Kai Part 5 Discussion Thread

[TheMajinRedComet]

Is anybody s box art really a really gross lime color, similar to the GT sets? It not just the box art ether, its all the yellow text and stuff! I think I might send it back to Amazon.

[ohaimynameiserik]

Is anybody s box art really a really gross lime color, similar to the GT sets? It not just the box art ether, its all the yellow text and stuff! I think I might send it back to Amazon.

Well the sidebar is yellow with a faint green tint to it... is that what you mean?

[TheMajinRedComet]

It does not look yellow at all, thats why I am confused maybe its just my eyes, I have to check the copies at the store tomorrow.

[Metalwario64]

It does not look yellow at all, thats why I am confused maybe its just my eyes, I have to check the copies at the store tomorrow.

snip]

Maybe it's your lighting?

[TheMajinRedComet]

At this point I am just going to wait and see, Either way it is not a big deal. I am just happy I got Big Bang Attack in the English Dub.

[Fionordequester]

You know, that quote in your sig by Chris Sabat, "Remember, when things get weird, skip the last Saga", where was that from? I'd like to see the whole conversation where that came up, as he was presumably talking about Dragon Ball Z, and anime in general.

[Kendamu]

So, did FUNi mix the Kikuchi tunes differently on their Kai release or something or is it just the same stuff I'm hearing on the TV episodes where they'll just play an entire track all the way through, wait a few seconds, and then start a new track?

It's the same score. For some reason though it's mixed real well with the Trunks and beginning of the Android stuff, but once 17 and 18 show up it noticabely goes downhill.

Well, that's lame. I figured that with all the "with Toei's blessing" going on that I could at least get a decent mix out of it.

I really want to like this still, but I can't bring myself to do it.

[ohaimynameiserik]

Well, that's lame. I figured that with all the "with Toei's blessing" going on that I could at least get a decent mix out of it.

I really want to like this still, but I can't bring myself to do it.

I dunno if it's this thread I said it before in, but all they're doing except for very rare instances is just picking a Kikuchi track that may vaguely resemble the Yamamoto piece that is originally there, slapping it on, then calling it a day.

[Gozar]

You know, that quote in your sig by Chris Sabat, "Remember, when things get weird, skip the last Saga", where was that from? I'd like to see the whole conversation where that came up, as he was presumably talking about Dragon Ball Z, and anime in general.

It was from the commentary track on the final Episode of Yu Yu Hakusho. He was referring to Kuwabara's role (Or lack of) in the final arc.

[Fionordequester]

I see. I agree that things got a little weird during the last arc (although I still prefer it to the sheer absurdity and stupidity of Sensui's character), but it wasn't that bad, was it?

In any case, where is the commentary track included? Is it in the Blu-ray releases or in some of the regular DVD's?

[TheMajinRedComet]

We don't know if its going to be on the Blu-ray yet, but it was on the last volume of the first DVD release. It's a great commentary.

[MetalMadness]

Could someone who understands copyright laws a bit explain to me how Yamamato did was exactly wrong, in the sense of the law. Sure, it may have been morally wrong, but I just don't see how it was illegal. It's not like he literally went and took tracks from other movies, and used them as his own. He composed similar sounding tracks, with his own little twists to them, and how is that illegal? Isn't one free to perform whatever music they like?

[ohaimynameiserik]

It's not like he literally went and took tracks from other movies, and used them as his own.

You sure about that? He might as well have. They are the exact same compositions right down to almost the finest detail. Had he even tried to alter them in any way then we probably wouldn't even be in this mess.

There is no credit or compensation or even mention of the original composer at all, and Yamamoto was going to pass it off as his own work. Which it wasn't. And the guy was paid for it. That's why it's illegal.

[Cipher]

It's the equivalent of someone taking a novel you wrote, changing a few words and character names, and then publishing it to sell on stands right by your original version. It's lifting your creative property to take away profits you should be getting. It's the very reason intellectual properties have copyrights.

