Crazy Dragonball Z theories that you've heard?

[DBZGTKOSDH]

But there's a difference in using a technique which puts massive strain on a persons body and a transformation that puts strain on someones body. Goku can increase his powerlevel by 50x with the use of SSJ because it fundamentally changes the body to cope with that power increase, hence, it being a transformation as it alters his body. Kaioken is strictly called a technique because while it increases Goku's stats it doesn't alter his body to cope with the strain of the power increase, this is why he needs to train in order to overcome Kaioken's disavantages. Strictly speaking from my point of view SSJ does cause strain on Goku's body, however small, and with the increased strain of the Kaioken technique on top of that I would think Goku's body wouldn't cope. SSJ alters his body so we don't really know of the effects another massive increase from Kaioken technique would do to his body.

That's why he used it for only one hit. He could use it for only a moment in SSJ, which proves that Super Kaio-ken is too much for Goku's body.

While Cell does have a SSJ2 aura that could be down to the substantial energy that flows from his body, I've always looked at aura's from the analogy that they are like water coming from a hose pipe, a person who can freely release their energy will have a less tempered aura, much in the same way that the more room for the water to escape from the hose pipe the less pressure is exerted so it would trickle out rather than blast out. I also adopted this analogy when characters power up because they don't always make the planet shake so they must be able to release their energy from their body much easier than the last time they did it. This would also be the reason why the characters powering up don't just destroy the planet because the characters at the end of DBZ have much more power than Nappa, for instance, who also made the planet shake. Also I don't see how a Zenkai would lead to Cell unlocking a transformation, we know that SSJ and SSJ2 need rage as a catalyst. I doubt Cell, while floating in otherworld as a small nucleus, would be mad because as a nucleus he wouldn't have the capacity for such mental thought processes.

That's why I said he was "something" like a SSJ2. While not exactly SSJ2, it's a Cell-mutated SSJ2. At least that's what I think.

I'm not saying Super Buu is weaker than Goku either, I'm saying that if Gotenks had injured Super Buu in his base I would believe he's stronger than SSJ3 Goku, but he doesn't. If Gotenks is a half or even a quarter of SSJ3 Goku's strength then the SSJ multiplier would be enough to allow him to hurt Super Buu because he'd be much much stronger than SSJ3 Goku.

^This. Base Gotenks was nothing for Evil Boo, I can't believe that SSJ3 Goku is so much weak. Unless someone could post proper evidence for this to make up my mind.

[Hitiro]

That's why he used it for only one hit. He could use it for only a moment in SSJ, which proves that Super Kaio-ken is too much for Goku's body.

From my personal point of view I very much doubt he could even pull it off without actually blowing himself up. But its all down to peoples own point of view, the fact that somebody says it exists just because it's in the anime filler though is not a valid argument, this is what I was pointing at in the OP. People can argue about whether Goku could pull it of all day and give many theories as to how it is or isn't possible but saying "It's possible because it's in the anime" isn't a theory or an argument worthy of noting.

[Bussani]

Base Gotenks was nothing for Evil Boo, I can't believe that SSJ3 Goku is so much weak. Unless someone could post proper evidence for this to make up my mind.

Goku said that he and Vegeta would be killed if they tried to fight Super Buu, and he had no reason to hide the fact that he had Super Saiyan 3 up his sleeve at that point since Vegeta had already called him out on it. Base Gotenks also wasn't a match for Super Buu, but Super Buu could be so much stronger that there's room for base Gotenks to be above Super Saiyan 3 Goku. But it isn't necessary, just a possibility that people may or may not believe.

Trunks thought Gotenks had powered up enough to fight Buu in his regular form, at least, which would probably put him somewhere close to Super Saiyan 3 Goku in the least. But a) we don't know which Buu he meant, and b) Trunks may have been overestimating or exaggerating.

[Hitiro]

Base Gotenks was nothing for Evil Boo, I can't believe that SSJ3 Goku is so much weak. Unless someone could post proper evidence for this to make up my mind.

