"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[namekiansaiyan]

Cauli saying both Kale and her will go SSJ3 is kind of a foreshadow that they will after they transform, but I lowkey dont want it to happen mainly because... I like Kafla's base design and I'm not a fan of what she will look like when she goes 3.

They can get what ever they like as they will still get their arses beaten as they are useless at fighting. Anymore transformations will just make them more hated by fans.

The key thing is that being Toriyama's favorite doesn't mean you will have a good fight. You may have story importance, but that's about it. Mr. Satan is one of Toriyama's favorites and he's a joke character despite the help he provided in the Cell and Buu Saga. Jaco is Toriyama's most current favorite and he's a butt monkey who has some story important like catching Frost cheating and helping to deduce Hit's ability.

Piccolo's important have more or less been getting Gohan back in shape, so has served the plot. If he gets more than that remains to be seen.

For the most part, Toriyama is more or less indifferent to his characters. Goku was his favorite and he tried to kill him off.

Characters don't stay this long unless they are going to something.

No one has done anything to the plot apart from Goku. Gohan, Piccolo, Vegeta and the rest have essentially done nothing so far.

You mean like Hit who stood as long as he did so Jiren could smash him? Or Cabba who stood around only for so long so Freeza could blast him out of the ring? Or Frost who survived his match with Vegeta, only to be knocked out next episode and then erased?

Freeza has done something for the plot with his scheming and he healed Goku after his fight with Jiren.

Goku and Frieza are the only ones with importance so far.

The examples you listed were to male Frieza and Jiren look good which is crap and annoying.

Since there is very little plot the amount of screen time, elimations and fights should be shared around but they are not for stupid reasons.

[Michsi]

Fans like to say that Piccolo didn't do anything in the Buu Saga, but that is actually not true. He didn't do any fighting, but other than that, he did a lot. And he gave him a fairly prominent presence in what ended up being the author's favorite fight. Him being reduced to a comedic role might have rubbed some people the wrong way, but that's actually what Toriyama's favorite thing is : comedy and silliness.

Didn't he say Gotenks vs Buu was one of his favorite fights because he loves drawing stupid, goofy nonsense like that? I remember in that same interview he said the real end-goal of the Frieza fight was the glare Goku gave him, and then he was kind of annoyed because he realized they'd still have to fight.

Yup, and that's exactly my point. The goofy nonsense side of Dragon Ball is the side that Toriyama seems to love the most, despite not being the side that fans care about so much, at least not when compared to the action part. So Piccolo not being one of the main power-houses anymore may not register in his mind as something bad for the character.
Or- and this is a personal theory with no proof whatsoever- he might have actively diminished Piccolo's role because he was aware that he was his favorite. To make sure there was no favoritism. He once claimed he made Goku marry Chichi because he didn't like her and he wanted to force himself to draw her more. What if he did the opposite with Piccolo

[namekiansaiyan]

Fans like to say that Piccolo didn't do anything in the Buu Saga, but that is actually not true. He didn't do any fighting, but other than that, he did a lot. And he gave him a fairly prominent presence in what ended up being the author's favorite fight. Him being reduced to a comedic role might have rubbed some people the wrong way, but that's actually what Toriyama's favorite thing is : comedy and silliness.

Didn't he say Gotenks vs Buu was one of his favorite fights because he loves drawing stupid, goofy nonsense like that? I remember in that same interview he said the real end-goal of the Frieza fight was the glare Goku gave him, and then he was kind of annoyed because he realized they'd still have to fight.

Yup, and that's exactly my point. The goofy nonsense side of Dragon Ball is the side that Toriyama seems to love the most, despite not being the side that fans care about so much, at least not when compared to the action part. So Piccolo not being one of the main power-houses anymore may not register in his mind as something bad for the character.
Or- and this is a personal theory with no proof whatsoever- he might have actively diminished Piccolo's role because he was aware that he was his favorite. To make sure there was no favoritism. He once claimed he made Goku marry Chichi because he didn't like her and he wanted to force himself to draw her more. What if he did the opposite with Piccolo

Difference now is that Toriyama doesn't draw the series anymore. He only has to write a story. There also really hasn't been any comedy at all recently.

