Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

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Seekeroftruth
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Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by Seekeroftruth » Sat Jan 27, 2024 12:54 pm

Image

So this is an alternate storyline that I've made in which Goku dies on Namek.

Son Goku is unable to find a working space ship to escape Namek's destruction, he resigns himself to his faith as he watches the planet about to detonate. With one fiery yell of discontent, Goku and the planet go up in smoke. He dies as the "strongest fighter in the universe" and sets a new level of power for his friends to meet.

Son's friends try to revive him using the dragon ball but are told that he will just die in space, since there is no planet. Goku comforts his friends that he is fine being dead and that he will meet them some day in the afterlife, he urges all of them to get stronger for future threats that may arise. With no Goku to wait on, Vegeta initially leaves Earth to train in outer space but finds that there is no one that can really give him a challenge and he has plateaued in his progression. He returns to Earth and demands that Dr. Brief construct a gravity machine for him that is 5x as tough than Goku's own in order to surpass him. Fast forward 1 year from now and Frieza and company arrive on earth to seek revenge on Goku. Trunks from an alternate timeline, in which Goku escaped Namek but died of the heart virus, intervenes and kills both Frieza , his father and all his men. He then informs everyone that he is from the future and came back to the past to find out information on how to stop the coming androids that are set to arrive in 3 years.

The androids attack Amenbo island. The Z senshi arrive and things play out as they did in the original manga. The only difference being that Piccolo fights android 19 and is saved by Vegeta, who then reveals that he is now a legendary SSJ. Andriod 20 flees the battle to get to his laboratory, and activates 16, 17, and 18. Everything continues to play out as in the original manga, with everyone losing to 17 and 18, while 16 watches the battle. After being informed by krillin, that Son Goku died on Namek, the androids choose to leave and find their purpose in life. Krillin then uses the senzu beans to revive the others and inform them on what happened. Piccolo is shaken by their power and goes to Kami to fuse with him. Vegeta flies off in disgrace, having been bested as a SSJ. At Kami, Piccolo arrives and is informed by Kami of another entity from the future. He agrees to fuse with him and they fly off to face cell.

Piccolo locks in on Cell's ki and confronts him at Gingerbread town, the fight between the two plays out like in the original manga. Vegeta and company sense Piccolo's ki and race the scene to find out what is going on. Piccolo informs them of this new entity and how they must stop it from absorbing the other androids. Using Kami's knowledge, Piccolo informs the others of the time chamber and urges trunks and vegeta to go in first, while the rest of them hunt for cell. Cell however is smart and hides his energy signature, he slowly builds up his power by killing people across multiple towns until he is confident that he can fight the androids. He eventually spots them, when their whereabout are reported on the news for a crime that they committed. Cell confronts the androids and begin fighting them, Piccolo senses his ki and correctly deduces that he must have found the androids. He race to the area and forms a temporary truce with 17 to stop cell from becoming perfect. Unfortunately, both are defeated and despite 16's best effort, cell becomes semi-perfect. The rest plays out similar to the manga, in which Tien holds off cell to give 16 and 18 a chance to escape. Unfortunately for Tien in this alternate universe, he is killed by cell but Piccolo manages to barely survive and is saved by Gohan, who was sensing the battle on Kami's lookout.

From this point forth, the story plays out similar to the manga, with Vegeta and Trunks confronting cell but ultimately failing to stop him from becoming perfect, as well as, Dende becoming new guardian of earth. Gohan and Piccolo go into the time chamber and Piccolo being aware of Gohan's hidden potential, pushes him towards becoming a SSJ and utilizing his rage. After ~ 1 day has passed, Piccolo and Gohan emerge from the time chamber, stronger than ever. They are informed of Vegeta failing to stop cell and of the upcoming cell games. Piccolo continue to train with Gohan during the coming days that lead into the cell game. On the day of the cell game, Gohan fights Cell and puts up a decent fight similar to Son Goku. Piccolo urges him to unleash his hidden power but due to Gohan fear of his power and gently nature, he resist. Cell wanting to find out more of Gohan's hidden potential unleashes the cell jr. on the z-senshi. This ultimately leads to the death of Android 16, which pushes Gohan to SSJ2. At this point, it plays out similar to the manga with Gohan defeating cell as a SSJ2.

Cell ultimately resorts to suicide via self detonation but is stopped by Trunks, who quickly picks him up and carries him to space to prevent the planet destruction. Trunks is killed in the blast but cell survives and reforms as Super Perfect Cell. He then returns to earth to gloat about his new power and Trunk's death. This enrages Vegeta, who subconsciously has grown attached to his future son and he launches an all out attack against Cell. This fails and cells knocks away vegeta, ultimately leading to Gohan getting injured. The rest of the events playing out similar to the manga. After cell is defeated, Dende uses the dragon ball to revive Tien, Trunks and everyone else killed by Cell. Trunks returns to his timeline in the future and peace is maintain in the world for the next 7 years.