Goku said that he and Vegeta would be killed if they tried to fight Super Buu, and he had no reason to hide the fact that he had Super Saiyan 3 up his sleeve at that point since Vegeta had already called him out on it. Base Gotenks also wasn't a match for Super Buu, but Super Buu could be so much stronger that there's room for base Gotenks to be above Super Saiyan 3 Goku. But it isn't necessary, just a possibility that people may or may not believe.

Trunks thought Gotenks had powered up enough to fight Buu in his regular form, at least, which would probably put him somewhere close to Super Saiyan 3 Goku in the least. But a) we don't know which Buu he meant, and b) Trunks may have been overestimating or exaggerating.

But Goku also said to Piccolo he probably couldn't beat Fat Buu yet in the end he says he could and he was fighting pretty evenly against Kid Buu in the end so I think Goku is a bit too modest with how much strength he has. If anything Goku probably said that they couldn't take Super Buu to spare Vegeta's feelings and pride, even though Vegeta says he knows about SSJ3. Even when Goku was fighting against Kid Buu he asks Vegeta for a few more minutes of fighting with Kid Buu and Vegeta points it out straight away that Goku didn't intend to give him a chance at fighting Kid Buu because he knew Vegeta wouldn't stand a chance. He even tries to deny that Vegeta wouldn't stand a chance for a second before coming straight out with the fact that Vegeta has no chance.

[Bussani]

All of that's possible, but at the same time doesn't exactly disprove the other possibilities.

[Hitiro]

All of that's possible, but at the same time doesn't exactly disprove the other possibilities.

There is one thing that can disprove the other possibilities and that's the fact that strength checker clearly states that while Super Buu changed into Kid Buu it makes no mentions of his power shrinking, only his size.

Chapter: 508 (DBZ 314), P3.4-6
Context: after Boo reverts to his pure form
Goku: “…”
Vegeta: “……Heh…Heheheh…Look! He’s shrunk down quite a bit!”
Goku: “We did it! This way, we might be able to manage something.”
Context: ‘He’s shrunk’ refers to Boo’s body, not his ki.

And considering Super Buu is Evil Buu with Good Buu absorbed then the Good Buu should technically weaken Evil Buu because he technically is Dai Kaioshin, the reason why Buu weakened in the first place, so removing Good Buu would allow Super Buu to regain all is original strength, hence, Kid Buu(the original form).

[dbgtFO]

Goku's comment is the important one.
While before he said they'd stand no chance, now he's confident that they might manage something, saying "We did it."
When you realize that Goku and Vegeta's plan with Buu was to either return him to the first one or make his power fall below his Super incarnation, it's not hard to figure out what "We did it" referred to.

[Senzu_Bean]

Enough with the Buu talk already. Everybody know it can go either way by now.

Anyway, Kuririn doesn't have nose/nostrils and Nyoibo connects the Heavenly Realm to the "lower" world.

[Hitiro]

Goku's comment is the important one.
While before he said they'd stand no chance, now he's confident that they might manage something, saying "We did it."
When you realize that Goku and Vegeta's plan with Buu was to either return him to the first one or make his power fall below his Super incarnation, it's not hard to figure out what "We did it" referred to.

Are you saying "We did it." refers to them decreasing Buu's power? Or that they achieved their plan of making Buu change, also Vegeta and Goku don't even know what Super Buu looked like before he absorbed Fat Buu as Goku was off to otherworld and Vegeta was dead. To me "We did it." could just mean they succeeded in changing him, they also probably don't know the full extent of Kid Buu's power because the previous incarnations had the ability to hide their power so why shouldn't he?

[Piccolo Daimao]

Anyway, Kuririn doesn't have nose/nostrils and Nyoibo connects the Heavenly Realm to the "lower" world.

Those aren't crazy theories; they're facts. Kuririn lacking a nose is even made a point of at the 21st Tenka'ichi Budokai, when Kuririn is getting beat up by Bacterian because of his smell. But when Goku reminds him that the smell's all in his head because he's got no nose, he immediately jumps up and easily defeats him. And I do think that the Nyoibo connecting the Heavenly Realm to the lower world is mentioned in an official guidebook.

[Bussani]

There is one thing that can disprove the other possibilities and that's the fact that strength checker clearly states that while Super Buu changed into Kid Buu it makes no mentions of his power shrinking, only his size.

Not stating something doesn't exactly disprove anything either.