[Michsi]

Difference now is that Toriyama doesn't draw the series anymore. He only has to write a story. There also really hasn't been any comedy at all recently.

That's true. The problem I see here is that, as much as the Buu Saga may not have been that bad for Piccolo as a character, it wasn't great for him as a fighter. I feel like since this was the last arc of the story it kind of set the trend of him sitting on the sidelines. Toriyama himself might have come to see him as more of an observer.

[namekiansaiyan]

Difference now is that Toriyama doesn't draw the series anymore. He only has to write a story. There also really hasn't been any comedy at all recently.

That's true. The problem I see here is that, as much as the Buu Saga may not have been that bad for Piccolo as a character, it wasn't great for him as a fighter. I feel like since this was the last arc of the story it kind of set the trend of him sitting on the sidelines. Toriyama himself might have come to see him as more of an observer.

Maybe but I think becuase he included him in the Champa tournament even though it was only one fight, it got rid of any thoughts I had that Toriyama might have of only having him be an observer in the future arcs.

If we have enough another tournament involving the other Universes later on then I think most of us would expect Piccolo to be in it with Goku and Vegeta but any other character from Universe 7 we would be definitely doubting their involvement.

[Totamo]

I guess thats why I feel like the manga's more closer to how DB would be than the anime one, the anime pushed Trunks way beyond what he should and would do, he went toe to toe with MZamasu, I kinda hope they went in deep about SSJRage and SSJRose, assuming SSJRage most likely wasnt his idea and was another Toei add with SSJBKK. Toriyama while watching the anime was probably like "woah... whats happening here, why does Trunks have 2 aura's? how's he fighting MZamasu toe to toe... what happened to Goku V MZamasu...*proceeds to call the writters on Toei* Guys... what happened?" joking aside I love how Nozawa got fan letters from girls about her sexy Black voice, she was the best thing in the arc.
Anyways, now all the more reasons to support the manga! while not perfect it still goes out of its way to follow AT's outline, these are the instances that I'm glad we have a manga version of it.
I hope we get an interview about the anime staff and Toriyama soon, and his art of MG Goku.

Toei:" Toriyama-Sensei, you want another Dragon Ball GT with Goku stealing the sp

GT has done permanent dmg to the franchise why was why there are some fans not wanting Goku to have the spotlight.

From a story standpoint Trunks vs Merged Zamasu makes sense, its just that they didnt bother explaining Ikari and the Genkidama, with the latter it couldve easier, just mention that it was the hybrids hidden potential or something like that(Look at Gohan who reached Blue level after hours of training too)

This has to be the most hilarious thing I read all day. It was Toei's idea to make Goku the star specifically because they knew kids, not you, kids would like him the best. Which they were right about as out of the 3 main cast at the beginning of GT, Kid Goku was the most likable. Pan was a brat and Trunks was a pansy.


Goku is the most popular character in the show and arguably the most popular protagonist in Shonen history. There are plenty of fans who would watch a show with just him having his own adventures with none of the main cast and I might test that one day. He is literally the one character in the show that can do just about anything and still have a loyal fanbase, unlike Gohan, who has fans who call him lame when he doesn't fight or vegeta fans who call him a jobber. Goku fans defended every action he took in the future trunks saga and had a blast with him threatening the other universes. His character was called into question but he was still defended.


This can't be said for one character that the anime made that wasn't meant to, Future trunks. He has now been called the erza of dragon ball and many fans never want to see him again. Whether you see it as a good thing or a bad thing, Future trunks' powerups put a huge divide in the fandom much larger than Goku's because at least people want to see Goku again just not that much

[namekiansaiyan]

Future Trunks arc should not have existed as it added nothing to the story going forwwrd and we should have had an arc going to another Universe or something.

