If faced with the choice of sacrificing the franchise's massive popularity

[GhostEmperorX]

Going back to original topic: No.

That is my answer to your question. Dragon ball being a cheap product is part of its charm. It was never meant for global success or to meet quality standards. It was a japanese animation made for japanese people who would buy the toukubon manga each week and decide the future of the series that way ( how vegeta was kept for example) . It is not a "cult" anime or a work of art manga. It has many defects, gaps and errors, but it is precisely that desire to "fix it" what has kept the franchise current and a strong fandom through Fan Manga, FanArt, Fanfiction... Fan rants.

Actually I've also had my fair share of moments where I've thought the same the more I've come to find out about how the series began and grew in the first place, so I can understand this reasoning for sure.
Especially since everything was apparently made on the spot without much prior planning (sometimes as a snappy response to editor and former editor feedback).
Even the original anime series has consistency issues here & there (like the end of episode 120 to the beginning of 121).

Although I think it would have been possible to at least give some areas the bare minimum treatment of those times it was made in, because when they did that the results were spectacular.
But I still understand your answer, makes plenty of sense in my view.

[ABED]

Pick your poison.
Very unpopular Dragon Ball = just up to Oolong wish.
Unpopular Dragon Ball = end of it after Piccolo Daimao.
Popular Dragon Ball = up to MajinBuu.
Extremely Popular Dragon Ball = Dragon Ball Super.
Uncanny Popular Dragon Ball = Kanzenshuu and strange people believing that Dragon Ball did more to humanity than penicilline.

You cannot expect for a commercial product to have better or same features as an unpopular one. If you strip out DB popularity, you can forget better features in exchange.
So the overall discussion is like "will you exchange your lungs for better air?"

It's not even REMOTELY like that. Those of us arguing for better treatment know exactly what DB is. It's a silly story that doesn't take itself too seriously that was written and drawn quickly. What about that means it's unreasonable to expect a dub that doesn't strip DB of its charm and cultural idiosyncrasies or a remaster that cuts nearly a quarter of the frame?

[super michael]

I would sacrifice DBS Anime popularity for better writing, animation, art style and better consistency.

Dragon Ball Super brought us a pleathora of cool new characters and storylines, it's not it's fault that it suffers from the same dumb shit that the original comic and cartoons did, only amplified by a lack of anyone in a position of power putting their foot down and actually making decisions intended to create a serious work. I find the "I'd gladly erase the existence of..." crowd to be overwrought children in this regard, mostly because they're incapable of having nuanced opinions on the subject, and are probably just having this position because they feel some sort of powerlessness elsewhere in their life and taking it out on a cartoon/comic franchise.

Anyway, my opinion is that Kale, Caulifla, Ribrianne, Zamasu, Gokuu Black, Broli, Cheelai, and Jiren are really cool and I think that it's a terrible shame to see Dragon Ball Super as anything but what it really is: a flawed but interesting series that can be improved upon, but it otherwise not a failure because, uh, hair colors or something.

DBS introduced worse issues compared to DB/DBZ. They ignored characters growth and treated some characters really bad, just for the sake of gag. They did it so much, it wasn't even funny at times.

Whatever issues DB/DBZ had, they could have fixed it in DBS. But they didn't do it. Instead they introduced new issues that DB/DBZ doesn't have and terrible writing that no other anime does.

In your character list the only character I disagree about being cool is Ribrianne. Her attitude and transformation are both awful.

[JulieYBM]

I would sacrifice DBS Anime popularity for better writing, animation, art style and better consistency.

Dragon Ball Super brought us a pleathora of cool new characters and storylines, it's not it's fault that it suffers from the same dumb shit that the original comic and cartoons did, only amplified by a lack of anyone in a position of power putting their foot down and actually making decisions intended to create a serious work. I find the "I'd gladly erase the existence of..." crowd to be overwrought children in this regard, mostly because they're incapable of having nuanced opinions on the subject, and are probably just having this position because they feel some sort of powerlessness elsewhere in their life and taking it out on a cartoon/comic franchise.

Anyway, my opinion is that Kale, Caulifla, Ribrianne, Zamasu, Gokuu Black, Broli, Cheelai, and Jiren are really cool and I think that it's a terrible shame to see Dragon Ball Super as anything but what it really is: a flawed but interesting series that can be improved upon, but it otherwise not a failure because, uh, hair colors or something.

In your character list the only character I disagree about being cool is Ribrianne. Her attitude and transformation are both awful.

Ribrianne's attitude and transformation are both really good. They're cute and unapologetically confident.

[super michael]

I would sacrifice DBS Anime popularity for better writing, animation, art style and better consistency.

Dragon Ball Super brought us a pleathora of cool new characters and storylines, it's not it's fault that it suffers from the same dumb shit that the original comic and cartoons did, only amplified by a lack of anyone in a position of power putting their foot down and actually making decisions intended to create a serious work. I find the "I'd gladly erase the existence of..." crowd to be overwrought children in this regard, mostly because they're incapable of having nuanced opinions on the subject, and are probably just having this position because they feel some sort of powerlessness elsewhere in their life and taking it out on a cartoon/comic franchise.

Anyway, my opinion is that Kale, Caulifla, Ribrianne, Zamasu, Gokuu Black, Broli, Cheelai, and Jiren are really cool and I think that it's a terrible shame to see Dragon Ball Super as anything but what it really is: a flawed but interesting series that can be improved upon, but it otherwise not a failure because, uh, hair colors or something.

In your character list the only character I disagree about being cool is Ribrianne. Her attitude and transformation are both awful.

Ribrianne's attitude and transformation are both really good. They're cute and unapologetically confident.

