Official On-Going Dragon Ball Super Movie #2 Thread: "Super Hero"

[fleahop]

I just had a thought. I'm not in marketing or planning media in anyway nor have I ever been part of a project, but maybe I'm onto something here.

One issue with Broly is where do you go from there? Yes, it's a major cash-in but it's hard to one-up the Broly hype. The original movie was going to succeed pretty much no matter what. Because Broly.

As a company, it may make more sense to make a larger swathe of new characters mixed in with some ties to older ideas into the media. Kinda like Battle of Gods. New characters with a very new direction that ties to the gods and super saiyan. By itself, battle of gods was okay, but what it allowed was a wide range of new stories and content to be played off of it. Maybe they're trying the same thing with Super Hero?

With Broly I can't imagine a Dragon Ball story besides "let's fight" but this movie could open up Gohan/Piccolo to be what Vegeta has been the last decade. That'd be pretty cool. Not to mention the tons of merchandise they'll sell for years off of this movie. From a business perspective I'm wondering if that's kinda the thought process with it.

Now, to clarify, I'm one of the rare few on here that is truly excited for the film for what it is and nothing more. I have no beliefs it will outsell Broly in the box office though, and I bet Toei knows that. I can imagine they see this film being a long term investment.

[ZeroNeonix]

Since Goku and Vegeta are literally god-tier beings now, I really think they should be searching the twelve universes for unusually powerful opponents to challenge. They could have a system where Goku and Vegeta are off-world doing their own things, while the Earthlings handle smaller level threats on their own planet, and they could each have their own separate stories going on simultaneously. But of course, we know Goku has to come back to Earth to train Uub, and that's a bit of a commitment...

[ObnoxiousNamek]

The execution in Broly was good, and I think most fans were able to forgive the rehashing of the Broly character, due to him being so popular. The original Broly was cool, but had the dumbest of backstories and motivations. Toriyama's spin on the character fixed the problems with the character, and transformed him into someone who you could get invested in. Now, if TOEI decided to just continue that trend by canonizing Cooler, Janemba, and other villains, then it would become predictable. I think it's safe to say that most fans want NEW stories from Super.

I disagree rehashed antagonists >>>>>> new ones. Super has had way too many swings and misses with Zamasu,Jiren,Moro, & Granola that I’d rather not see them try again.

Why is it some taboo thing that Dragonball can’t bring back old villains people are familiar with but reimagined when you have other successful film franchises do this exact same thing? You never see people complain when the MCU does this & a good majority of their movie villains aren’t even brand new.

[sangofe]

Seems like the staff of Knights of the Zodiac (the Netflix remake) is helping with the movie. In this video, the director Yoshiharu Ashino talks about it (4:30).

Is that a good thing for the movie in regards of quality?

https://youtu.be/RNA4E3AuGIk This is what the show looks like I’ll let you judge it for yourself but a lot of the longtime saint seiya fans were pissed

Very cartoonish and shiny I think..

[ZeroNeonix]

The execution in Broly was good, and I think most fans were able to forgive the rehashing of the Broly character, due to him being so popular. The original Broly was cool, but had the dumbest of backstories and motivations. Toriyama's spin on the character fixed the problems with the character, and transformed him into someone who you could get invested in. Now, if TOEI decided to just continue that trend by canonizing Cooler, Janemba, and other villains, then it would become predictable. I think it's safe to say that most fans want NEW stories from Super.

I disagree rehashed antagonists >>>>>> new ones. Super has had way too many swings and misses with Zamasu,Jiren,Moro, & Granola that I’d rather not see them try again.

Why is it some taboo thing that Dragonball can’t bring back old villains people are familiar with but reimagined when you have other successful film franchises do this exact same thing? You never see people complain when the MCU does this & a good majority of their movie villains aren’t even brand new.

Uh, we disagree strongly on those "misses." Jiren was kind of boring once we got his Batman-esque backstory, but Zamasu was delightfully conceited. Moro? You kidding me? He's a fantastic villain. He starts off weak, but he evens the odds with his magical powers. He's menacing and intelligent, and his designs were great. He's my favorite Super villain so far. The Granola arc isn't finished yet, so can't really judge it fairly. It started off strong, and now it's in a weird place, but we'll have to see where the story takes us.

Broly was interesting, as a detour. But he's not the best thing that happened to the series. The higher budget made for a nice visual experience. But if Toei went with your vision for the future of the series, I'd be done with it. It would be like Disney with their shameless copy/paste live action remakes. Why would you want something so lacking in artistic integrity? Something so boring and predictable?

[SupremeKai25]

Zamasu (who is the main villain of the Future Trunks arc) is arguably the best villain in the entire franchise (I can also explain why btw).

Unfortunately all other villains and antagonists of Super are lame, so I kind of agree with the idea that they are "hit and miss" ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Majin Buu]

I disagree rehashed antagonists >>>>>> new ones. Super has had way too many swings and misses with Zamasu,Jiren,Moro, & Granola that I’d rather not see them try again.

