Death Battle: Goku vs Superman 2

[rereboy]

1) When I say "dampening", I mean "nullifying". Or rather, I think Goku was trying to nullify the shockwaves and the fact that the denizens of Earth still feel something going on is because he either wasn't executing this technique correctly, or he was and there's just a limit to how much you can nullify the shockwaves of the God of Destruction.

2) Is your question "What already existing in the series is this hypothetical SIF-like technique based on, such that it isn't just some new thing completely out of the blue?" Because I can answer that.

3) I can share and expand on my pet theory. It's one of the things I enjoy about participating on this forum. I'd love to do so. But the last time I tried to explain one of my interpretations, I got burned for it. Is it going to be a waste of my time to do so now? Should I even bother?

1) Like I said, there's a difference between nullifying (or trying to nullify) them, and simply numbing them for a while until they reach their full force again once they are very far from the Earth. What I stated is that it simply doesn't make sense for Goku to do, or try to do, this numbing instead of actual nullification, nor it does it it make sense for it randomly happen.

2) What I tried to state was that there are different degrees for things that don't make sense in fiction. We all know that magic doesn't make sense according to the real world, but in stuff like Harry Potter, because its a fundamental assumption of the premise, we simply accept it. Does that mean that regarding everything else in Harry Potter we have no claim or right to point out inconsistencies or things that don't make sense since some stuff is already like that from the premise? Of course we can because, even though we accept these fundamental changes in the premise of the work of fiction regarding how things work and make sense, we also will want to have a sense of consistency, of inner logic of how things work inside that fictional universe. That's why your example of the Enterprise is not a good one, because it's part, or too closely related, to the things that we accept in the premise, like that there are functional starships that have somehow overcome all the logistic problems regarding human travel through space in such speeds.

3) The only thing I can tell is that you should only considered yourself "burned" if someone is actually insulting you.

[Tsufuru]

if superman is somesort of god than we accept infinity lifting becouse he would say fuck logic but he isnt.
in gokus case its pretty simple what they tryed to do.earth shouldnt supposed to be destroyed so they tryed to make sense of it by making goku somehow weaken the shockwave at the center but at the same time they wanted to show how strong it is.
it doesnt have to make 100% goku basicly "reppeled" the shockwave away from earth idk really.

and you can accept the feat becouse of the fact that the intention is clear.
bills can destroy the universe and it was said multiple times already before we got the proof.

you cant accept supermans feat becouse how obviouse it is than he does not have infinity strength.

[Polyphase Avatron]

People act like that's the only OTT thing Superman has ever done. There are a bunch of nonsense and crazy feats he has, and attempting to say they don't count because they make no sense while supporting a feat from another character that makes no sense either, just because you can come up with a fan theory to try to explain it, smacks of hypocrisy.

[Tsufuru]

People act like that's the only OTT thing Superman has ever done. There are a bunch of nonsense and crazy feats he has, and attempting to say they don't count because they make no sense while supporting a feat from another character that makes no sense either, just because you can come up with a fan theory to try to explain it, smacks of hypocrisy.

its not cuz they dont make sense.

its cuz why should some1 accept high ends ?

[Polyphase Avatron]

That goes both ways. I mean, honestly, this is totally subjective, so you can choose to 'accept' or 'reject' anything you like, but at least be consistent about it.

[Saiyan007]

People act like that's the only OTT thing Superman has ever done. There are a bunch of nonsense and crazy feats he has, and attempting to say they don't count because they make no sense while supporting a feat from another character that makes no sense either, just because you can come up with a fan theory to try to explain it, smacks of hypocrisy.

You don't understand if you can lift infinity you shouldn't lose ever to anyone at all

You can't supress infinite strength or gain higher than infinite strength

The feat is nonsense because it contradicts everything

[Polyphase Avatron]

People act like that's the only OTT thing Superman has ever done. There are a bunch of nonsense and crazy feats he has, and attempting to say they don't count because they make no sense while supporting a feat from another character that makes no sense either, just because you can come up with a fan theory to try to explain it, smacks of hypocrisy.

You don't understand if you can lift infinity you shouldn't lose ever to anyone at all

You can't supress infinite strength or gain higher than infinite strength

The feat is nonsense because it contradicts everything

Actually it is possible to beat infinity, if you have a higher cardinality.

[dbzfan7]

Superman does this impossible like all the time. Lifting infinity, holding black holes, hearing people from space. He's pretty much a god among men. His story ain't really about overcoming a powerful foe, the usual DB M.O., but more trying to do what's right with his great power.

[Soppa Saia People]

Superman does this impossible like all the time. Lifting infinity, holding black holes

WHAT ? That doesn't even make sense.(unless it's from the sliver age)

[Polyphase Avatron]

Very little in comics (or most anime/manga, for that matter) makes physical or scientific sense.

