Unpopular DB opinions

[Scsigs]

I agree, Faulconer certainly stands out more than Johnson and Menza . It's probably because that score makes its presence known during key scenes whilst the others just add background noise. Not a fan personally, but I certainly understand the appeal.

I'll give it this, though I don't give a shit to check out Z with his score, &, in fact, feel disgusted when I find clips of it online, Faulconer made some VERY memorable tracks. In Buu's Fury, they definitely picked out some gems to use for it.

[10gigtriforce]

Faulconer made some VERY memorable tracks. In Buu's Fury, they definitely picked out some gems to use for it.

It kinda makes sense. his tracks were used to revive the show from a what 2ish year hiatus on new episodes? They had to be used to help sell the series(both on tv and home release) from then on. with the score from the UUE, we were already gonna buy those so it didnt need as much work. Similar for GT. yeah a new series and all, but they really rode dbz's name to sell gt and to a lesser extent dragon ball. so they didnt have to put in as much effort there.

my $.02

[MasenkoHA]

Faulconer made some VERY memorable tracks. In Buu's Fury, they definitely picked out some gems to use for it.

It kinda makes sense. his tracks were used to revive the show from a what 2ish year hiatus on new episodes? They had to be used to help sell the series(both on tv and home release) from then on. with the score from the UUE, we were already gonna buy those so it didnt need as much work. Similar for GT. yeah a new series and all, but they really rode dbz's name to sell gt and to a lesser extent dragon ball. so they didnt have to put in as much effort there.

my $.02

It’s not like they had to revitalize some forgotten show that was off the air for two years. Once the show hit Toonami in late August 1998 the Captain Ginyu episodes were on home video the following April and on tv by that September. The show was doing gangbusters on Toonami as it was with the Saban era episodes there’s a reason the Funi cast started out directed to sound like the Ocean cast as much as possible. Faulconer’s music didn’t do anything it was just more replacement music in the vein of the Wasserman music (vague feeling of dark foreboding action with goofy hijinx music for the lighter scenes). Faulconer was probably hired because he was cheap and all the product was being made as cheap as possible. Money was not being thrown towards a quality score.

[Planetnamek]

Faulconer made some VERY memorable tracks. In Buu's Fury, they definitely picked out some gems to use for it.

It kinda makes sense. his tracks were used to revive the show from a what 2ish year hiatus on new episodes? They had to be used to help sell the series(both on tv and home release) from then on. with the score from the UUE, we were already gonna buy those so it didnt need as much work. Similar for GT. yeah a new series and all, but they really rode dbz's name to sell gt and to a lesser extent dragon ball. so they didnt have to put in as much effort there.

my $.02

It’s not like they had to revitalize some forgotten show that was off the air for two years. Once the show hit Toonami in late August 1998 the Captain Ginyu episodes were on home video the following April and on tv by that September. The show was doing gangbusters on Toonami as it was with the Saban era episodes there’s a reason the Funi cast started out directed to sound like the Ocean cast as much as possible. Faulconer’s music didn’t do anything it was just more replacement music in the vein of the Wasserman music (vague feeling of dark foreboding action with goofy hijinx music for the lighter scenes). Faulconer was probably hired because he was cheap and all the product was being made as cheap as possible. Money was not being thrown towards a quality score.

It certainly never sounded cheap to me, and cheap does not always mean bad, some of the greatest albums were recorded on a shoestring budget after all. To me it sounds significantly different then Saban's music as most of that just fades into the background like New Age music, whereas Faulconer's soundtrack has a very distinctive tone that sticks out for me way more.