Why is it some taboo thing that Dragonball can’t bring back old villains people are familiar with but reimagined when you have other successful film franchises do this exact same thing? You never see people complain when the MCU does this & a good majority of their movie villains aren’t even brand new.

1. Dragon Ball is not the MCU. What works for the MCU won't necessarily work for Dragon Ball.

2. There's no guarantee that we won't get a miss with a reimagined villain.

3. Relying on that would just cement the criticism that Dragon Ball has no original ideas anymore; and while there is some truth to that, "can't win so don't try" isn't a good solution either.

I'd rather them try and come up short than not try at all.

[WittyUsername]

I would say that if the people in charge of Dragon Ball wanted to pull the ultimate fanservice move, they should do what No Way Home did and have DBS Goku crossover with GT Goku to fight a bunch of past movie and GT villains, but Heroes already has that covered. .

[Lukmendes]

Since Goku and Vegeta are literally god-tier beings now, I really think they should be searching the twelve universes for unusually powerful opponents to challenge. They could have a system where Goku and Vegeta are off-world doing their own things, while the Earthlings handle smaller level threats on their own planet, and they could each have their own separate stories going on simultaneously. But of course, we know Goku has to come back to Earth to train Uub, and that's a bit of a commitment...

Specially considering that, while ToP showed that there are weird beings in other universes, not only it's showing only a small part of each universe, they all also didn't have a lot of time to gather strong fighters, and there's 4 universes that didn't participate in the tournament.

It's actually kinda sad that Broly, Moro and Granolah are all still in U7, while I don't think we should sideline U7 completely, some exploration on the other universes could be fine, but even when a threat comes from another universe like Zamasu, he still was dealt with on Earth... At least Granolah's arc isn't on Earth I guess, but I really think DB should eventually travel to another universe and have adventures there, at least for one arc lol.

I disagree rehashed antagonists >>>>>> new ones. Super has had way too many swings and misses with Zamasu,Jiren,Moro, & Granola that I’d rather not see them try again.

Why is it some taboo thing that Dragonball can’t bring back old villains people are familiar with but reimagined when you have other successful film franchises do this exact same thing? You never see people complain when the MCU does this & a good majority of their movie villains aren’t even brand new.

MCU is an adaptation of comic books, one of the many, it's a different universe that does its own thing, but is still using comic elements and characters.

Super is more or less a sequel of DBZ, it being a continuation means it's continuing DB's story in a way, while it can bring back older villains, it can also bring new shit, and only bringing back older shit isn't gonna exactly continue the story.

Apples and oranges.

I would say that if the people in charge of Dragon Ball wanted to pull the ultimate fanservice move, they should do what No Way Home did and have DBS Goku crossover with GT Goku to fight a bunch of past movie and GT villains, but Heroes already has that covered. .

Hopefully it means that as long as Heroes does it, it doesn't have in Super, 2uper or whatever lol.

[ZombieVito]

Zamasu (who is the main villain of the Future Trunks arc) is arguably the best villain in the entire franchise (I can also explain why btw).

Unfortunately all other villains and antagonists of Super are lame, so I kind of agree with the idea that they are "hit and miss" ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Zamasu is so great that it makes up for Super only having 1 villain to me. Well, now we have more thanks to Super Hero.

[Skar]

Which is crazy to me they already came into this movie with a losers mindset after knocking it out the park with Broly. Broly can be topped but you have to go Bigger and badder not regress. Which is why it’s strange to me when everyone is against Cooler or Janemba being brought back. These straight to home video street shark reject villains are not it. Making a great DB is not rocket science I’d wager a good majority of the fans don’t go to the movies expecting a good plot these Dragonball movies (execept for this latest one) are essentially theme park ride films ffs. Plot be dammed.

I think rebooting another old villain was the literal first idea that came to mind after Broly. Broly was the most popular old movie villain so there's no guarantee rebooting Cooler or Janemba would be a success. RoF was about the most popular manga villain so I'd assume rebooting another movie villain would gross less than RoF. It could be a moderate success but I doubt as big as fans claim it'll be or gross more than Broly.

[Muffin Man]

Since Goku and Vegeta are literally god-tier beings now, I really think they should be searching the twelve universes for unusually powerful opponents to challenge. They could have a system where Goku and Vegeta are off-world doing their own things, while the Earthlings handle smaller level threats on their own planet, and they could each have their own separate stories going on simultaneously. But of course, we know Goku has to come back to Earth to train Uub, and that's a bit of a commitment...

If only it were possible to have stories set after he trains Uub, leading to a logical progression where the next generation takes over the responsibility of protecting Earth while Goku and Vegeta search for new challenges. Oh if only...

[Jiren The Alpha]

I would say that if the people in charge of Dragon Ball wanted to pull the ultimate fanservice move, they should do what No Way Home did and have DBS Goku crossover with GT Goku to fight a bunch of past movie and GT villains, but Heroes already has that covered. .

How is that even fanservice? Did people forget that GT got canceled because it was shit? Heroes is only spamming Super Saiyan 4 and thats for the Xeno characters not even the original GT characters lol.

[Skar]

How is that even fanservice? Did people forget that GT got canceled because it was shit? Heroes is only spamming Super Saiyan 4 and thats for the Xeno characters not even the original GT characters lol.

