DB/Older anime fans different from new anime fans?

Sebastian (SB) · Post by **Sebastian (SB)** » Thu Oct 01, 2009 5:23 pm

The only reason anyone would ever say Dragon Ball Z had the best dub ever was because that's what they grew up with in Toonami during the anime boom. Complaints of Nozawa's performance capabilities and music aside, that's really the main reason I hear most of the time. While I don't particularly blame them for feeling that way, it's absolutely hypocritical to chastise dubs by today standards while praising how great DBZ was "back in the day" in Toonami. Dubs, in general, have come a long way from the days of Speed Racer, G-Force/Gatchaman, Voltron, Macross, Sailor Moon, and DBZ. Most of today's dubs stay completely faithful to the source material, music, and/or dialogue. I think the idea of staying faithful to the original material came from the rise of digital fansubs and its availability over the internet. Now that the anime fanbase has become more self aware of preserving the original vision of most animes in general, there was really no reason for dubbing companies to change and alter any or most of the material to deem it suitable for kids and tweens alas DBZ and Sailor Moon.

Nowadays, most of the petty complaints I hear, are how some voices don't particularly fit or how some of the attack names are mispronounced. The fact that Ichigo says Zanpakuto, Bankai, or Getsuga Tensho (mispronounced or not) is a godsend compared to the days of Solar Flare, Special Beam Cannon, and the such. From someone who's had exposure to DBZ subs via VHS and other anime titles back in the mid to late 90s, it's laughable to think that such things are being grumbled about when the dubbing industry was MUCH worse 10-20 years back. But I suppose that's just human nature. So I just sit back and enjoy the ride.

penguintruth · Post by **penguintruth** » Thu Oct 01, 2009 5:29 pm

jda95 wrote:
penguintruth wrote:Huh. I thought Death Note had one of the best dubs of all time, especially compared to DBZ. It was probably Ocean's best work. Haruhi's dub wasn't that bad, either. I can't say I cared much for GL's, though.
.
Death Note was of course near the level of the original voices. Haruhi's dub was pretty excellent, but I had a real problem with the honorifics left in.

I don't recall honorifics being left in the Haruhi dub. It's been a while since I've watched my DVDs for it.

All I remember is that the subtitles were a little too big on those DVDs. Bandai does this now, gigantic subtitles. But that's a different topic altogether.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Thu Oct 01, 2009 5:29 pm

Sebastian (SB) wrote:compared to the days of Solar Flare

What's wrong with Solar Flare?

JulieYBM · Post by **JulieYBM** » Thu Oct 01, 2009 6:14 pm

Rocketman wrote:
Sebastian (SB) wrote:compared to the days of Solar Flare
What's wrong with Solar Flare?

The literal translation of Taiyô-ken is 'Sun Fist'. At that point, it's best to go the KameHame-Ha route and retain it's Japanese name.

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Thu Oct 01, 2009 7:33 pm

JulieYBM wrote:The literal translation of Taiyô-ken is 'Sun Fist'. At that point, it's best to go the KameHame-Ha route and retain it's Japanese name.

Bah! Solar Flare is perfectly fine for that.

And Kamehameha is Hawaiian.

Bussani · Post by **Bussani** » Thu Oct 01, 2009 8:58 pm

penguintruth wrote:I thought Death Note had one of the best dubs of all time

It was decent, but the guy who did Light's voice couldn't really capture his personality, I think. He was stuck in 'normal teenager Light' mode all the time, and never gave the impression that it was just a front. In the Japanese version, the change between Light talking to someone like a family member and talking to Ryuk is very noticeable.

Most anime fans these days haven't seen a real bad dub. Most of them today are pretty good, if a bit too generic at times.

MCDaveG · Post by **MCDaveG** » Fri Oct 02, 2009 4:09 pm

JulieYBM wrote:
Rocketman wrote:
Sebastian (SB) wrote:compared to the days of Solar Flare
What's wrong with Solar Flare?
The literal translation of Taiyô-ken is 'Sun Fist'. At that point, it's best to go the KameHame-Ha route and retain it's Japanese name.

"ken" is also word for "attack" rather than "fist".

Super Sonic · Post by **Super Sonic** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 2:27 pm

Will say, that desite names being different across the board, DB fans won't chastise you for it, and since they're so similar not raise a funk. Have had guys yell at me for saying "1000 years of Death" even though both English manga and dvd subs put that down there. But since fansubber couldn't tell Japanese words for "death" and "pain" apart, they take it as law, and say it should be the latter since it doesn't kill ya.

laserkid · Post by **laserkid** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 7:02 pm

I definitely get what you're saying. A friend of mine new to anime wanted to do a convention panel on terrible dubs, and asked for help.

I asked what he had...and he had listed Death Note, Naruto, and Cowboy Bebop.

I had to shake my head laughing before I showed him some of the old dubs I'd grown up with, it blew up his world.

Newer anime fans, assuming they aren't pirates, are spoiled by the availability and general quality of dubs, and view dubs that are good as "terrible" for not being exceptional. It's a little funny for an old time anime fan who've learned to put up with terrible fansubs, terrible dubs, and low availability. Anyone else remember hunting for VHS tapes in Suncoast's small anime section, finding a gem, and then learning it was really obnoxiously voiced? >.>

penguintruth · Post by **penguintruth** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 7:16 pm

He was probably trolling you if he said Cowboy Bebop had a horrible English dub. It's almost universally loved, even by the director of the series. On the off chance he actually disliked that dub, which I suppose could happen (hell, I dislike the FMA dub, and people seem to love that one), I doubt anyone would be delusional enough to include it in a panel for bad dubs, because they would know how popular it is.

