improved on what worked.

Yes and him writing the movies has always been a major selling point.

Yes clearly but alone isn't enough. If it all came down to was the fact that he wrote the movie then there wouldn't have been such a large difference in gross between Resurrection F and Broly.

Toriyama is writing this one just like he wrote Broly but you watch when this makes nowhere near as much as that movie.

Most casual fans aren't even that bothered. More people would have seen Broly because it had Broly in it. If Toriyama wrote the same movie but it had Garlic Jr it wouldn't have been as successful.

It needs more than just his involvement to sell it. This movie does not have a strong selling point. Bringing back the Red Ribbon Army is not the same as bringing back Frieza and Broly.

Pan is in a movie for the first time and it isn't GT Pan

No offense but the idea that is what counts as a selling point is laughable. The majority of people that went to see Broly were males in their late 20's/early 30's, outside of Japan anyway and none of them care about Pan.

it has Gohan in a major role since Resurrection 'F' who is the third most popular character in all of Dragon Ball

That's not a selling point either. Gohan had a major role in the Tournament of Power. It's not like Trunks where they brought him back again after not seeing him for like 20 years.

In the end this being Dragon Ball it will make money but when there's been near 40 years of it and 20 movies, when they make a new one they still need a hook to truly bring people in.

People complained about them bringing back Frieza and then Broly but the characters are very popular, combined with giving them new forms/making then canon, that was enough to draw casuals in.

This one so far does not have any specific thing to really sell the movie. It might have something eventually but so far nothing.

It has a art style that's divided opinions and trailers have placed emphasis on characters that aren't Goku or Vegeta and are new so have no built in interest.

Out of the four Toriyama movies so far, this one is easily the hardest sell were you to describe it to a casual fan.

Battle of Gods - "They're making a new DB movie after all these years and Toriyama is writing this one. Goku's even gonna get a new form called Super Saiyan God!"

Resurrection F - "They're bringing back Frieza and giving him a new form!"

Broly - "They're bringing back Broly but Toriyama is rewriting him and bringing him into the canon story!"

Super Hero - "....Pan and Gohan are in it?"

[HeroR]

I'm not sure how many people you've spoken with but I don't think that sample size would reflect the entire casual Japanese audience. This is the largest DB forum online and has fans from all over the world but it's brought up how opinions here don't reflect the casual audiences of their countries. I'm pretty sure it far outsells other DB spin-offs by volume so I think it's selling as good as it can for something not drawn by Toriyama himself but still supervises it.

It isn't just forums. We're talking about people who live in the country in question. And there isn't any other Dragon Ball spin-off unless you mean the Dragon Ball Heroes manga. Are we doing that comparison to an official sequel? And that is what Super is, an official sequel, not a spin-off.

[HeroR]

DB movies IMO should have continued to follow the “Broly formula” which is Keep it mostly action (let’s be honest with ourselves the large majority of people go to see these movies for the action) ABSOLUTELY keep it 2-D hand drawn,keep it fun, hit key moments/scenes hard, the rest can be whatever as long as its serviceable.

That's exactly what they should have done. Battle of Gods was too light hearted for most casual fans.

Resurrection F took things more in the direction that casual fans do want from the series.

Broly near perfected that.

Now they're straying when there was no need. Broly was well liked and successful and they should have just improved on what worked.

Yes and him writing the movies has always been a major selling point.

Yes clearly but alone isn't enough. If it all came down to was the fact that he wrote the movie then there wouldn't have been such a large difference in gross between Resurrection F and Broly.

Toriyama is writing this one just like he wrote Broly but you watch when this makes nowhere near as much as that movie.

Most casual fans aren't even that bothered. More people would have seen Broly because it had Broly in it. If Toriyama wrote the same movie but it had Garlic Jr it wouldn't have been as successful.

It needs more than just his involvement to sell it. This movie does not have a strong selling point. Bringing back the Red Ribbon Army is not the same as bringing back Frieza and Broly.

