"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[TheOtherDude]

It looks like we were wrong.

When the Grand Priest stopped the first fight with Toppo and Goku, it seems as though he was protecting Goku. Which is weird.

Also, it’s not looking good for us Vegeta fans!

Toppo needs jiren to get Vegeta. Not good for Toppo either

Why would not that be good for Vegeta fans? He is basically facing Toppo and Jiren at the same time

I meant in the sense that after a full barrage of attacks, we already know Jiren will be the one standing. What Jiren does after that barrage we have no idea. He might decide that’s enough of Vegeta.

[TheOtherDude]

I wouldn’t mind a showdown with Jiren/Toppo vs Goku/Vegeta

Me neither and Vegetto showing up one last time to take them both would be priceless.

True. I’m in the small group of people who want Vegetto/Gogeta. He will definitely make them work up a sweat

[Kenneth La Torre]

So toppo will drop both freeza and 17 at the same time, while vegeta ignores toppo to fight jiren? Or will toppo get eliminated half way in episode 126, and then vegeta will charge at jiren!

[TheShadowEmperor8055]

Vegeta vs Toppo AND Jiren? Not what I was expecting at all. Dafuq happens to Goku? I just wanted a Vegeta vs Toppo showdown TTYTT...

[Legion]

I still think that "surpasses a God with a life risking blow" is about Toppo, so maybe Vegeta and Toppo will eliminate each other. Of course he will not beat Jiren.

[Michsi]

Most of the acclaimed for Z comes from the action, almost nothing to do with the story. Especially after the Namek Saga where most of the cast too a level in dumbass.

Acclaim is acclaim, that brings with it expectations. If its storytelling was considered one of Z more weaker aspects, then it stands to reason that you'd expect them to improve on that.

What ideas did they reused? Champa, Hit, and Jiren act almost nothing like antagonists in Z.

What I meant was that the same way Z reused 'the evil for the sake of evil villain', Super sticks with 'antagonist, but not really evil' trope.

That still matches Z almost toe to toe. Zamasu is still the second best villain of the series.

Wait, I'm following you here. What does?

They're really not. Cell wanted to fight strong people for the sake of stroking his ego. The moment he meant someone stronger than him, he had a breakdown. Beerus wanted to fight a Super Saiyan God to have a real rival and was disappointed when Goku didn't meet up to his expectations. For Beerus, fighting a Super Saiyan God wasn't an ego trip like the Cell Games were to Cell. And Jiren's motives are unclear, but he's mostly fighting for his universe, which more motivation that most of Z villains even if you find his personality dry.

It's still alike in shallowness. We didn't see Beerus have a breakdown, because Goku never properly gave him a reason to have one. The only time he came close to that was in the cave. I think Beerus is a great character, but it's his uneasy ally status that makes him interesting. As far as his antagonistic motives go , it's as simple and uncomplicated as it could be.
We still have more to learn about Jiren, but fighting not to die is also not the most groundbreaking of motives. The concept of our hero being pitted against someone who fights against him only because they don't want to die is interesting, but given the lack on tension that should've accompanied such a scenario and the fact that Jiren is being portrayed so poorly, the silent, arrogant type, just proves my point of good idea, weak execution.

[BlueBasilisk]

The order of events is really unclear here. Does Toppo fell 17 and Frieza then go for Vegeta? Does he go for Vegeta then get challenged by Frieza and 17? Does Vegeta drop him then fight Jiren? Hell, does Goku fight Toppo instead?

[Noah]

Vegeta vs Toppo AND Jiren? Not what I was expecting at all. Dafuq happens to Goku? I just wanted a Vegeta vs Toppo showdown TTYTT...

What if Goku was eliminated? That would be quite a twist!

[Kenneth La Torre]

We might need to wait for the japanese scans to see of its any better explained. Cause this is a mess.

[Xeogran]

Vegeta vs Toppo AND Jiren? Not what I was expecting at all. Dafuq happens to Goku? I just wanted a Vegeta vs Toppo showdown TTYTT...

What if Goku was eliminated? That would be quite a twist!

>Goku eliminated before Shirtless UI

Yeah right, why would they even bother with concept art and stuff for it.

[HeroR]

Most of the acclaimed for Z comes from the action, almost nothing to do with the story. Especially after the Namek Saga where most of the cast too a level in dumbass.

Acclaim is acclaim, that brings with it expectations. If its storytelling was considered one of Z more weaker aspects, then it stands to reason that you'd expect them to improve on that.

What ideas did they reused? Champa, Hit, and Jiren act almost nothing like antagonists in Z.

What I meant was that the same way Z reused 'the evil for the sake of evil villain', Super sticks with 'antagonist, but not really evil' trope.

That still matches Z almost toe to toe. Zamasu is still the second best villain of the series.

Wait, I'm following you here. What does?

They're really not. Cell wanted to fight strong people for the sake of stroking his ego. The moment he meant someone stronger than him, he had a breakdown. Beerus wanted to fight a Super Saiyan God to have a real rival and was disappointed when Goku didn't meet up to his expectations. For Beerus, fighting a Super Saiyan God wasn't an ego trip like the Cell Games were to Cell. And Jiren's motives are unclear, but he's mostly fighting for his universe, which more motivation that most of Z villains even if you find his personality dry.