[voltlunok]

Superman does this impossible like all the time. Lifting infinity, holding black holes

WHAT ? That doesn't even make sense.(unless it's from the sliver age)

Nope. Post Crisis. Supes is and probably will always be genuinely OP.

You don't understand if you can lift infinity you shouldn't lose ever to anyone at all

You can't supress infinite strength or gain higher than infinite strength

The feat is nonsense because it contradicts everything

I love this kind of one way bias we have here...When we talk about Goku and Beerus' clash (Or any real questioning of Goku's feats.) our argument is "It doesn't have to make sense! It doesn't have to stick to science! It's fiction!" but when we talk about stuff superman does "That makes no sense! That's scientifically impossible! This shouldn't be counted!" You can't say superman's feats make no sense and contradict things when Goku has the same thing with his own feats. You can't say one party has to play by the rules while the other is free to play fast and loose with no rules at all.

Also you can suppress limitless strength, just like how Goku suppresses his monstrous strength on a daily basis so he doesn't crush his wife when he hugs her or breaks objects simply by touching them. Superman can do the same and he's done it for YEARS!

[fadeddreams5]

For anyone interested, here are some good reads on the subject...

Combat Speed of Dragon Ball Characters

How Fast are Dragon Ball Characters

Dbz Characters are FTL

My favorite, but not without its flaws, a super analysis of both characters:

Death Battle Erred: Goku vs Superman

Or, rather than reading all this bul*****, you could just m*********. If somebody's getting w***** around here, it might as well be you.

I'm still laughing at this. I miss Rocketman...

[voltlunok]

For anyone interested, here are some good reads on the subject...

Combat Speed of Dragon Ball Characters

How Fast are Dragon Ball Characters

Dbz Characters are FTL

My favorite, but not without its flaws, a super analysis of both characters:

Death Battle Erred: Goku vs Superman

Or, rather than reading all this bul*****, you could just m*********. If somebody's getting w***** around here, it might as well be you.

I'm still laughing at this. I miss Rocketman...

Oh that still cracks me up to this day.

[Polyphase Avatron]

What happened to him?

[Saiyan007]

I love this kind of one way bias we have here...When we talk about Goku and Beerus' clash (Or any real questioning of Goku's feats.) our argument is "It doesn't have to make sense! It doesn't have to stick to science! It's fiction!" but when we talk about stuff superman does "That makes no sense! That's scientifically impossible! This shouldn't be counted!" You can't say superman's feats make no sense and contradict things when Goku has the same thing with his own feats. You can't say one party has to play by the rules while the other is free to play fast and loose with no rules at all.

Also you can suppress limitless strength, just like how Goku suppresses his monstrous strength on a daily basis so he doesn't crush his wife when he hugs her or breaks objects simply by touching them. Superman can do the same and he's done it for YEARS!

You cannot suppress infinity .Goku's feat is quantifiable since they were going to destroy the universe.If someone is lifting an infinite amount that means they have infinite strength/durability/striking strength.

It's not bias becuase he doesn't have anything close to those kind of stats not to mention Doomsday killed so is doomsday above infinity?

Infinity will always be infinite no mater how much you suppress it or go above it hence why no one except an omnipotent(which Superman clearly isn't) could never have infinite power

[singsing]

I love this kind of one way bias we have here...When we talk about Goku and Beerus' clash (Or any real questioning of Goku's feats.) our argument is "It doesn't have to make sense! It doesn't have to stick to science! It's fiction!" but when we talk about stuff superman does "That makes no sense! That's scientifically impossible! This shouldn't be counted!" You can't say superman's feats make no sense and contradict things when Goku has the same thing with his own feats. You can't say one party has to play by the rules while the other is free to play fast and loose with no rules at all.

Also you can suppress limitless strength, just like how Goku suppresses his monstrous strength on a daily basis so he doesn't crush his wife when he hugs her or breaks objects simply by touching them. Superman can do the same and he's done it for YEARS!

You cannot suppress infinity .Goku's feat is quantifiable since they were going to destroy the universe.If someone is lifting an infinite amount that means they have infinite strength/durability/striking strength.

It's not bias becuase he doesn't have anything close to those kind of stats not to mention Doomsday killed so is doomsday above infinity?

Infinity will always be infinite no mater how much you suppress it or go above it hence why no one except an omnipotent(which Superman clearly isn't) could never have infinite power

Well, some infinities are larger than other infinities.

[pacz360]

I love this kind of one way bias we have here...When we talk about Goku and Beerus' clash (Or any real questioning of Goku's feats.) our argument is "It doesn't have to make sense! It doesn't have to stick to science! It's fiction!" but when we talk about stuff superman does "That makes no sense! That's scientifically impossible! This shouldn't be counted!" You can't say superman's feats make no sense and contradict things when Goku has the same thing with his own feats. You can't say one party has to play by the rules while the other is free to play fast and loose with no rules at all.