Toriyama has actually wrote the biggest filler in the series with the Future Trunks arc.

[Michsi]

Difference now is that Toriyama doesn't draw the series anymore. He only has to write a story. There also really hasn't been any comedy at all recently.

That's true. The problem I see here is that, as much as the Buu Saga may not have been that bad for Piccolo as a character, it wasn't great for him as a fighter. I feel like since this was the last arc of the story it kind of set the trend of him sitting on the sidelines. Toriyama himself might have come to see him as more of an observer.

Maybe but I think becuase he included him in the Champa tournament even though it was only one fight, it got rid of any thoughts I had that Toriyama might have of only having him be an observer in the future arcs.

If we have enough another tournament involving the other Universes later on then I think most of us would expect Piccolo to be in it with Goku and Vegeta but any other character from Universe 7 we would be definitely doubting their involvement.

It feels like they all acknowledge his importance to the franchise, so they involve him here and there, but don't want to give him more than they need to
Someone already mentioned that he has been made the butt of a joke a little to often, and I don't know if this is DBS level humor or someone thinks it's funny to put him down like that.
I don't follow the manga, but I'm really curious to find out how he'll be treated there, and if the U6 namekians have any significance whatsoever. No way will the manga be able to give everyone the attention the anime gave them.

[Kinokima]

Goku is the most popular character in the show and arguably the most popular protagonist in Shonen history. There are plenty of fans who would watch a show with just him having his own adventures with none of the main cast and I might test that one day. He is literally the one character in the show that can do just about anything and still have a loyal fanbase, unlike Gohan, who has fans who call him lame when he doesn't fight or vegeta fans who call him a jobber. Goku fans defended every action he took in the future trunks saga and had a blast with him threatening the other universes. His character was called into question but he was still defended.


This can't be said for one character that the anime made that wasn't meant to, Future trunks. He has now been called the erza of dragon ball and many fans never want to see him again. Whether you see it as a good thing or a bad thing, Future trunks' powerups put a huge divide in the fandom much larger than Goku's because at least people want to see Goku again just not that much

yes true about Goku being the most popular but not necessarily true that the series would survive with just Goku and an all new cast.

Also a lot of your assumptions seemed to be based on what angry fans say on the Internet and not based on any concrete evidence that this is how the fandom as a whole feels. I don't really take fans shouting on the web (especially Western fans) opinions as gospel truth. And even angry "adult" Japanese fans shouting on the Internet may not be the target audience they are aiming for. These are the type of fans I would expect from the following.

*Calling Gohan lame
* Never wanting to see F. Trunks again
* Calling Vegeta a jobber

[Baggie_Saiyan]

Sigh. All I want is promo art to be good;(
[spoiler]
[/spoiler]

I want to know who is signing these off thinking it's good enough to promote their show? That "Gohan" looks all sorts of messed up... I'd so take boring Yamamuro over these any day. We have 2 good promo artists that have suddenly been shelved for the crappy one.

[Nero<>Akira]

Future Trunks arc should not have existed as it added nothing to the story going forwwrd and we should have had an arc going to another Universe or something.

Toriyama has actually wrote the biggest filler in the series with the Future Trunks arc.

lol right.

[BlueBasilisk]

Sigh. All I want is promo art to be good;(
[spoiler]
[/spoiler]

I want to know who is signing these off thinking it's good enough to promote their show? That "Gohan" looks all sorts of messed up... I'd so take boring Yamamuro over these any day. We have 2 good promo artists that have suddenly been shelved for the crappy one.

Haven't we seen that piece of art before? That janky Gohan looks really familiar...

[namekiansaiyan]

That's true. The problem I see here is that, as much as the Buu Saga may not have been that bad for Piccolo as a character, it wasn't great for him as a fighter. I feel like since this was the last arc of the story it kind of set the trend of him sitting on the sidelines. Toriyama himself might have come to see him as more of an observer.