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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by MasenkoHA » Sat Jan 27, 2024 1:07 pm

The comtempt Dragon Ball fans have for the main character who embodies the series theme is truly fascinating.
Seekeroftruth wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 12:54 pm Image
.

Son's friends try to revive him using the dragon ball but are told that he will just die in space, since there is no planet. .
This is why they wished Krillin's spirit to earth before reviving him

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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by Dragon Ball Ireland » Sat Jan 27, 2024 1:28 pm

No, Goku's role in the Artificial Humans arc was crucial. Most of the tension early on comes from Goku dying from the heart virus in the future and not being able to be wished back with the Dragon Balls because it was a death by natural causes. Goku saving Gohan and the Earth from Cell self destruction was also a pivotal moment and a redemption for his rash decision to send Gohan out to fight Cell not knowing he didn't have the same thirst for battle.
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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by AliTheZombie13 » Sat Jan 27, 2024 9:24 pm

No, but I do think it would've been better if he stayed dead during the Boo Saga.

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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by MasenkoHA » Sat Jan 27, 2024 10:22 pm

AliTheZombie13 wrote: Sat Jan 27, 2024 9:24 pm No, but I do think it would've been better if he stayed dead during the Boo Saga.
If Dragon Ball had come out a decade and half later or so and the Great Saiyaman arc started around the MCU boom in the late aughts/early 10s, Toriyama probably would have stuck with Gohan/Great Saiyaman as the new protagonist, tbh.

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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by JulieYBM » Sun Jan 28, 2024 12:01 am

I think any art that someone wants to make is worth being made. That being said, I think it would be more interesting to have simply had Gokuu change into a different character entirely after the Namek arc. I would be more interested in thinking about the series if Gokuu had changed as a character, and how the other characters reacted to that. What if he was the initial depiction of Super Saiyan Gokuu all the time now? What if the series took Gokuu’s cavalier behavior more seriously?

You could really do a ton of different things to make the series post-Namek better. Killing off Gokuu is not the only option.
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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by TobyS » Sun Jan 28, 2024 5:20 am

Yeah vegeta would suggest summoning his soul like he did for kuririn.

I'm not sure why trunks would need to come from a timeline where goku was alive he's dead in the future either way.

Piccolo would need a reason to remember the rosat.

I don't see how Cell would stumble across the androids.

You'd need to iron out those creases.

Without goku suggesting surpassing ss piccolo wouldn't think much of them using rosat he'd probably send himself and destroy first or mid form cell easy.

Then we get the whole “everyone dies” situation in the boo arc, unless gohan has his ss2 thing with dabra
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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by TheGreatness25 » Sun Jan 28, 2024 10:32 am

Talk about a sad, dreary ending for the series' protagonist.

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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by Hellspawn28 » Sun Jan 28, 2024 2:32 pm

I never get the appeal of Goku dying on Namek?
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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by coola » Sun Jan 28, 2024 7:21 pm

After Goku become crappy character past Freeza saga (in my opinion, he keeps making same mistakes and never learned from them) I wouldn't mind if he stayed death, same with Vegeta :D

I mostly agree with what would happen in OP post, but...how would Dende got on Earth without Goku IT?
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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by Dbzfan94 » Sun Jan 28, 2024 7:44 pm

No, I dont. Quite the opposite actually.

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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by ABED » Sun Jan 28, 2024 7:46 pm

coola wrote: Sun Jan 28, 2024 7:21 pm After Goku become crappy character past Freeza saga (in my opinion, he keeps making same mistakes and never learned from them) I wouldn't mind if he stayed death, same with Vegeta
Why would he learn? It's not like he failed.

And no, my answer will always be "no" whenever this question arises. Why kill off Goku on Namek? What purpose does it serve? It just doesn't work tonally with the story.
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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by JulieYBM » Sun Jan 28, 2024 7:54 pm

There are such a large number of different options available for stories to tell whether Son Gokuu survived Namek or not that I really don't see where the confidence in one option being objectively worse than the other is coming from.
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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by MasenkoHA » Sun Jan 28, 2024 8:06 pm

coola wrote: Sun Jan 28, 2024 7:21 pm After Goku become crappy character past Freeza saga (in my opinion, he keeps making same mistakes and never learned from them) I wouldn't mind if he stayed death, same with Vegeta :D

I mostly agree with what would happen in OP post, but...how would Dende got on Earth without Goku IT?
Making mistakes is called being human

I swear people have it drilled in their head that fictional characters need to grow to be perfect or they failed

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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by coola » Sun Jan 28, 2024 9:11 pm

MasenkoHA wrote: Sun Jan 28, 2024 8:06 pm
coola wrote: Sun Jan 28, 2024 7:21 pm After Goku become crappy character past Freeza saga (in my opinion, he keeps making same mistakes and never learned from them) I wouldn't mind if he stayed death, same with Vegeta :D

