Gohan vs. Dabura

[Satan-Sama]

Why is it that Gohan didn't turn SSJ2 against Dabura, during their fight on the third floor of Babidi's spaceship. Surely there wouldn't have been any struggle for him had he done so.

[Kaboom]

Out-of-Universe answer: Because Toriyama wanted to make Goku and Vegeta, and subsequently Majin Boo, look better.

In-Universe answer: Because Gohan is a wuss.

[Savage68]

There is actually quite a large amount of evidence for Gohan being either SSj or SSj 2 against Dabura(and against Buu and when he released the Z-Sword).

I personally find Gohan being SSj against Dabura more believable, because it's not like Toriyama just up and forgot how to draw a SSj 2 aura or something. And because Dabura seems to be implied to be < SSj Goku. So even though Gohan fighting those two at only the SSj level may not make the most sense to some, I think it's still the case. Not like this series is always perfectly logical, anyway.

[JulieYBM]

Why is it that Gohan didn't turn SSJ2 against Dabura, during their fight on the third floor of Babidi's spaceship. Surely there wouldn't have been any struggle for him had he done so.

There are innumerable schools of thought.

The Daizenshû (official guide books written by Toriyama's staff with his approval) says Gohan did use it against Dabra.

The second school ignores the Daizenshû.

The third chalks it up to Toriyama forgetting.

A fourth believes Gohan couldn't become a Super Saiyan 2 because he lacked anger.

A fifth believes Kibito could not restore all of his ki, so Gohan was unable.

A sixth would offer that Gohan was warming up and never had to chance to go all-out.

A seventh would assert Gohan felt he could defeat Dabra without it, assuming the Cell Dabra was on par with was the one Gokû fought. Without even becoming a Super Saiyan 2, Gohan was already more powerful than his old man during the Cell Games.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Out-of-Universe answer: Because Toriyama wanted to make Goku and Vegeta, and subsequently Majin Boo, look better.

This is the one I'd most be in favour of. That and I think, perhaps, Toriyama didn't want to make Dabra as strong as Super Perfect Cell, only Perfect Cell, since he wasn't even the main villain. But unless Toriyama gives us the answer, we shall continue to speculate.

In-Universe answer: Because Gohan is a wuss.

I truly think that Son Gohan was unable to transform into Super Saiyan 2. Chalking it up to him being a wuss or being stupid is one of the most baseless, refutable answers as to why he didn't transform. If he was going up against two formidable enemies (Dabra & Majin Buu) who wanted to kill him, the latter being the most powerful villain the heroes had faced yet, why the heck wouldn't he use his full power?

[rereboy]

In-Universe answer: Because Gohan is a wuss.

I truly think that Son Gohan was unable to transform into Super Saiyan 2. Chalking it up to him being a wuss or being stupid is one of the most baseless, refutable answers as to why he didn't transform. If he was going up against two formidable enemies (Dabra & Majin Buu) who wanted to kill him, the latter being the most powerful villain the heroes had faced yet, why the heck wouldn't he use his full power?

The problem is that he did it at the tournament with no effort at all and he wasn`t in any danger.

I would understand a logic like "well he hasn`t trained in 7 years and he pretty much never used the SSJ2 again, so now he has trouble turning into SSJ2 again at will".

That would make sense, but the problem is that he didn`t have any problem with it at the tournament. If only he hadn`t turned SSJ2 at the tournament it would all make sense.

[Piccolo Daimao]

In-Universe answer: Because Gohan is a wuss.

I truly think that Son Gohan was unable to transform into Super Saiyan 2. Chalking it up to him being a wuss or being stupid is one of the most baseless, refutable answers as to why he didn't transform. If he was going up against two formidable enemies (Dabra & Majin Buu) who wanted to kill him, the latter being the most powerful villain the heroes had faced yet, why the heck wouldn't he use his full power?

The problem is that he did it at the tournament with no effort at all and he wasn`t in any danger.

I would understand a logic like "well he hasn`t trained in 7 years and he pretty much never used the SSJ2 again, so now he has trouble turning into SSJ2 again at will".

That would make sense, but the problem is that he didn`t have any problem with it at the tournament. If only he hadn`t turned SSJ2 at the tournament it would all make sense.

If he could do it at the Tenka'ichi Budokai at will, then he should be able to do it in battle.

Actually, even if he hadn't turned SSJ2 at the Budokai, it still wouldn't make sense because he still had a transformation available to him. I don't know how come he couldn't turn into SSJ2, but he didn't, which brings me to the conclusion that he just was not able to.

There's been other threads about this before, probably countless, and we've never gotten any closer to the answer, so why keep on speculating?

[Bussani]

Actually, even if he hadn't turned SSJ2 at the Budokai, it still wouldn't make sense because he still had a transformation available to him.