Maybe but I think becuase he included him in the Champa tournament even though it was only one fight, it got rid of any thoughts I had that Toriyama might have of only having him be an observer in the future arcs.

If we have enough another tournament involving the other Universes later on then I think most of us would expect Piccolo to be in it with Goku and Vegeta but any other character from Universe 7 we would be definitely doubting their involvement.

It feels like they all acknowledge his importance to the franchise, so they involve him here and there, but don't want to give him more than they need to
Someone already mentioned that he has been made the butt of a joke a little to often, and I don't know if this is DBS level humor or someone thinks it's funny to put him down like that.
I don't follow the manga, but I'm really curious to find out how he'll be treated there, and if the U6 namekians have any significance whatsoever. No way will the manga be able to give everyone the attention the anime gave them.

It shows that Piccolo is in Toriyama's mind.

Piccolo gets more shit then any other character right now even though he has done nothing wrong in this arc.

He trains Gohan again and all I here from fans is that he is a babysitter and that is all he will ever do.

We then get all the arm jokes constantly.

Everyone just randomly calls him irrelevant and weak just to join with the nonsense even if they don't believe it.

Ever since this arc has started and when people predict who will beat who all I ever read is that 'Piccolo will lose to this character' while '17 will then beat a different character' and Gohan will beat another character'. I don't remember seeing a comment that says Piccolo will beat a character apart from my own. Even Krillin got better predictions from fans than he did.

I fail to see how Gohan and 17 are more relevant than Piccolo. They have nothing more important tham Piccolo and if you look at the characters left, what could they possibly do? They are all as irrelevant as each other as they can't beat Jiren.

I feel with Piccolo fans mock him because he doesn't meet their expectations when he appears and wont be happy until he is as strong as Goku.

In the end though I always see people say he is the character more than any other that they want to see get a massive power up.

The Namekians are his way to getting this power up at some point in the future. The fact they are in Universe 6 and not Unuverse 2 like the Tuffle and Yardratian is a good sign.

[HeroR]

Future Trunks arc should not have existed as it added nothing to the story going forwwrd and we should have had an arc going to another Universe or something.

Toriyama has actually wrote the biggest filler in the series with the Future Trunks arc.

I can’t help but wonder if you cried bitter tears as you typed this.

I could make a list why the Future Trunks Saga isn’t filler, but not going to bother. I will just say that Resurrection ‘F’ was called filler thst added nothing to story and we know how that ended.

[Baggie_Saiyan]

Sigh. All I want is promo art to be good;(
[spoiler]
[/spoiler]

I want to know who is signing these off thinking it's good enough to promote their show? That "Gohan" looks all sorts of messed up... I'd so take boring Yamamuro over these any day. We have 2 good promo artists that have suddenly been shelved for the crappy one.

Haven't we seen that piece of art before? That janky Gohan looks really familiar...

Probably. It's the U.S arc promo piece that's gonna be splattered all over merchandise like the Trunks arc and like that this is also done by the same crappy promo artist. But this is the clearest image I have seen of the art and yup looks awful.

[MaskedRider]

Future Trunks arc should not have existed as it added nothing to the story going forwwrd and we should have had an arc going to another Universe or something.

Toriyama has actually wrote the biggest filler in the series with the Future Trunks arc.

It kinda did. Zeno's button is what allowed Goku to travel to him and remind him of the universal tournament. It showcased Zeno's power of destruction to Goku and Vegeta. It brought along the second Zeno to allow the exhibition match / GoD rumble to happen. I suppose you can throw in there that it gave us information such as Whis being an angel, the potara time limit, the consequences of time travelling. I can see why one would argue that what was going on with Trunks was noise but it was also a catalyst for what I mentioned to happen. In a way, Zeno calling for Goku in the middle of the arc helps these characters to feel more connected to each other but that is a plus for me personally.

