Filler Guide (General + Inconsistencies)

SonGohan-san · Post by **SonGohan-san** » Fri Feb 06, 2004 6:43 pm

That whole dream sequence stuff with Cell and the artificial humans could TECHNICALLY be considered a plothole, I guess.

Thing is, I think they just used their images where they did to add drama and build-up for the viewers at home, not as a representation for what was actually being seen in the dream by Goku and Gohan.

If they had used some vague shadowy characters, it may have actually confused some viewers (they could be thinking that they are dreaming about something else besides Cell or whoever).

A few I'm not sure about:

I thought no plane could reach the top of Karin's Tower. Wasn't that mentioned in DB?
Then, during the Cell Saga, Bulma flies to Kami's Palace in her jet-thing, which is even higher.

Cell regernating after Goku blasts off Cell's head (despite his nucleus being there). (Sorry if this one has been said, it seems like a fairly known one.)

Isn't mentioned at one point that the earth's King uses the Dragon Balls to attain his position? If so, that would conflict with other obvious details.

While not necessarily a plothole, how can the sayians, or any other alien, communicate with earth's creatures? An intergalactic language?

When Trunks knocks over stone Piccolo, he should have been dead when it shattered to pieces. From what I can tell, Piccolo can only regenerate his limbs not his entire structure like Cell or Buu. If he could, then you have question how Demon Piccolo actually died when chibi Goku burst through his body. Plus, you’d have to wonder why Piccolo didn’t just regenerate when Furiza fately wounded him on Namek after he aided Goku.

There is a point in the anime and perhaps even the manga which Goku uses his teleportation to reach Lord Kaiou’s planet. When Kaiou-samma withnesses this new technique, he shrugs it off as being assinine saying something along the lines of, “That’s nothing. I could’ve taught you that if you’d had asked me.” However, this premise of Kaiou-samma knowing the teleportation neglects the notion of Goku being forced to travel back on the Serpant Path when the Sayians arrive. If you recall, Goku even asks Kaiou-samma if he could just “zap him there or something” to which Lord Kaiou angrily replies, “I can’t do you everything, you know.”

Dai · Post by **Dai** » Fri Feb 06, 2004 7:00 pm

About no plane reaching Karin Tower: We're talking about the girl who invented a time machine, fixed up an Artifical Human, and invented several way-ahead-of-time spaceships, remember?

The Earth's king didn't use the Dragon Balls to gain his position... Bulma said something ''The last one who gathered the dragon balls, wished to become a king'', which she also states happened centuries ago. It couldn't honestly be that same king, now could it?

About the communication thingie... Can't really be defined inconsistent or a fault. It's just something that obviously had to be done to make the thing readable. Hell, just look at Star Trek...

''Hello, we are an alien race here to brutally murder all of you, even though we've never met you. Oh, and we also conveniently speak fluent English.''

Good point about the Serpent Path, though I'm not sure whether that was in the manga or not...

That also brings up: Why didn't Goku simply jump off Serpent Path? He could'be used to shortcut via Hell and end up in Enma's desk.

SonGohan-san · Post by **SonGohan-san** » Fri Feb 06, 2004 7:29 pm

Well, I know its a cheap way out of your question or whatever, but the whole ordeal in Hell with Goku falling off was Toei filler. At least I'm 95% sure.

As far as the king thing, I couldn't remember too well, so thanks for clearing that up.

About the ships, I kinda figured that with Capsole Corp. and everything. I just remember it being so dramatic when Goku first reaches Kami's Palace (all the clouds) and then by the Cell era, Bulma just casually flies up there like going to the corner seven eleven. I guess she flew Kuririn, Yamucha, and Tien/Chaotzu up there before, so I dunno.

One other thing....I believe Goku is wished back to life for the first time to face the sayians after a year had already passed. And we all know the rule about wishing people back to life after more than a year has passed. That's what the timeline says, which is strange b/c Raditzu said they other Sayians would arrive in one year (how he knew how long an earth year was is beyond me), yet in the anime (and possibly the manga) the Z Senshi all comment how Vegita and Nappa had arrive AHEAD of schedule. a lot conflict with time going on there.

Post by **TripleRach** » Fri Feb 06, 2004 8:51 pm

SonGohan-san wrote:When Trunks knocks over stone Piccolo, he should have been dead when it shattered to pieces. From what I can tell, Piccolo can only regenerate his limbs not his entire structure like Cell or Buu. If he could, then you have question how Demon Piccolo actually died when chibi Goku burst through his body. Plus, you’d have to wonder why Piccolo didn’t just regenerate when Furiza fately wounded him on Namek after he aided Goku.

Right after Piccolo recovers from being shattered, he says that he can fully regenerate, so long as his head is left in tact. But it takes up a lot of energy to do this, so it can't be done at the brink of death, when he obviously has very little energy.

PsyLiam · Post by **PsyLiam** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 12:14 am

SonGohan-san wrote:One other thing....I believe Goku is wished back to life for the first time to face the sayians after a year had already passed. And we all know the rule about wishing people back to life after more than a year has passed. That's what the timeline says, which is strange b/c Raditzu said they other Sayians would arrive in one year (how he knew how long an earth year was is beyond me), yet in the anime (and possibly the manga) the Z Senshi all comment how Vegita and Nappa had arrive AHEAD of schedule. a lot conflict with time going on there.