[Scsigs]

It kinda makes sense. his tracks were used to revive the show from a what 2ish year hiatus on new episodes? They had to be used to help sell the series (both on tv and home release) from then on. with the score from the UUE, we were already gonna buy those so it didnt need as much work. Similar for GT. yeah a new series and all, but they really rode dbz's name to sell gt and to a lesser extent dragon ball. so they didnt have to put in as much effort there.

my $.02

That's REALLY misunderstanding what was going on in 1999 when they started dubbing the episodes again for Toonami. By then, there were over a year of reruns of the 53 episodes & 3 movies they'd already dubbed with Saban & Ocean. Cartoon Network gave them money to dub the series &, since FUNi was a smaller company at the time, they couldn't afford to license the Kikuchi score (4Kids also had this problem), but they also needed to maintain consistency with the previous replaced score Saban had made for the series, so they hired Faulconer to make it. CN didn't care how they dubbed it, as long as they dubbed it.
They also didn't NEED to sell it because it was already sold to them & was a ratings giant on Toonami.

[10gigtriforce]

they couldn't afford to license the Kikuchi

huh well toei sucks for not making the score part of the anime deal. explains some of the changes to super songs too

[Planetnamek]

It kinda makes sense. his tracks were used to revive the show from a what 2ish year hiatus on new episodes? They had to be used to help sell the series (both on tv and home release) from then on. with the score from the UUE, we were already gonna buy those so it didnt need as much work. Similar for GT. yeah a new series and all, but they really rode dbz's name to sell gt and to a lesser extent dragon ball. so they didnt have to put in as much effort there.

my $.02

That's REALLY misunderstanding what was going on in 1999 when they started dubbing the episodes again for Toonami. By then, there were over a year of reruns of the 53 episodes & 3 movies they'd already dubbed with Saban & Ocean. Cartoon Network gave them money to dub the series &, since FUNi was a smaller company at the time, they couldn't afford to license the Kikuchi score (4Kids also had this problem), but they also needed to maintain consistency with the previous replaced score Saban had made for the series, so they hired Faulconer to make it. CN didn't care how they dubbed it, as long as they dubbed it.
They also didn't NEED to sell it because it was already sold to them & was a ratings giant on Toonami.

I thought they could afford the Kikuchi score but they decided to make their own soundtrack so they could get royalties on it? That's what Gen said in an interview anyways(thanks to GreatSaiyaman for unearthing that fascinating gem of an interview for DBZU2).

[MasenkoHA]

The “Funimation couldn’t afford the Kikuchi score” is some bs myth that keeps getting spun around despite holding no water. They couldn’t afford it for Z but could afford it for Dragon Ball? How the hell does that work? Only Funimation and Westwood (that was continuing from the in house Funi dub) apparently had this problem. Ocean outsourced Dragon Ball and GT to their budget studio and they could keep the score?


ETA: Ninja’s by PlanetNamek but yes they just wanted to use their own score for Z and GT plain and simple.

[funrush]

Yeah affording Kikuchi had nothing to do with it, it was just common practice to edit anime and change the music because executives were afraid of it not appealing to American children if they didn't tinker with it first. They thought eerie sci-fi synths would hook kids more than oldschool brass band music.

[Scsigs]

I thought they could afford the Kikuchi score but they decided to make their own soundtrack so they could get royalties on it? That's what Gen said in an interview anyways(thanks to GreatSaiyaman for unearthing that fascinating gem of an interview for DBZU2).

Hmm...that seems like another likely explanation. Making your own soundtracks are always more cost effective & easy to monetize than licensing the original OST. It's why 4Kids changed the soundtracks too. I just thought it was because they didn't have much more money at the time after licensing the episodes. I mean, they needed to partner with Saban initially to get VAs to act in the series, so it's not THAT big of a stretch.

Explains some of the changes to super songs too

They dubbed some of the songs that had lyrics because they wanted to, not because they changed the songs to monetize or afford them. In fact, I think it costs more to get the license to record cover versions of the songs than license the originals, hence why they stopped dubbing One Piece's theme & ending songs, though it COULD also be the record labels or original artists not wanting them to do so as well.

[MasenkoHA]

. I mean, they needed to partner with Saban initially to get VAs to act in the series, so it's not THAT big of a stretch.