I mostly agree with what would happen in OP post, but...how would Dende got on Earth without Goku IT?
Making mistakes is called being human

I swear people have it drilled in their head that fictional characters need to grow to be perfect or they failed
Not perfect, but when you learn you shouldn't give senzu beans to your enemy or mess up and force others to clear your mistake, it actually get boring and annoying.
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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by Majin Buu » Mon Jan 29, 2024 9:36 am

coola wrote: Sun Jan 28, 2024 9:11 pmNot perfect, but when you learn you shouldn't give senzu beans to your enemy or mess up and force others to clear your mistake, it actually get boring and annoying.
Thing is, when people complain over and over about Goku doing stuff like this, it creates the impression that folks expect Goku to be flawless and always make the right decisions and always act like a hero should.

And that's what I personally find "boring".

For me, Goku is more interesting as a flawed character that doesn't always make decisions in service of the greater good and has his own ulterior motives when he does. Goody two-shoes Jesus Goku that never does anything questionable is the more boring Goku to me.

Sometimes it feels like fans want Goku to be something like modern day Micky Mouse- Iconic, but not allowed to be anything other than an upstanding good guy.

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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by MasenkoHA » Mon Jan 29, 2024 9:47 am

coola wrote: Sun Jan 28, 2024 9:11 pm
MasenkoHA wrote: Sun Jan 28, 2024 8:06 pm
coola wrote: Sun Jan 28, 2024 7:21 pm After Goku become crappy character past Freeza saga (in my opinion, he keeps making same mistakes and never learned from them) I wouldn't mind if he stayed death, same with Vegeta :D

I mostly agree with what would happen in OP post, but...how would Dende got on Earth without Goku IT?
Making mistakes is called being human

I swear people have it drilled in their head that fictional characters need to grow to be perfect or they failed
Not perfect, but when you learn you shouldn't give senzu beans to your enemy or mess up and force others to clear your mistake, it actually get boring and annoying.
When did he learn you shouldn't give senzu beans to your enemy?

He wanted to have Cell at full strength to show the full extent of Gohan's power with a fair fight.

It wasn't bright, but it was very Goku. It's fighting series about characters wanting to test their strength. I think the sooner fans realize what kind of story Dragon Ball actually is the less upset they would be with half the plot developments that bother them.

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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by Koitsukai » Mon Jan 29, 2024 10:56 am

Goku is a great agent of chaos, like the I Didn't Do It kid from that Krusty episode. He shows up and things tend to get even worse, although he usually makes up for it.

But I can understand people wanting somebody or something else being the motor of a conflict. Oh wait, we have that already in the form of Krilin, Vegeta, Gohan when he has too many pints of power. The entire cast is self destructive, Goku at least does so and then sticks around to fix the problem he created.
The other guys hardly ever clean up their own mess, Goku does that for them. However, the hate always goes to Goku.

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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by Zephyr » Mon Jan 29, 2024 12:05 pm

My preferred ending for Goku's arc is to become a martial arts master. He can't do that if he dies on Namek, because it's in the Cell and Boo arcs that we see him begin training others. So, I don't think Dragon Ball would have worked better if he died on Namek.
MasenkoHA wrote: Mon Jan 29, 2024 9:47 amHe wanted to have Cell at full strength to show the full extent of Gohan's power with a fair fight.

It wasn't bright, but it was very Goku. It's fighting series about characters wanting to test their strength. I think the sooner fans realize what kind of story Dragon Ball actually is the less upset they would be with half the plot developments that bother them.
It's always come across to me that he also was projecting his own interests onto Gohan, who just spent four years training with him, the most recent one being only with him.

And to be honest, the fact that Goku didn't know that Gohan was becoming a pacifist is somewhat on Gohan for never talking with his father during all of that time about this stuff.

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Re: Do you think Dragon Ball would have worked better if Goku died on Namek?

Post by MasenkoHA » Mon Jan 29, 2024 12:40 pm

Zephyr wrote: Mon Jan 29, 2024 12:05 pm My preferred ending for Goku's arc is to become a martial arts master. He can't do that if he dies on Namek, because it's in the Cell and Boo arcs that we see him begin training others. So, I don't think Dragon Ball would have worked better if he died on Namek.
This is why I think the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai and the Boo arc make for the best endings. In the former Goku is finally Tenkaichi, and will continue to train to become even stronger. In the latter he's taken his own pupil under his wing and will pass on everything he learned from Grandpa Gohan, Kame Sennin, Karin, Kami, and Kaio.

The Freeza and Cell arc are terrible endings, for both Goku and the story itself
It's always come across to me that he also was projecting his own interests onto Gohan, who just spent four years training with him, the most recent one being only with him.

And to be honest, the fact that Goku didn't know that Gohan was becoming a pacifist is somewhat on Gohan for never talking with his father during all of that time about this stuff.
Goku is totally that sports dad who doesn't get that his naturally athletic son would rather just play Xbox

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