[xzero]

Could someone who understands copyright laws a bit explain to me how Yamamato did was exactly wrong, in the sense of the law. Sure, it may have been morally wrong, but I just don't see how it was illegal. It's not like he literally went and took tracks from other movies, and used them as his own. He composed similar sounding tracks, with his own little twists to them, and how is that illegal? Isn't one free to perform whatever music they like?

International copyright law isn't my area of legal knowledge, but I'm reasonably well versed in American copyright law (which, in a lot of ways, is similar to international copyright law).

Under federal law, copyright protection is provided for "original works of authorship fixed in any tangible medium of expression." To show that someone infringed on your copyright, you must demonstrate that:
(1) you hold a valid copyright in the work,
(2) the defendant copied your work, and
(3) the defendant's copying amounted to an "improper appropriation."

To prove that defendant copied the work, you have to show the defendant had access to the work and that the work is similar enough to demonstrate copying. This was difficult before the age of the internet, as you might imagine. Now, everyone essentially has access to almost any given work, and similarity is fairly easy to establish, especially here.

A significant defense in copyright law is the "fair use" doctrine. Courts evaluating fair use utilize a factors test, evaluating (i) the use's purpose and character, (ii) the nature of the copyrighted work, (iii) the amount of the work used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole (like, is 1% used vs. 70%), and (iv) the effecct of the use on the potential market for the copyrighted work. Some courts will also look at stuff like defendant's intent and the First Amendment's free speech protections.

Fair use is primarily designed to protect "transformative works." The best example of this, and the one referenced regularly in first year law school property classes, is Weird Al. Al, as a matter of professional courtesy, gets permission to parody every song he does. But he doesn't need to. If you listen to his new take on Lady Gaga's "Born this Way" called "Perform this Way," you'll notice that it uses pretty much the entire tune, but changes the lyrics into something funny and satirical. That is the poster child for transformative works.

So let's apply this to Yamamoto. We know without any question that the artists he "ripped off" have valid copyrights in their respective countries for their works. Yamamoto would have had access to the music through YouTube or Japanese equivalents. Similarity has been discussed at length on this forum and in Mike's in-depth discussion of the topic, so let's just say that it's pretty darn similar. But is it transformative such that it constitutes fair use? Honestly, probably not, but the argument could be made if you compare the tracks that he is taking only fundamental parts of them and giving everything his own unique arrangement.

The biggest problem is profiting from misappropriation of the copyrighted work. If anyone here is a video game music fan, you're probably familiar with OC Remix and similar sites like that. They have literally thousands of free arrangements of video game music on their website, some of which sticks really close to the source material. But no one is ever going to challenge them on it because it is transformative of the source material and, more importantly, because they don't sell the music. Arrangements, remixes, etc. are one thing. Selling and profiting is another.

Whether you attribute the work to the original author is irrelevant, by the way, except to the extent that it is considered as a factor in the fair use analysis.

[Budogenkai]

Am I the only one that thinks the ending song sounds better in English?

[GotenDaisuki]

Am I the only one that thinks the ending song sounds better in English?

I'm not a big fan of the English Version. Just like "Yeah! Break! Care! Break!" I prefer the Japanese version of the song much more than the English version. I don't like the English lyrics. That's one of the main problems I have with the English version.

[xzero]

Am I the only one that thinks the ending song sounds better in English?

I tend to agree with you. The first time I heard the song was in the dub when my set 5 came a couple of weeks ago. After listening to it once, I felt it was kind of "meh." Then, after hearing it about 3 more times, I decided that I actually really liked it. I then went searching on YouTube for the full Japanese version, and I'm really not impressed with that version.

For "Yeah! Break! Care! Break!" I don't have a preference either way. For "Dragon Soul," I prefer the Japanese version over every dub version except Vic's. But the new ending is, in my opinion, a lot better in English.

[DragonBoxZTheMovies]

Trailer for Part 6:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZpJHv1w2ic

[PuppetDoctor]

Thanks for posting the link to the trailer.

I thought the trailer was really good and I liked the track that played in the background. That was actually my first time hearing Daemon Clarke as Cell (I haven't watched the latest episode yet).