When Goku first got back to Earth after Namek exploding, Trunks asked him if he could transform at will. Goku told him that he couldn't at first and had to train at it before he could. Since Gohan promised to focus on studying after the Cell incident, it's possible that he never got proper control over it.

After all, even though Goku said he couldn't do it whenever he wanted at first, he was still able to power down and then back up again in the middle of his fight with Freeza.

[Piccolo Daimao]

Actually, even if he hadn't turned SSJ2 at the Budokai, it still wouldn't make sense because he still had a transformation available to him.

When Goku first got back to Earth after Namek exploding, Trunks asked him if he could transform at will. Goku told him that he couldn't at first and had to train at it before he could. Since Gohan promised to focus on studying after the Cell incident, it's possible that he never got proper control over it.

After all, even though Goku said he couldn't do it whenever he wanted at first, he was still able to power down and then back up again in the middle of his fight with Freeza.

Gohan had some control on it, at least, since he did transform into Super Saiyan 2 at will. In addition to the Goku example, Gohan powered down to SSJ and then back up to SSJ2 after Super Perfect Cell returned. Albeit, you could say that in both those situations, they were triggered by rage, however little.

[Kaboom]

Gohan had the capacity to transform to Super Saiyan 2. He did so at the Budokai not even an hour prior. But against Dabra, he just... didn't.

The story suggests he just was having trouble getting angry enough. He, Goku, and Vegeta were treating the whole descent into Babidi's ship and clashes against his underlings like a game. Yeah, they had to kill Dabra to save Kuririn and Piccolo outside, but they were still confident and having fun.

While at the Budokai, Gohan could have still been pissed over Videl being hurt, and then over his identity as both Saiyaman and the 'golden warrior' being exposed. I guess he had more to be angry about there than here.

[JulieYBM]

I don't think he was very 'angry' when he used Super Saiyan 2 against Kibito, nor do I think his trademark 'anger boost' would be the only thing that allows him to use Super Saiyan 2. Gohan could still be a Super Saiyan 2 and not be able to reach his full power.

[Savage68]

I don't think he was angry against Kibito either.

We already saw him transform in response to Videl's beating, and he was only SSj. It doesn't make sense that he would still be angry about that, when she's perfectly fine and he's not even facing the guy that hurt her in the first place.

And...being angry about having his secret identity blown? Seriously?

[Kaboom]

I don't mean angry as in his "YOU KILLED/HURT <PERSON> RAAAAGH I'M GONNA SKULLF*CK YOU" rage sessions like he's famous for, nor did I mean that he can't go SSj2 if he's not upset. I meant that even just being agitated or frustrated would still serve to make the transformation easier.

He had stuff to be angry about at the tournament. By the time he was fighting Dabra, he was kind of having fun.

[Savage68]

He looked just as agitated, if not more when he was fighting Dabura compared to when he faced Kibito.

Piccolo and Krillin's lives were in danger; I think that would serve to make the transformation easier, even more so than whatever reasons he may have had at the Budokai.

[Kaboom]

You're right, it doesn't make sense that he'd be acting the way he did under the circumstances. Nonetheless, he was. He seemed determined, but it was out of a drive to have his turn fighting and prove himself to Goku and Vegeta. And it was stated by both himself and others that he was having a hard time getting angry and using his "true power." (i.e. Super Saiyan 2). When for all intents and purposes, he should have been able to do so.

It may not make much sense, but that's how it is...

[JulieYBM]

The Daizenshû claims he was using Super Saiyan 2, however. And by the way he spoke to Kibito at the tournament, he seemed to have control over the transformation...so it's not unlikely it was a visual goof on Toriyama's part.

Then again, it's with the Videl-Spopovitch match that Gohan's regular Super Saiyan hair began to have only the one bang down the middle.

[Savage68]

IIRC, it says Gohan only used SSj 2 once in his 'Growing Up' guide or something, but claims Dabura fought SSj 2 Gohan.

In any case, I've never felt that Toriyama just got amnesia overnight and forgot how to draw a SSj 2 aura. However nonsensical it may be, he intended for Gohan to be SSj against Dabura and Buu for a reason.

[Kaboom]

Yeah, it's a mistake on the Daizenshuu's part.

[Maphisto86]

This is probably impossible to answer since there are plenty of arguments for and against. Mr. Toriyama has not always been consistant in how he shows the SSJ states throughout every panel of manga they are present. While he is much more accurate then the animators at Toei, it's possible Mr. Toriyama just did not care by then to be make the few subtle changes in hair and aura between SSJ1 or SSJ2.

My in universe theory is that even though Gohan was agitated fighting Dabura, he needed to be a lot more angry to sustain SSJ2. Gohan had been neglecting his training for so long that SSJ2 was no longer so easy for him to maintain so he found it more comfortable to fight in the first SSJ stage. Vegeta constantly complains during this fight about how weak Gohan had become and that he would have had to use little effort to defeat Dabura.

[Savage68]

We've already established that he can use SSj 2 effortlessly.