[Silver Sinspawn]

Now, this may not be a fan theory, but I've heard Jeice and Salza are from the same planet. I'm pretty sure it's in the Daizenshuu though. A little help on this would be appreciated.

[Kaboom]

Now, this may not be a fan theory, but I've heard Jeice and Salza are from the same planet. I'm pretty sure it's in the Daizenshuu though. A little help on this would be appreciated.

I'm not sure if they're of the same exact race, but they're at least from the same solar system. This wasn't from one of the Daizenshuu, but apparently from an old issue of Jump. Here's an old thread about it, and I think this more recent thread has scans of the article in question.

[Ussj Future Trunks]

My theory that the Original LSSJ is actually a time travelling Trunks.

Which would be impossible unless changes to canon were made.

so bardock being ssj isnt possible? then why was it written? time travel makes a lot of things possible.

[dbgtFO]

Are you saying "We did it." refers to them decreasing Buu's power? Or that they achieved their plan of making Buu change, also Vegeta and Goku don't even know what Super Buu looked like before he absorbed Fat Buu as Goku was off to otherworld and Vegeta was dead. To me "We did it." could just mean they succeeded in changing him, they also probably don't know the full extent of Kid Buu's power because the previous incarnations had the ability to hide their power so why shouldn't he?

The former. They didn't end up changing Buu to the original one(Fat Buu) afterall.

Like Piccolo Daimao said Krillin having no nose is a fact, but after that point it didn't seem like it could stop him from bleeding from it and apparently being capable of smelling...

[Silkman3003]

What about the "Gohan can only go Ssj2 if he has a rage boost" theory? You know, the people who say that Gohan can only go Ssj2 if he get's really angry.

I've seen this theory pop up when people would try to prove that Gohan didn't go Ssj2 against Dabura or Fatbuu.

[Bussani]

so bardock being ssj isnt possible? then why was it written?

What does Bardock being a Super Saiyan have to do with anything? And even if it didn't make sense, that's no worse than practically every Dragon Ball movie.

time travel makes a lot of things possible.

Wouldn't Trunks going back in time just create a new timeline where he was the original Super Saiyan? But then, who was the original Super Saiyan in his timeline?

[Saiga]

My theory that the Original LSSJ is actually a time travelling Trunks.

Which would be impossible unless changes to canon were made.

so bardock being ssj isnt possible? then why was it written? time travel makes a lot of things possible.

Trunk's time travel doesn't work that way, though.

[FNF]

-Base Gotenks > SSJ3 Goku.

That's perfectly legit actually.

You know Gotenks loses against Fat buu in his Base form, right?

There are many statements that basically say that base Gotenks (post RoSaT)>>SSjin Gotenks (pre RoSaT) who should be in the same realm of power as SSjin3 Goku.

You have Trunks saying Gotenks while still in base should be able to fight evenly with a Boo who was >>> Fat Boo(note that Goten doesn't correct him like he does with Trunks when he says that Gotenks was stronger than Gohan) and you have Piccolo then thinking base Gotenks could actually win against Evil Boo after he was wishing for a 'miracle' to happen for Gotenks to beat Boo.

People can dismiss it as a gag if they want but then you would have to dismiss every power statement made in the 1st arcs in Dragonball.
The whole point of the gag was to show that no matter how much stronger Gotenks had become, he was still no match for Boo until he went SSjin and then SSjin3.

There is also a title page which, imo, alludes to base Gotenks and Evil Boo being treated as the 2 strongest fighters in the universe. It says in a rhetorical manner;

"Will the greatest in the universe be decided?!!!"


Besides, I wouldn't get hung up on it numerically. AT ditched the power level system as it limited his abilities to make creative fights (I'm pretty sure) so there's no point saying 'that's impossible because that makes Gotenks waaaaaaaaa~y too strong compared to Goku'. He was just working from an 'A>B>C' pov.

[Hellspawn28]

I remember people always believe that General Rildo was stronger then Vegito because Goku said that he was stronger then Buu. Goku never said which form of Buu, my guess would be Kid Buu since Kid Buu was the last form of Buu that Goku fought. General Rildo never seem to do anything that great, I think Buuhan or SSj Vegito could beat him just fine.