Pan is in a movie for the first time and it isn't GT Pan

No offense but the idea that is what counts as a selling point is laughable. The majority of people that went to see Broly were males in their late 20's/early 30's, outside of Japan anyway and none of them care about Pan.

it has Gohan in a major role since Resurrection 'F' who is the third most popular character in all of Dragon Ball

That's not a selling point either. Gohan had a major role in the Tournament of Power. It's not like Trunks where they brought him back again after not seeing him for like 20 years.

In the end this being Dragon Ball it will make money but when there's been near 40 years of it and 20 movies, when they make a new one they still need a hook to truly bring people in.

People complained about them bringing back Frieza and then Broly but the characters are very popular, combined with giving them new forms/making then canon, that was enough to draw casuals in.

This one so far does not have any specific thing to really sell the movie. It might have something eventually but so far nothing.

It has a art style that's divided opinions and trailers have placed emphasis on characters that aren't Goku or Vegeta and are new so have no built in interest.

Out of the four Toriyama movies so far, this one is easily the hardest sell were you to describe it to a casual fan.

Battle of Gods - "They're making a new DB movie after all these years and Toriyama is writing this one. Goku's even gonna get a new form called Super Saiyan God!"

Resurrection F - "They're bringing back Frieza and giving him a new form!"

Broly - "They're bringing back Broly but Toriyama is rewriting him and bringing him into the canon story!"

Super Hero - "....Pan and Gohan are in it?"

So don't do anything different, just do Broly? Also, the problem with Battle of Gods for casual fans wasn't that it was too light-hearted. The problem was that no real fighting happened until the last third of the movie and Beerus vs Super Saiyan God Goku was short.

"Yes clearly but alone isn't enough."

Based on what?

" If it all came down to was the fact that he wrote the movie then there wouldn't have been such a large difference in gross between Resurrection F and Broly."

This comparison doesn't work for several dozen reasons. For one, Resurrection 'F' was a massive success to the point that it created Super. Broly came right off the heals of the anime most hype arc with UI, Jiren, and Frieza coming back for good along with FighterZ using Super characters like Hit and Black in the base game. Those were massive factors in Broly's success on top of it being Broly. In short, Resurrection 'F' was in a completely different environment compared to Broly because by the time Broly came out, Dragon Ball became a massive brand that surpassed One Piece in Japan. Also, Broly was released in far more theaters than Resurrection 'F', so it had more chances to make money. Same reason why Battle of Gods' sells look relatively low. It had a far more limited theater released and came out two years after its Japan's release worldwide.

"Toriyama is writing this one just like he wrote Broly but you watch when this makes nowhere near as much as that movie."

Because the environment is also not the same, and even then we won't know until it happened. Compared to Broly, this is the first massive Dragon Ball project in years.

"Most casual fans aren't even that bothered. More people would have seen Broly because it had Broly in it. If Toriyama wrote the same movie but it had Garlic Jr it wouldn't have been as successful."

Casual fans in Japan do indeed care that it's Toriyama. If you mean overseas fans, they're see it because it's Dragon Ball. That and the comparison to Garlic Jr is weird because what is the context? What's the story behind the new Garlic Jr, how does he connect to current events, what other characters are in the movie. You can't just throw a random name since if Broly was just a copy pasta of OG Broly, it wouldn't have been as successful either.

" Bringing back the Red Ribbon Army is not the same as bringing back Frieza and Broly."

Except the major selling point isn't 'OMG, RR is back!'. The selling point right now is 'OMG, Gohan is back and he looks awesome!' and 'who are those two new characters'. Like, have you actually read casual response to the movie or are you assuming?

"No offense but the idea that is what counts as a selling point is laughable. The majority of people that went to see Broly were males in their late 20's/early 30's, outside of Japan anyway and none of them care about Pan."

Funny you say that since Dragon Ball's female fan base has massively increased since Super, especially in Japan. So they would care about Pan. Believe it or not, not everything is about overseas. Heck, people were massively excited when they saw fan.

