Freeza shouldn’t have been a transforming villain

[Majin Buu]

Boo gets overwhelmed at several points by stronger opponents and has to resort to absorption to keep going, but regardless, his final defeat is because Goku throws a Genki Dama at him. As far as strategies go, that’s pretty basic.

It seems pretty basic when you ignore everything that went into said strategy (including the hiccups that complicated things).

That's like saying "Jackie Chun defeated Goku because he kicked him" and acting like that's all there is to it when in actuality:

1. Jackie Chun's kick hit harder than Goku's due to Chun having longer legs than Goku.

2. The match was technically a double knock-out.

3. Goku only lost because he couldn't fully say "I won it" with a smile before collapsing after being the first one to get up.

You're oversimplifying what actually happened for the sake of making a point (a point that isn't even holding up to scrutiny) and painting an inaccurate picture of these events in the process.

[MasenkoHA]

Fights in the later parts of Dragon Ball are flashy light shows where the winner is the one with the higher power level. I wouldn’t really call that “martial arts.” The fighting is too simplistic. There’s not really any sense that skill or strategy actually matter.

There's not enough strategy in these fights =/= its not martial arts. It's still martial arts.

And people way over exaggerate the usage of ki blast (which in the confines of Dragon Ball is still martial arts but whatever). Yes there is a lot of it from the Tenshinhan arc onwards but so many people make it sound like the fights are nothing but characters standing in one spot and firing ki beams at each other. The hand to hand combat never goes away at any point

I mean, sure, it’s technically martial arts in-universe. It’s just obvious that Toriyama didn’t put much thought into it beyond “the stronger character wins.” It’s all very basic. The characters all more or less fight the same.

I mean, fights in general are usually resolved by who's stronger. I'm not quite sure what you're expecting? And even then Vegeta's final downfall in his first battle with Goku involved Goku telling Gohan to look at the fake moon. Does that not count as strategy? Goku won his battle with Freeza because he dodged Freeza's flying death disk at the last second to slice Freeza in half. If that doesn't count as strategy it certainly isn't "the stronger character won"

The Gohan vs Super Perfect Cell fight while being a pretty straight forward beam war still had Vegeta intervening as a distraction to give Gohan an edge.

The Genki Dama against Majin Boo still involved Vegeta organizing to get everyone on earth to lend their ki to Goku and using a wish to restore Goku to full strength.


I'm just at a complete loss of what you're qualifying as strategy

[WittyUsername]

Alright, look, perhaps “strategy” wasn’t the best word to use. My initial point was only ever that being a “good fighter” doesn’t really matter in Dragon Ball, because more often than not, having a high power level trumps actual fighting skill. Freeza or Raditz not being “skilled fighters,” makes very little difference, because from our perspective, they fight about as well as every other character. My “martial arts” comment was meant to just be an offhand remark, not a serious analysis.

Anyway, I should probably leave before this thread gets any further off-topic.

[Cure Dragon 255]

Alright, look, perhaps “strategy” wasn’t the best word to use. My initial point was only ever that being a “good fighter” doesn’t really matter in Dragon Ball, because more often than not, having a high power level trumps actual fighting skill. Freeza or Raditz not being “skilled fighters,” makes very little difference, because from our perspective, they fight about as well as every other character. My “martial arts” comment was meant to just be an offhand remark, not a serious analysis.

Anyway, I should probably leave before this thread gets any further off-topic.

There are bad martial artists you know?

[ABED]

Fights in the later parts of Dragon Ball are flashy light shows where the winner is the one with the higher power level. I wouldn’t really call that “martial arts.” The fighting is too simplistic. There’s not really any sense that skill or strategy actually matter.

This isn't true. Buu was stronger than anyone he comes up against, and while Gohan was stronger than Cell, Gohan's shattered arm put him at a severe disadvantage. The heroes usually won due to a numbers game, and yes, a strategy. And whether you call it martial arts or not, it is.

Boo gets overwhelmed at several points by stronger opponents and has to resort to absorption to keep going, but regardless, his final defeat is because Goku throws a Genki Dama at him. As far as strategies go, that’s pretty basic.

He has to top them after they get some transformation or skill set. It's one-upmanship but he is by and large stronger than his opponents.

The Genki Dama isn't a basic strategy. It's simple but it's not easy. It requires time to gather all that energy, meanwhile leaving Goku vulnerable. It also required Vegeta to come up with the plan, Kaio to telepathically broadcast the message, the Namekians to gather the DBs and make the wish, EVERYONE to give up their energy, Mr. Satan to get normal people to get involved, and Vegeta to come up with the idea to wish back Goku's ki so he can kill Buu once and for all.