It's still alike in shallowness. We didn't see Beerus have a breakdown, because Goku never properly gave him a reason to have one. The only time he came close to that was in the cave. I think Beerus is a great character, but it's his uneasy ally status that makes him interesting. As far as his antagonistic motives go , it's as simple and uncomplicated as it could be.
We still have more to learn about Jiren, but fighting not to die is also not the most groundbreaking of motives. The concept of our hero being pitted against someone who fights against him only because they don't want to die is interesting, but given the lack on tension that should've accompanied such a scenario and the fact that Jiren is being portrayed so poorly, the silent, arrogant type, just proves my point of good idea, weak execution.

We're talking about story, which Z has never been acclaimed for even at its peak. And Super did improved Z's storytelling, for those who are honest about how weak the story in Z was after Namek.

Super uses shades of grey trope, which most modern anime uses. If that's the requirement, an antagonist can only be: evil, not really evil, or good but are against the heroes for reasons. Which the Pride Troopers fall into.

Beerus can't have a breakdown like Cell because Beerus never pretended to be the strongest or perfect. He knows where he stands in the universe, even more so in the movie where he tells Goku that he isn't the strongest, that's Whis, and they could be fighters in other universes that surpasses even him. That isn't like Cell at all who couldn't comprehend anything stronger than himself. You're taking one shared quirked between Cell and Beerus and trying to say that they're alike. It's about as annoying when people claimed Perfect Cell is an evil counterpart to Goku and Goku would be like this if he was evil, ignoring that Goku would fight for the sake of it, not so he can proved he's the strongest in the universe. The motives may seem the same, but devil are in the details.

Fighting not to be erased along with their own universe is different than most antagonist in Dragon Ball. And the 'lack of tension' is because Dragon Ball is Dragon Ball.

[Professor Freeza]

That still matches Z almost toe to toe. Zamasu is still the second best villain of the series.

Wait, I'm following you here. What does?

The villains motives and stuff.

[Noah]

And the 'lack of tension' is because Dragon Ball is Dragon Ball.

Nope, the lack of tension is because this story is set before EoZ that we all know all these characters will be fine, so the thing amusing about Super is how they get into there.

[Ki Breaker]

Vegeta vs Toppo AND Jiren? Not what I was expecting at all. Dafuq happens to Goku? I just wanted a Vegeta vs Toppo showdown TTYTT...

What if Goku was eliminated? That would be quite a twist!

>Goku eliminated before Shirtless UI

Yeah right, why would they even bother with concept art and stuff for it.

Goku trips and falls off his undershirt piece tearing the whole thing in the process..
A shitless UI Goku intently watches Vegeta get wreaked to hell

[TheSaiyanGod]

So the order of events is really confusing.

It is said that Vegeta will face Toppo. But both Toppo and Jiren will attack Vegeta. So maybe Toppo himself is asking Jiren for help?
The synopsis also gave the impression that Vegeta will face Jiren alone at some point, but I believe that's not it.

It is said '' he and Jiren attack Vegeta. HOWEVER, Vegeta faces off against Jiren ''.
Here, it seems that Jiren and Toppo are going to attack Vegeta, but Vegeta will quickly counterattack (at the same time), so probably that is still referring to when Toppo and Jiren attack Vegeta, even though the synopsis has just said that Vegeta faces off against Jiren.

I think it's 17 and Freeza will be knocked over by Toppo before Toppo will face Vegeta, after all their fight looks like it's going to be the continuation of the fight started on EP 125.
And so Toppo will need help from Jiren

[IndieBooToo]

Looks like Vegeta will get his shit rocked by Toppo after all. Interesting. Well not really since it was expected. I'm wondering what happens with Goku. Probably will come in with UI after Vegeta does his usual job.

[ToshioWrites]

Looks like Vegeta will get his shit rocked by Toppo after all. Interesting. Well not really since it was expected. I'm wondering what happens with Goku. Probably will come in with UI after Vegeta does his usual job.

That’s one way to interpret the spoilers I guess

[Noah]

Looks like Vegeta will get his shit rocked by Toppo after all. Interesting. Well not really since it was expected. I'm wondering what happens with Goku. Probably will come in with UI after Vegeta does his usual job.

I think both will be eliminated alongside Toppo and probably Platinum Freeza vs. FP Jiren will be the final match of the ToP.

[TheOtherDude]

So toppo will drop both freeza and 17 at the same time, while vegeta ignores toppo to fight jiren? Or will toppo get eliminated half way in episode 126, and then vegeta will charge at jiren!

It comes across as Vegeta changes his focus from Toppo back to Jiren. The spoilers have been wrong before so we will see.

Ultimately I think it’ll come down to 4 God of Destruction level fighters going at it.

[Nickolaidas]

So the entire Frieza plot turned out to be a huge pile of nothing. Yay, I guess. All that build-up, scheming and the like turned out to be just to make you wonder whether Frieza will do something sneaky or not. Getting thrashed by Toppo is hardly an epic moment for the alien tyrant so I guess that Goku, #17, Roshi and Vegeta remain the only U7 fighters who actually exceeded expectations.

Gohan, Frieza and 18 take second place of being there and doing stuff but never doing something actually awesome ...

Piccolo and Krillin were wasted opportunities ...

And Tien was an epic clusterfuck.