"Gohan had a major role in the Tournament of Power. "

The TOP is over three years old and he wasn't even in the Broly movie, which did legit annoyed people. And you saying this isn't a big selling point only tells me further that you haven't actually read people's response to the movie. Or just look at reaction videos.

"In the end this being Dragon Ball it will make money but when there's been near 40 years of it and 20 movies, when they make a new one they still need a hook to truly bring people in."

Most of those people watch the OG movies outside of Fusion Reborn.

"This one so far does not have any specific thing to really sell the movie"

Which is again not true since people are excited about Gohan returning. You really don't understand how big that is for many people, especially since he wasn't in Broly.

"Out of the four Toriyama movies so far, this one is easily the hardest sell were you to describe it to a casual fan."

"Super Hero - "....Pan and Gohan are in it?"

You can say, 'Dragon Ball's first ever fully CGI movie' because casual fans do what to see if Toei can pull off a CGI anime movie. As much as people loved the art style of Broly, casual fans are not married to it like fans here and they didn't collectively shot themselves hearing about an anime movie being 3D. Heck, the first trailer with the jumping Goku with the chopping frame rate was viewed positively by most people because they loved Goku's CGI model. It was like going into a different world since Dragon Ball fans were crying in a corner. That and in the second trailer the Easter Egg of Broly practically made the casuals creamed themselves so you can say, 'Broly is back and he's training with Goku on Beerus' planet'.

[Koitsukai]

Worthless comment: Piccolo has his manga colours, yet has one extra finger like in DBS.

[Skar]

It isn't just forums. We're talking about people who live in the country in question.

I live in the US but no way to know what the average American feels about the DBS manga. If I asked people in the street to conduct my own independent survey, I probably wouldn't get many responses. The only place I can communicate with other English speaking DB fans is online which usually isn't the casual audience. It's difficult to take your word for it that the few people you've spoken with represent the majority of Japanese fans without knowing how they obtained this information.

And there isn't any other Dragon Ball spin-off unless you mean the Dragon Ball Heroes manga. Are we doing that comparison to an official sequel? And that is what Super is, an official sequel, not a spin-off.

I don't know of many manga series that have sequels to compare it to. DBS was #38 last year and I think the only sequel in the 37 above it was called Daiya No Ace II. I checked and that it seems like it's drawn by the original author so DBS manga is the highest for a sequel drawn by a different artist.

[Chuquita]

Maybe part of why Pan is involved is because the parent and child dynamic of Gohan and Pan is meant to mirror how many fans are parents with kids of their own now around Pan's age? At least in the U.S? I know the earlier fans in Japan who grew up with DB are at least 10 years older so I guess their kids would on average be teenagers by now.

Or Toriyama semi-recently had grandchildren of his own and wanted to write something fun for them with a child protagonist?

[capsulecorp]

I wish we could move beyond these meta-comments about how much money this movie might make, or how much it might appeal to "casual fans" and so on.

I'm not a casual fan and I honestly couldn't care less about casual fans. I also think Toei already has MORE than enough money and don't really care about their bottom line.

I'll see this movie though! Even though the new trailer wasn't as exciting as the first.

[Mr_CINDER]

I wish we could move beyond these meta-comments about how much money this movie might make, or how much it might appeal to "casual fans" and so on.

I'm not a casual fan and I honestly couldn't care less about casual fans. I also think Toei already has MORE than enough money and don't really care about their bottom line.

I'll see this movie though! Even though the new trailer wasn't as exciting as the first.

By your logic marvel already has enough money so they should also stop appealing to casual fans all over the world and make movies for only hardcore comicbook fans, sorry to say it but that's not how it works.

[Jord]

The Broly movie did well because it featured a massively popular character, not seen for a while, a new form for Gogeta who was also mia for a long time and it just looked cool due to the art style. Trailers really sold the movie.
This looks like a regular episode but in video game cut scene form.