Also you can suppress limitless strength, just like how Goku suppresses his monstrous strength on a daily basis so he doesn't crush his wife when he hugs her or breaks objects simply by touching them. Superman can do the same and he's done it for YEARS!

You cannot suppress infinity .Goku's feat is quantifiable since they were going to destroy the universe.If someone is lifting an infinite amount that means they have infinite strength/durability/striking strength.

It's not bias becuase he doesn't have anything close to those kind of stats not to mention Doomsday killed so is doomsday above infinity?

Infinity will always be infinite no mater how much you suppress it or go above it hence why no one except an omnipotent(which Superman clearly isn't) could never have infinite power

Exactly Honestly this whole infinity feat was not just him captain marvel help him so does that mean he above infinty too? Plus if supes truly had infinte strength the enitre justice league would be useless and he wouldn't need them.supes has limits heck he stated that himself plus it would make going sundipped meaningless.

[voltlunok]

I love this kind of one way bias we have here...When we talk about Goku and Beerus' clash (Or any real questioning of Goku's feats.) our argument is "It doesn't have to make sense! It doesn't have to stick to science! It's fiction!" but when we talk about stuff superman does "That makes no sense! That's scientifically impossible! This shouldn't be counted!" You can't say superman's feats make no sense and contradict things when Goku has the same thing with his own feats. You can't say one party has to play by the rules while the other is free to play fast and loose with no rules at all.

Also you can suppress limitless strength, just like how Goku suppresses his monstrous strength on a daily basis so he doesn't crush his wife when he hugs her or breaks objects simply by touching them. Superman can do the same and he's done it for YEARS!

You cannot suppress infinity .Goku's feat is quantifiable since they were going to destroy the universe.If someone is lifting an infinite amount that means they have infinite strength/durability/striking strength.

It's not bias becuase he doesn't have anything close to those kind of stats not to mention Doomsday killed so is doomsday above infinity?

Infinity will always be infinite no mater how much you suppress it or go above it hence why no one except an omnipotent(which Superman clearly isn't) could never have infinite power

It absolutely is bias. You bring up doomsday but completely ignore the context of when doomsday killed superman because why not? If it allows us to say "GOKU WINS!" lets ignore all the context ever! Hell, deathbattle even addressed the very argument you're making! See?!

Goku's feat isn't quantifiable, it's BS. One with how Old Kai explains the event, it can't destroy the universe...at all. The energy grows stronger as it travels AWAY from Goku & Beerus so everything within a certain distance from them is not going to be destroyed because it's within the 'safe zone'. So it can't destroy the whole universe cause areas would survive! Two, Strength doesn't tie to durability, if that was the case then the term "Glass cannon" wouldn't exist. Hell if that's how durability works, how did Sorbet's ring pierce Goku if he has this universal god tier durability? Does that mean Sorbet is god tier? Does that mean Sorbet is stronger then Goku cause his ring pierced Goku's god tier durability?

Hell I'm questioning if this universal shockwave feat should even be counted since it's not present in the BoG movie (Which was rewritten and personally helmed by Toriyama!) and the BoG Adaptation in Super (Which we have little idea how much involvement he has with the writing and episode to episode production of the adaptation.) pretty much fits the definition of filler and we all have this lovely rule of "Filler doesn't count."! But I guess we'll let this one slide cause it has the chance to let Goku hurt superman right?

There is clearly a bias in favor of Goku cause you and a few others are actively trying to tear away Superman's higher tier feats while simultaneously saying Goku's feats "Don't need to make sense. It's fiction." and saying that Superman's don't make sense and shouldn't be considered. Again, you can't force one party to play by the rules while the other is allowed to run free from the rules. That's bias. But I guess having Goku win means more even if it is under a severe handicap.

I'm done. Just done...this topic is dead and all that's left is bias and grasping at straws. There isn't conversation left to be had, just arguments and shouting between bias parties.

So with that, I bid you adieu.

[Dbzk1999]

BoG Adaptation in Super (Which we have little idea how much involvement he has with the writing and episode to episode production of the adaptation.) pretty much fits the definition of filler

Uh, what? No, no it doesn't

[BrolyLSSJ]

People need to realize that screwattack simply hates Anime/DBZ in general. They were happy enough to do this whole Goku vs Supes battle just for the views and to troll DBZ fanboys. Even though Superman fanboys who where hating on Goku failed to realize that he is a better written character compared to Superman. Would have been ironic if while they were celebrating Goku's death Screw Attack had Superman prime one million fight against Masaki Tenchi. I mean would you rather want Goku to beat Superman or some high school japanese kid from a harem show that has a power of literal omnipotence and PIS powers like light hawk wings that can reduce all Attack and Defense to zero and can erase you completely from existence as he proceeds to blink all version's of superman out of existence without even lifting a finger? lol

Thought Robot > Tenchi Muyo!verse