Wasn't that only a rumor that GT was canceled? The TV special came out around the Baby saga so it seemed they already had the ending in mind. If it was canceled they probably wouldn't still sell GT merchandise and include characters in video games decades later.

[TobyS]

How is that even fanservice? Did people forget that GT got canceled because it was shit? Heroes is only spamming Super Saiyan 4 and thats for the Xeno characters not even the original GT characters lol.

Wasn't that only a rumor that GT was canceled? The TV special came out around the Baby saga so it seemed they already had the ending in mind. If it was canceled they probably wouldn't still sell GT merchandise and include characters in video games decades later.

Even as a gt hater myself I think it's more an extension of DB being in decline before gt even started. GT was not just bad but even charitably it was “not good enough” to slow the rot.

So it's hard to say how much GT failed itself versus just DB was just wrapping up as a S tier franchise at the time.

People liked SS4 as a breakout star of GT. But no one really gives a shit about the Para para brothers or Luis or pan or get trunks super 17 generally.

Forms are just easier to slap on to characters as an easy way to make a new variation of an old thing. It'd be silly not to.

[SupremeKai25]

Zamasu (who is the main villain of the Future Trunks arc) is arguably the best villain in the entire franchise (I can also explain why btw).

Unfortunately all other villains and antagonists of Super are lame, so I kind of agree with the idea that they are "hit and miss" ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Zamasu is so great that it makes up for Super only having 1 villain to me. Well, now we have more thanks to Super Hero.

I agree, but it's kind of funny when you think about it. Super introduced many new universes, characters, fighters, etc. But it introduced only one "major" villain: Zamasu.

Everyone else is either an Antagonist (so not someone who can truly be called a "villain", like Beerus, Hit, Jiren, and Broly) or is not important enough to be called "major" (Frost... and Sorbet, I guess? I can't think of anyone else).

Which I suppose makes sense, because DBS had two Tournament arcs that were never interrupted, and so there wasn't much room for actual villains who want to kill the protagonists.

Thankfully Zamasu is a 10/10 villain so he just carries Super, it is therefore not a surprise that Ep. 47 (Ep. where Goku Black makes his debut) has the highest ratings in all of Super

By the way, I intentionally didn't mention Moro, Granolah, Gas, because we don't know if Toei will improve them and, hopefully, give them more personality. So I can't fully judge them yet.

[ZombieVito]

Zamasu (who is the main villain of the Future Trunks arc) is arguably the best villain in the entire franchise (I can also explain why btw).

Unfortunately all other villains and antagonists of Super are lame, so I kind of agree with the idea that they are "hit and miss" ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Zamasu is so great that it makes up for Super only having 1 villain to me. Well, now we have more thanks to Super Hero.

I agree, but it's kind of funny when you think about it. Super introduced many new universes, characters, fighters, etc. But it introduced only one "major" villain: Zamasu.

Everyone else is either an Antagonist (so not someone who can truly be called a "villain", like Beerus, Hit, Jiren, and Broly) or is not important enough to be called "major" (Frost... and Sorbet, I guess? I can't think of anyone else).

Which I suppose makes sense, because DBS had two Tournament arcs that were never interrupted, and so there wasn't much room for actual villains who want to kill the protagonists.

Thankfully Zamasu is a 10/10 villain so he just carries Super, it is therefore not a surprise that Ep. 47 (Ep. where Goku Black makes his debut) has the highest ratings in all of Super

By the way, I intentionally didn't mention Moro, Granolah, Gas, because we don't know if Toei will improve them and, hopefully, give them more personality. So I can't fully judge them yet.

Exactly. Until Toei animates Moro and Granolah, I will just ignore them.

[Hugo Boss]

If we are counting only really major bad guys here, I guess Moro and Elec would be the only ones besides Zamasu to warrant such a title. The shark androids, Granolah and Gas are probably just “tools”. And there is the secret antagonist from Super Hero, so we don’t know what kind of role he/she will play.

[Jord]

I would say that if the people in charge of Dragon Ball wanted to pull the ultimate fanservice move, they should do what No Way Home did and have DBS Goku crossover with GT Goku to fight a bunch of past movie and GT villains, but Heroes already has that covered. .

How is that even fanservice? Did people forget that GT got canceled because it was shit? Heroes is only spamming Super Saiyan 4 and thats for the Xeno characters not even the original GT characters lol.

Just like how Super got cancelled because it's shit, right?

[Lukmendes]

Wasn't that only a rumor that GT was canceled? The TV special came out around the Baby saga so it seemed they already had the ending in mind. If it was canceled they probably wouldn't still sell GT merchandise and include characters in video games decades later.

I hear that in Japan, GT's ratings weren't really good, but also that Z itself in the end also didn't really have good ratings, it's possible that GT's ratings were meh partially because they were having a DB fatigue.

Also from what I hear, GT was originally planned to end in Baby saga, and got extended, though whether or not Super 17 and Shadow Dragons were considered so bad it cancelled GT, I can't say, but I didn't get the feeling that the ending was that rushed, but who knows.