No, no they didn’t. Saban was their distributor to get it the show on tv. Their partnership with Ocean for the ADR work was a separate matter all together. Funimation was already working with its Vancouver based cast before they partnered with Saban when they dubbed the first thirteen episodes of the original Dragon Ball and first movie back in 95

[Scsigs]

No, no they didn’t. Saban was their distributor to get it the show on tv. Their partnership with Ocean for the ADR work was a separate matter all together. Funimation was already working with its Vancouver based cast before they partnered with Saban when they dubbed the first thirteen episodes of the original Dragon Ball and first movie back in 95

But, I thought that's why the censorship was mostly as it was. Saban were helping out with the production of the show, so they dictated how the show was changed to meet broadcast standards. It certainly adds up with them recasting every character's VA when they dubbed more episodes & they were less censored as a result. Saban's dubs of other anime & how Power Rangers adapted Super Sentai at the time adds to that, since they had similar censorships & dialogue changes.

[MasenkoHA]

No, no they didn’t. Saban was their distributor to get it the show on tv. Their partnership with Ocean for the ADR work was a separate matter all together. Funimation was already working with its Vancouver based cast before they partnered with Saban when they dubbed the first thirteen episodes of the original Dragon Ball and first movie back in 95

But, I thought that's why the censorship was mostly as it was. Saban were helping out with the production of the show, so they dictated how the show was changed to meet broadcast standards. It certainly adds up with them recasting every character's VA when they dubbed more episodes & they were less censored as a result. Saban's dubs of other anime & how Power Rangers adapted Super Sentai at the time adds to that, since they had similar censorships & dialogue changes.

Saban’s over the top restrictions was why those first two seasons were so heavily censored, yes. That has nothing to do with the voice acting. Two completely separate partnerships. Funimation just cut ties with both to have further control of the show (it also proved even cheaper to move production in-house)

Basically

Funimation- Licensed, produced, and wrote the dub. They also did the censorship and editing to Saban’s specifications.

Saban- Distributed the show on television told Funimation what they could and couldn’t do. Had some creative control but not near as much as people think (I believe Barry Watson said the other dimension stuff was Saban’s idea but the only specification was they couldn’t say die or kill). Also composed the replacement music via Ron Wasserman but this was Funimation’s idea to have a replacement score.

Ocean Group- Provided the ADR work and casting. I think they helped with the scripting to a point.

Pioneer- Distributed the episodes on home video also oversaw the dubbing of the first three movies working with Ocean Group.

Around 1998 Funimation cut ties with all 3 to handle everything themselves.

[WittyUsername]

On the subject of the Faulconer score, there are a fair amount of tracks that I would consider to be memorable, such as Time Chamber, Ginyu Transformation, Hell’s Bells, and the SSJ3 theme. Still, it’s hard to argue that the score doesn’t get exhausting with how it never shuts up.

[Planetnamek]

On the subject of the Faulconer score, there are a fair amount of tracks that I would consider to be memorable, such as Time Chamber, Ginyu Transformation, Hell’s Bells, and the SSJ3 theme. Still, it’s hard to argue that the score doesn’t get exhausting with how it never shuts up.

Honestly I never really noticed the lack of silence, I guess growing up with western cartoons kind of taught me to always expect music to be playing in animated shows. But for those who didn't I can understand how the relentless soundtrack can get annoying.

[MasenkoHA]

On the subject of the Faulconer score, there are a fair amount of tracks that I would consider to be memorable, such as Time Chamber, Ginyu Transformation, Hell’s Bells, and the SSJ3 theme. Still, it’s hard to argue that the score doesn’t get exhausting with how it never shuts up.

Honestly I never really noticed the lack of silence, I guess growing up with western cartoons kind of taught me to always expect music to be playing in animated shows. But for those who didn't I can understand how the relentless soundtrack can get annoying.