Ribrianne acted like a spoiled brat, just because C17 used his brains attacking her when she left herself wide open.
She constantly mocked C18, just because she was married to Kuririn. Her attitude toward the other universe he came out as egotistic and arrogant.
As for her transformation in my opinion she looks ugly. Then she got huge, which didn't look any better.

[JulieYBM]

I would sacrifice DBS Anime popularity for better writing, animation, art style and better consistency.



In your character list the only character I disagree about being cool is Ribrianne. Her attitude and transformation are both awful.

Ribrianne's attitude and transformation are both really good. They're cute and unapologetically confident.

Ribrianne acted like a spoiled brat, just because C17 used his brains attacking her when she left herself wide open.

so what?

She constantly mocked C18, just because she was married to Kuririn. Her attitude toward the other universe he came out as egotistic and arrogant.

well, #18's married to a cop, it makes sense to me to mock her.

As for her transformation in my opinion she looks ugly. Then she got huge, which didn't look any better.

why does she look ugly? Because she's not thin?

[super michael]

so what?

That makes her look bad. A pro fighter knows to not leave themselves exposed, yet she announced to everyone, while leaving themselve exposed. She expects everyone to not attack them, which is just dumb.
She is nothing but a spoiled brat, who wants everything her way.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIOwwVWRfjE

She is also a hypocrite, she doesn't want anyone to interrupt her transformation and possess, but she didn't have any problem trying to stop Goku Genki Dama against Jiren.
https://youtu.be/nSUa9dJQUr4?t=89

That makes her look worse. Luckily Vegeta stopped her.

well, #18's married to a cop, it makes sense to me to mock her.

She was mocking Kuririn due to his appearance, not because of his job. I don't believe anyone mentioned to her what Kuririn job was.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kU7LTtcwOs0

why does she look ugly? Because she's not thin?

Her clothes and appearance. I don't believe her being fat is the problem, there are characters that are fatter than her and looks good.
Her normal form looks better than her transformed form.

[GhostEmperorX]

Not sure what the above conversation is but surely it could use its own thread separate from this one.
Also...

It's not even REMOTELY like that. Those of us arguing for better treatment know exactly what DB is. It's a silly story that doesn't take itself too seriously that was written and drawn quickly. What about that means it's unreasonable to expect a dub that doesn't strip DB of its charm and cultural idiosyncrasies or a remaster that cuts nearly a quarter of the frame?

This is very much the case, and regarding that point about "forgetting better features in exchange", it's not as if it even has said features now, whereas far less popular properties do.

[JulieYBM]

so what?

That makes her look bad. A pro fighter knows to not leave themselves exposed, yet she announced to everyone, while leaving themselve exposed. She expects everyone to not attack them, which is just dumb.
She is nothing but a spoiled brat, who wants everything her way.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIOwwVWRfjE

She is also a hypocrite, she doesn't want anyone to interrupt her transformation and possess, but she didn't have any problem trying to stop Goku Genki Dama against Jiren.
https://youtu.be/nSUa9dJQUr4?t=89

That makes her look worse. Luckily Vegeta stopped her.

They're fictional characters, it's okay for them to not be great people. Ribrianne is an antagonist to the other characters, she's functioning as an antagonist that is completely out of step with the other characters' goals and personalities.

Besides, if you support womens' rights then you have to support womens' wrongs, too

She was mocking Kuririn due to his appearance, not because of his job. I don't believe anyone mentioned to her what Kuririn job was.

kuririn being a cop is so bad that is traverses reality and automatically makes it apparent how much of a loser he is, even to the point that you can make fun of him being bald, it's actually just making fun of him being a cop.

Her clothes and appearance. I don't believe her being fat is the problem, there are characters that are fatter than her and looks good.
Her normal form looks better than her transformed form.

"Her normal form looks better" the 'normal form' that is stereotypically cute and thin?

what's the difference between Ribrianne's transformed state and those 'other fat characters' who apparently 'are fatter' and 'look good' as such?

[super michael]

They're fictional characters, it's okay for them to not be great people. Ribrianne is an antagonist to the other characters, she's functioning as an antagonist that is completely out of step with the other characters' goals and personalities.

Besides, if you support womens' rights then you have to support womens' wrongs, too

It doesn't matter if she is fictional, how she is written is bad.

kuririn being a cop is so bad that is traverses reality and automatically makes it apparent how much of a loser he is, even to the point that you can make fun of him being bald, it's actually just making fun of him being a cop.

I just edited my post with the video, showing evidence it has nothing to do with Kuririn job but his appearance. Even making fun of his lack of nose.

"Her normal form looks better" the 'normal form' that is stereotypically cute and thin?

what's the difference between Ribrianne's transformed state and those 'other fat characters' who apparently 'are fatter' and 'look good' as such?

Fat Boo, Super Buu and his absorption, Kid Boo and his absorption they all look cool.

However unlike Fat Boo, Ribrianne just doesn't look good. Her clothes changes into some ridiculous. She loses her hair to gain a antena or whatever it is. She has no neck at all. Her eyes doesn't look good at all.

Ribrianne normal form looks better in everyway possible.

Mr Popo isn't slim, yet he looks cool.

[super michael]

I almost forgot since he wasn't mentioned, I am not a fan of Cabba design at all. Him being slim isn't the problem, but his lack of muscles doesn't look good at all.
His limbs looks like twigs, despite that he trains and fight.

Normally training and fighting leads to muscle growth, so him having 0 muscles is bad.
Plus his eyes doesn't look good.

Imagine if Cabba gains SSG, how can he look slimmer than he is now.