[Michsi]

I don't know if this was asked in this thread before, but when was Blizzard announced as the theme for the Broly movie? If they don't intend to give this one a theme song as well then I guess that proves they aren't spending a lot on marketing this time around.

[Xeogran]

I don't know if this was asked in this thread before, but when was Blizzard announced as the theme for the Broly movie? If they don't intend to give this one a theme song as well then I guess that proves they aren't spending a lot on marketing this time around.

Blizzard was revealed just 2 months before release. It's gonna have an Ending theme for sure, all the movies do.

[Luso Saiyan]

Worthless comment: Piccolo has his manga colours, yet has one extra finger like in DBS.

That's probably because it's a cultural issue.

In any case, I'm glad they've started to conform to the manga.

[Michsi]

I don't know if this was asked in this thread before, but when was Blizzard announced as the theme for the Broly movie? If they don't intend to give this one a theme song as well then I guess that proves they aren't spending a lot on marketing this time around.

Blizzard was revealed just 2 months before release. It's gonna have an Ending theme for sure, all the movies do.

Thanks!
Admittedly, I forgot about Battle of Gods' Hero and thought Resurrection F didn't have one so I kinda believed Broly was the only one with a proper theme song.

[Xeno Goku Black]

So don't do anything different, just do Broly?

Yes because it worked. It was more successful than the previous two movies put together and was the most well liked of the three. All they had to do was emulate that again.

People loved the art style, so keep the art style, keep the action, put Broly back in it and put an emphasis on him and then have the new story and villain and what not.

Don't go from Broly to Pan.

Based on what?

The clear lack of interest in this movie compared to the interest of Broly.

" If it all came down to was the fact that he wrote the movie then there wouldn't have been such a large difference in gross between Resurrection F and Broly."

Because the environment is also not the same, and even then we won't know until it happened. Compared to Broly, this is the first massive Dragon Ball project in years.

Whether it's the same or not, the movie will not make the money that Broly will because the movie has nothing of interest going for it when compared to previous movies.

"Most casual fans aren't even that bothered. More people would have seen Broly because it had Broly in it. If Toriyama wrote the same movie but it had Garlic Jr it wouldn't have been as successful."

Except the major selling point isn't 'OMG, RR is back!'. The selling point right now is 'OMG, Gohan is back and he looks awesome!' and 'who are those two new characters'. Like, have you actually read casual response to the movie or are you assuming?

Which again is not a selling point. "Gohan is back"....from what? He's back from 2018 because he missed one 90 minute movie? This is not like them bringing back Frieza, Android 17, Trunks or Broly. He had a big role in the Tournament of Power, missed a movie and is now in this one. He's been that frequent of a character overall that him being in it is not in any way a major selling point.

Which is again not true since people are excited about Gohan returning.

People can be as excited as they want. People are excited about Piccolo having a bigger role and yet it is still not a selling point.

I don't think you understand what a selling point is. Broly is in the top five for most popular characters. Them making the movie where they have Toriyama rewrite his character and bring him into the canon after not having appeared properly since the early 90's was the big hook for that movie. That was the thing to point out that specific movie and draw people in.

Gohan being back in a Dragon Ball movie, after going missing for one movie, because he was still relevant in the manga, when having appeared in a dozen movies already is not going to make casual fans be all excited.

You can say, 'Dragon Ball's first ever fully CGI movie' because casual fans do what to see if Toei can pull off a CGI anime movie.

People don't like the CGI. If anything that's only working against the movie. It's certainly not been a plus. All you see in the comments and here is how much it looks like a video game.

That and in the second trailer the Easter Egg of Broly practically made the casuals creamed themselves so you can say, 'Broly is back and he's training with Goku on Beerus' planet'.

Yeah and that should have been the movies selling point. The immensely popular Broly is back having not been seen since his movie, in the manga or Heroes and now he's training with Goku.

That's genuinely something yet it's been shown as a blink or you'll miss it moment because they'd much rather show Pan of all characters like anyone cares at all.