To be honest I never got that argument about wall to wall music either. My problem is I just don’t care or even like the Faulconer score. If it was good it wouldn’t be a big deal if it was wall to wall music. On the dubbers side of things I never got the “kids need wall to wall” argument on their side either. And this wasn’t something unique to Funimation. I seem to remember the Pokemon dub at least originally kept the Japanese music but filled scenes with no music with their own custom score. Was there focus groups on this?

I have way more grievance with the dub’s unwillingness to let the characters shut the fuck up for two seconds than I do the music. Rewatching the original Dragon Ball dub a couple years back and almost any scene where you cant see the characters mouths there would be talking and if you could see their faces and their mouths weren’t moving they would be thinking.

[Planetnamek]

On the subject of the Faulconer score, there are a fair amount of tracks that I would consider to be memorable, such as Time Chamber, Ginyu Transformation, Hell’s Bells, and the SSJ3 theme. Still, it’s hard to argue that the score doesn’t get exhausting with how it never shuts up.

Honestly I never really noticed the lack of silence, I guess growing up with western cartoons kind of taught me to always expect music to be playing in animated shows. But for those who didn't I can understand how the relentless soundtrack can get annoying.

To be honest I never got that argument about wall to wall music either. My problem is I just don’t care or even like the Faulconer score. If it was good it wouldn’t be a big deal if it was wall to wall music. On the dubbers side of things I never got the “kids need wall to wall” argument on their side either. And this wasn’t something unique to Funimation. I seem to remember the Pokemon dub at least originally kept the Japanese music but filled scenes with no music with their own custom score. Was there focus groups on this?

I have way more grievance with the dub’s unwillingness to let the characters shut the fuck up for two seconds than I do the music. Rewatching the original Dragon Ball dub a couple years back and almost any scene where you cant see the characters mouths there would be talking and if you could see their faces and their mouths weren’t moving they would be thinking.

I don't think kids need constant music either, but that's what the cartoons I grew up watching had so it didn't sound out of place to me when I saw DBZ.

I don't mind the added dialogue either, some of it quite amused me, particularly this bit:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnriaELk_pw

Adding music to dubs is a practice that predates DBZ by a decent amount, as Kiki's Delivery Service had music added for it's theatrical release in the U.S. in 1988.

[It_Is_Ayna_You_Flips]

As far as warrior races go, Saiyans are pretty boring. The one thing that made them interesting was their unapologetically chaotic evil nature but with that retconned... Saiyans don't have a cool language or interesting set of traditions or anything. I think they're one saving grace is that they're so bland that the audience can project whatever "warrior" image it wants onto them.

[ABED]

On the subject of the Faulconer score, there are a fair amount of tracks that I would consider to be memorable, such as Time Chamber, Ginyu Transformation, Hell’s Bells, and the SSJ3 theme. Still, it’s hard to argue that the score doesn’t get exhausting with how it never shuts up.

Honestly I never really noticed the lack of silence, I guess growing up with western cartoons kind of taught me to always expect music to be playing in animated shows. But for those who didn't I can understand how the relentless soundtrack can get annoying.

To be honest I never got that argument about wall to wall music either. My problem is I just don’t care or even like the Faulconer score. If it was good it wouldn’t be a big deal if it was wall to wall music. On the dubbers side of things I never got the “kids need wall to wall” argument on their side either. And this wasn’t something unique to Funimation. I seem to remember the Pokemon dub at least originally kept the Japanese music but filled scenes with no music with their own custom score. Was there focus groups on this?

I have way more grievance with the dub’s unwillingness to let the characters shut the fuck up for two seconds than I do the music. Rewatching the original Dragon Ball dub a couple years back and almost any scene where you cant see the characters mouths there would be talking and if you could see their faces and their mouths weren’t moving they would be thinking.

I never noticed these things until much later. As a kid the wall to wall music in kids shows was not something I would notice.

[Scsigs]

Anyone else really hate how people's arms were drawn when they folded them together in the Super anime? I'm someone who doesn't mind the artstyle of Super & I hate them. They're too angular & perfectly symmetrical, as well as conforming to the proportions of their torsos, which give off an uncanny valley feel.