SSJ2bardock · Post by **SSJ2bardock** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 8:22 pm

Metalwario64 wrote:
russ869 wrote:
The Time Traveller wrote:Most of the young anime fans of today always, always, ALWAYS say shit like "OMG this dub is terrible", they're usually talking about Death Note, Gurren Lagann, Haruhi, and will always at one point come out with "Dragon Ball Z had the most perfect anime dub ever."
Seriously?
Yes... Unfortunately...

Most young anime fans I've talked to think DBZ is stupid, I don't know what you're talking about...

Metalwario64 · Post by **Metalwario64** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 8:47 pm

SSJ2bardock wrote:Most young anime fans I've talked to think DBZ is stupid

Yes, from what I've seen they do think it's stupid. But they do think the dub was better than the Japanese version.

They always tend to say "I can't stand most dubs, but DBZEEEE's was better than the Japanese version where every1 wuz a gurl!!11"

laserkid · Post by **laserkid** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 10:54 pm

penguintruth wrote:He was probably trolling you if he said Cowboy Bebop had a horrible English dub. It's almost universally loved, even by the director of the series. On the off chance he actually disliked that dub, which I suppose could happen (hell, I dislike the FMA dub, and people seem to love that one), I doubt anyone would be delusional enough to include it in a panel for bad dubs, because they would know how popular it is.

The problem with this kid was he thinks all dubs are bad because it's not in Japanese, and yes he's very delusional. I included his extreme examples on purpose. Seriously, the younger generation of anime fans seem to have ridiculously high standards. If the VA doesn't sound EXACTLY like the Japanese voice actor, for some people that's an egregious sin for a dub.

That's not to say dub standards should be low, but man younger fans are idiots about what "terrible dubs" mean.

Olivier Hague · Post by **Olivier Hague** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 11:08 pm

penguintruth wrote:He was probably trolling you if he said Cowboy Bebop had a horrible English dub.

It might be good for an English dub, but really...

penguintruth · Post by **penguintruth** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 11:26 pm

Apparently not a lot of the newer fans have suffered through most Manga Entertainment dubs. Though, to be fair, Cyber City Oedo's dub was so bad it was good.

AnimeEigo's Bubblegum Crisis English dub, on the other hand, was just bad. But least it didn't deviate from the script like DBZ's, though.

Streamline dubs look good in comparison.

Sebastian (SB) · Post by **Sebastian (SB)** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 11:28 pm

Yeah, I get what you guys are saying. Attack name changes are not so much of a problem than dialogue inconsistencies that might contradict the source material. That's even worse, but luckily that wasn't much of problem with various video game localizations. Those are probably the only instances where I can tolerate the dubbing. I was always of the belief if your going to do a translation for the attacks, keep it rough or as close to the original naming as much as possible. Kamehameha wasn't derived of the famous Hawaiian King as many think. That's just a coincidence.

SparkyPantsMcGee · Post by **SparkyPantsMcGee** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 11:35 pm

I can't stand new anime fans for some reason(no offense to anyone here). It's like a totally different crowed now a days. Most of the fans are obnoxious and over the top tween girls as apposed to the smaller more "under ground" group I was used to in middle school and early high school. The kids who had sources on stuff like GT and etc. before it came out in America. Like, I had a friend who let me borrow his older brother's bootlegs of Cowboy Beebop and the Dragonball movies.

It could just be me though, I liked being part of what felt like a small group. Now you see people flaunting the messenger bags and other accessories(I'm looking at you kid in the Naruto Headband).

Another problem is I don't like most of the newer anime which could be why I'm not fond of the newer fans. A lot of shows have this plastic or candy look and feel and the stories feel bland too. I liked Death Note for awhile because it was something original but eventually I just got bored. I liked Bleach when it was called Yu-Yu-Hakusho(

) and I hate Naruto. I get so pissed when I talk to new fans and all I hear is "Death Note and Naruto are the best animes evvvvvvver!!!!"

Super Sonic · Post by **Super Sonic** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 11:47 pm

laserkid wrote:
penguintruth wrote:He was probably trolling you if he said Cowboy Bebop had a horrible English dub. It's almost universally loved, even by the director of the series. On the off chance he actually disliked that dub, which I suppose could happen (hell, I dislike the FMA dub, and people seem to love that one), I doubt anyone would be delusional enough to include it in a panel for bad dubs, because they would know how popular it is.
The problem with this kid was he thinks all dubs are bad because it's not in Japanese, and yes he's very delusional. I included his extreme examples on purpose. Seriously, the younger generation of anime fans seem to have ridiculously high standards. If the VA doesn't sound EXACTLY like the Japanese voice actor, for some people that's an egregious sin for a dub.

That's not to say dub standards should be low, but man younger fans are idiots about what "terrible dubs" mean.

Yeah, starting to see many Japanophiles who think that way. If it's not in the language of the land of the Gods (Japan in their view), they automatically badmouth it.

MajinVejitaXV · Post by **MajinVejitaXV** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 11:48 pm

SparkyPantsMcGee wrote:II get so pissed when I talk to new fans and all I hear is "Death Not and Naruto are the best animes evvvvvvver!!!!"

I *especially* hate it when they call it Death Not. Especially if they speak like a Valley Girl

-Corey

penguintruth · Post by **penguintruth** » Sat Oct 03, 2009 11:50 pm

I think it's best not to pigeon hole people as "Japanophiles" or, popularly, "weeaboo" for preferring the Japanese versions. If they think the Japanese casts are better than the English dub cast (which, in my opinion, is usually the case), doesn't necessarily mean they're some Japan-obsessed feeb. That sort of straw hat argument is best left for the garbage at 4chan.

Kanzenshuu

DB/Older anime fans different from new anime fans?

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