If anything you could replace what happened during the Future Trunks arc with exploring to another universe though I suppose in a way we already did with travelling to the world of the kais for universe 10 and seeing planet babari I prefer with what we got. With its flaws I would prefer the arc than having to feel asleep like I do with my recent re-watch of GT

[Kinokima]

Piccolo is the butt of all jokes? Really? I must be watching a different series than some of you.

Keep in mind that Toriyama loves gags and humor is part of Dragon Ball. You can't be part of this show if you aren't amusing at times. But I don't think Piccolo gets the comedy treatment anymore than any other character.

[namekiansaiyan]

Future Trunks arc should not have existed as it added nothing to the story going forwwrd and we should have had an arc going to another Universe or something.

Toriyama has actually wrote the biggest filler in the series with the Future Trunks arc.

I can’t help but wonder if you cried bitter tears as you typed this.

I could make a list why the Future Trunks Saga isn’t filler, but not going to bother. I will just say that Resurrection ‘F’ was called filler thst added nothing to story and we know how that ended.

Bitter about what? Wanting an arc that actually affects the future and an arc that is not a just full of fanfiction, rematches and bullshit power ups. I don't defend everything in Super like you constantly do.

How could the Future Trunks arc possible affect future arcs unless Future Zeno does something. As of right now you can skip that arc and just say that Zeno has a twin brother that was not around last time.

Sigh. All I want is promo art to be good;(
[spoiler]
[/spoiler]

I want to know who is signing these off thinking it's good enough to promote their show? That "Gohan" looks all sorts of messed up... I'd so take boring Yamamuro over these any day. We have 2 good promo artists that have suddenly been shelved for the crappy one.

Why do they keep putting 17 in these things when he is one of the most unpopular characters around?

[The gr]

Why do they keep putting 17 in these things when he is one of the most unpopular characters around?

He isn't unpopular,is simple he is the new shiny hero of this hence the promo art

[namekiansaiyan]

Why do they keep putting 17 in these things when he is one of the most unpopular characters around?

He isn't unpopular,is simple he is the new shiny hero of this hence the promo art

Yeah he defiently is compared to everyone else on team Universe 7.

Piccolo is the butt of all jokes? Really? I must be watching a different series than some of you.

Keep in mind that Toriyama loves gags and humor is part of Dragon Ball. You can't be part of this show if you aren't amusing at times. But I don't think Piccolo gets the comedy treatment anymore than any other character.

Fans seeimg him that way due to what Toei done to him in the Resurrection of F super arc along with him babysitting Pan and Goku ignoring him when learning the Mafuba. What most fans don't realise is that there has not been a singlr at all involving Piccolo since the Universal Survival arc started and they fail to realise that the tone of the series has also changed since the start of this arc.

Future Trunks arc should not have existed as it added nothing to the story going forwwrd and we should have had an arc going to another Universe or something.

Toriyama has actually wrote the biggest filler in the series with the Future Trunks arc.

It kinda did. Zeno's button is what allowed Goku to travel to him and remind him of the universal tournament. It showcased Zeno's power of destruction to Goku and Vegeta. It brought along the second Zeno to allow the exhibition match / GoD rumble to happen. I suppose you can throw in there that it gave us information such as Whis being an angel, the potara time limit, the consequences of time travelling. I can see why one would argue that what was going on with Trunks was noise but it was also a catalyst for what I mentioned to happen. In a way, Zeno calling for Goku in the middle of the arc helps these characters to feel more connected to each other but that is a plus for me personally.

If anything you could replace what happened during the Future Trunks arc with exploring to another universe though I suppose in a way we already did with travelling to the world of the kais for universe 10 and seeing planet babari I prefer with what we got. With its flaws I would prefer the arc than having to feel asleep like I do with my recent re-watch of GT

All that information could have been said at any time and the button could have been given to Goku at any time. Wouldn't it have been better if the first time we saw Universal destruction was during this arc when Universe 9 got destroyed?