Toriyama's racial/ist character portrayals?

[DarkPrince_92]

If putting thick lips on a character is racist, then African American comedian Billy Cosby, and all of the African Americans who watched and enjoyed his cartoons must be racist because his cartoon characters have lips bigger than Mr Popo

I don't think it's the same thing in this case. Not like we had a bunch of black animators at that time. Who made the final decision on those designs?

[jcogginsa]

From what I hear, Fat Albert and his group ARE considered racist designs.

[UpFromTheSkies]

If putting thick lips on a character is racist, then African American comedian Billy Cosby, and all of the African Americans who watched and enjoyed his cartoons must be racist because his cartoon characters have lips bigger than Mr Popo

I don't think it's the same thing in this case. Not like we had a bunch of black animators at that time. Who made the final decision on those designs?

It was made by Bill Cosby, an African American.

Here's a modern cartoon made by modern African Americans with lips bigger than Popo



Are they racist too?

[MCDaveG]

Well, all animated african americans are racist man, stop trying!
African Americans shouldn't be animated, like ever, lol!



On the right note, this is starting to be really rudiculous and that's what is wrong with people nowadays!
What would be really racist? If Mr. Popo, who is cool and strong character, was dressed in boilersuit, harvesting cotton.
And now, eat me! There is nothing racist in Toriyama's portrayals, only oversensitive pseudohumanist people are making issues where there is none.
I think that policemen shooting african-americans on street for nothing is problem, not races depicted with their facial features with non-offensive traits.

And nobody has trouble with John Stewart from DC Comics? He has lips bigger than Superman's fist. How come?

[rereboy]

only oversensitive pseudohumanist people are making issues where there is none.

In a nutshell.

[jjgp1112]

You haven't proven anything, MCDave. The racist black character portrayal is a very specific appearance that Toriyama's black characters typically have: Excessively dark skin, bugged out eyes, bulging, red lips like a baboon attached its ass to the person's face. The Green lantern example isn't racist. The ones that explicitly reference minstrel show blackface definitely are.

[TheGmGoken]

And nobody has trouble with John Stewart from DC Comics? He has lips bigger than Superman's fist. How come?

I don't care for the topic. But no he..doesn't...

[UpFromTheSkies]

You haven't proven anything, MCDave. The racist black character portrayal is a very specific appearance that Toriyama's black characters typically have: Excessively dark skin, bugged out eyes, bulging, red lips like a baboon attached its ass to the person's face. The Green lantern example isn't racist. The ones that explicitly reference minstrel show blackface definitely are.

The only character with round eyes is Popo, none of them have bulging lips that cover half of their face like the racist caricatures, and as for the skin color, there actually are dark skinned black people, and there is nothing wrong with dark skin

[jjgp1112]

You still haven't actually proven anything. It's a combination of dark skin and red lips applied to a broad spectrum of African-descending people to essentially say "All black people are dark and have huge lips that are meant to be mocked." I'm failing to grasp why this is so difficult for you to understand.

Regardless, I'm done with this discussion. I'd suggest looking up a thing or two about blackface, minstrel shows, and sambos.

[UpFromTheSkies]

You still haven't actually proven anything. It's a combination of dark skin and red lips applied to a broad spectrum of African-descending people to essentially say "All black people are dark and have huge lips that are meant to be mocked." I'm failing to grasp why this is so difficult for you to understand.

Regardless, I'm done with this discussion. I'd suggest looking up a thing or two about blackface, minstrel shows, and sambos.

Not all of the black characters in Dragon Ball have dark skin, and I don't think their lips are "huge", they look normal to me.

This is over sized

Spoiler:

This is normal looking

Spoiler:

[Big Momma]

IMO, the intent is more important than the actual result. Mr. Popo is undeniably an example of blackface. Is it offensive? For a lot of people, yes. But is it racist? Ehhh...I really don't think so. I doubt Toriyama had any ill will when he designed Mr. Popo.



Or maybe he did. Who knows?

[jcogginsa]

I think a big part of this is that, at the time, Japan had few examples of nonracist depictions of black people to draw from.

[jjgp1112]

IMO, the intent is more important than the actual result. Mr. Popo is undeniably an example of blackface. Is it offensive? For a lot of people, yes. But is it racist? Ehhh...I really don't think so. I doubt Toriyama had any ill will when he designed Mr. Popo.



Or maybe he did. Who knows?

That's ultimately what I was trying to say. Toriyama's intent is up for debate, but the simple fact is it's based on a racial stereotype.

[The Monkey King]

What I will say on such a sensitive subject is as a black person myself I actually like Commander Black as a villain. He is understandably outraged when he found out that Commander Red has sent many men to their death to collect the Dragon Balls just so he could wish to grow taller, promptly shoots him and appoints himself the head of the RRA.

He does the whole cliche' 'We can rule toghether' shtick with the hero but even offers to use the Dragon Ball to ressurect Upa's dad showing that he is a pretty reasonable guy.
He even doesn't get completely humiliated when he challenges Goku to a H2H fight.

Although his lips may be a little big, his overall design is not offensive in the slightest donning a simple professional suit. I honestly don't think a hint of racial malice went into his conception.

Yeah he ultimately is defeated like every other villain, but you can't really help that.

[Polyphase Avatron]

I never saw Mr. Popo as a black person, I always thought he was some kind of genie back when I watched the show on Toonami.

[Vegitofaxx]

I highly doubt that when Toriyama designed Popo, he thought to himself: "I hate black people, and wanna mock them with this character, who isn't even human"

[jcogginsa]

I highly doubt that when Toriyama designed Popo, he thought to himself: "I hate black people, and wanna mock them with this character, who isn't even human"

True, but that doesn't mean he wasn't influenced by racist images

[Vegitofaxx]

I highly doubt that when Toriyama designed Popo, he thought to himself: "I hate black people, and wanna mock them with this character, who isn't even human"

True, but that doesn't mean he wasn't influenced by racist images

In the end I think it came down to; "This looks fun and goofy, I'll make the character look like that"

[jcogginsa]

I highly doubt that when Toriyama designed Popo, he thought to himself: "I hate black people, and wanna mock them with this character, who isn't even human"

True, but that doesn't mean he wasn't influenced by racist images

In the end I think it came down to; "This looks fun and goofy, I'll make the character look like that"

And if a Two year old hears his dad say the N-Word, and repeats it because he thinks it sounds funny, does that make the N Word not racist?

[Metalwario64]

You're... seriously saying that if a 2 year old says a "racist word", without understanding it, then said kid is a racist?