Well, there really is no conflict. If by "timeline", you mean the daizenshuu, don't they just list years, rather than months? As long as the Saiyans arrived one hour less than a year after Goku died, he could be wished back. And, as you pointed out, they were early, so it had to have been less than a year since Goku died.

And Raditz knew how long an earth year was in the same way that he knew how to speak Engish. Honest, did you want him to say "They will arrive in one of your Earth years"? Because dialogue like that makes me want to scream and kill.

sailorspazz · Post by **sailorspazz** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 12:27 am

The uber-detailed timeline in Daizenshuu 7 lists years, months, even days of when certain events took place. I'm looking at it now since I brought it to the computer to check some of the timeline discussion (oi....giving me a headache) and, according to it, the Vegeta and Nappa actually arrive later than was expected, and Gokuu was dead for more than a year. It says that Gokuu died on October 12th 761, yet he wasn't wished back until November 2nd 762, and Vegeta and Nappa arrived on Earth the day after that. I think the whole "you must be wished back within a year" thing had to do with the body still being intact, so I guess if they preserved Gokuu's body it was OK to wish him back a little over a year later (or the Daizenshuu is just making up dates and forgetting that part ^_^)

PsyLiam · Post by **PsyLiam** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 12:49 am

And it also jibes with the "they're early" comment made by other characters, too.

SonGohan-san · Post by **SonGohan-san** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 2:11 am

The Piccolo thing may be true...[/i]I guess It just seems so half-assed to me. I mean, his body was in shambles. It's like saying he can regenerate like Majin Buu or Cell. But you're probably right. I just don't like it, though. I'm sure the detailed timelines screw many things over (like Dai said with Goku going after the Dballs during the RR saga even though according to the dates, less than a year had passed).

And yes, it would have been stupid for Raditzu to say "one of your years" but "one earth year" doesn't sound so off to me when you take into account HE'S AN ALIEN. I'm not saying it's even plothole, though, it just popped into my head as I was typing the other stuff.

PsyLiam · Post by **PsyLiam** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 2:19 am

Hmm. Maybe you're...nope, sorry. I tried. But sticking the word "earth" in amoungst measurments when someone is already speaking English strikes me as one of the laziest sci-fi cliches anyone can do. What, he's worried that they might think he means a Martian year? (Or, perhaps, a Vegetian Year?)

Besides, it always reminds me of that bit on the Simpsons:

"Greeting, Earth children!"

"What planet are you from?"

"...Earth."

SonGohan-san · Post by **SonGohan-san** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 2:27 am

Hey, it's the effort that really matters.

What a b*tchin little Emoticon. All the rest are a bunch of uptight drama queens. He's like, "hey, I'm just suave".

PsyLiam · Post by **PsyLiam** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 2:36 am

I dunno. I think he's a twat. The sort of emoticon that wears sunglasses indoors just to look cool.

SonGohan-san · Post by **SonGohan-san** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 2:44 am

Hey, what's cooler than being coola? (edited to make lame DBZ pun)

Obviously, its an emoticon that sports his blueblocas.

PsyLiam · Post by **PsyLiam** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 2:51 am

Coolness is not something you can achieve merely by wearing sunglasses. Coolness is built in. People who try to be cool end up smelling of coolness-failure, which is the most unpleasant smell of all.

Post by **TripleRach** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 4:00 am

sailorspazz wrote:The uber-detailed timeline in Daizenshuu 7 lists years, months, even days of when certain events took place. I'm looking at it now since I brought it to the computer to check some of the timeline discussion (oi....giving me a headache) and, according to it, the Vegeta and Nappa actually arrive later than was expected, and Gokuu was dead for more than a year. It says that Gokuu died on October 12th 761, yet he wasn't wished back until November 2nd 762, and Vegeta and Nappa arrived on Earth the day after that. I think the whole "you must be wished back within a year" thing had to do with the body still being intact, so I guess if they preserved Gokuu's body it was OK to wish him back a little over a year later (or the Daizenshuu is just making up dates and forgetting that part ^_^)

Well well well, it seems the Daizenshuu writers did something to conflict with what the actual series says. It takes Gokuu six months to travel down Snake Road and reach Kaiou's planet, and then Kaiou-sama tells him the Saiya-jin will arrive in 158 days.

Actually, it was probably a misprint or something. If they meant November 2nd, 761 ~ October 12th, 762, that fits the 6 months + 158 days thing almost exactly.

sailorspazz · Post by **sailorspazz** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 4:20 am

Heh, they give dates for more things, too. Gokuu died October 12th, arrived at Kaiou's planet April 29th (6 1/2 months rather than 6), caught Bubbles on May 9th, hit Gregory with a hammer on "about" May 23rd (what's with the about? Everything else was pretty damn specific) and was wished back November 2nd. The time between April 29th and November 3rd is about a month more than 158 days....man, did these people lose count when coming up with these dates? I've always been a bit wary of the Daizenshuu 7 uber-timeline....it gets so specific that it's easy for it to contradict things that were actually stated in the series.

Post by **TripleRach** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 4:36 am

Arriving on April 29th, and catching Bubbles on May 9th... It was supposed to have taken him forty days to catch Bubbles.

Sounds like the Daizenshuu people got all confused with that point in the story. ^^;;

Jerseymilk · Post by **Jerseymilk** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 7:41 am

I agree with what TripleRach is saying about the times. They totally conflict with the anime and manga. I've got the Viz manga right in front of me and according to it, took Goku 40 days to catch Bubbles, and on an interesting note, I actually remember in the French version of the anime, the narration stated that Vegita and Nappa arrived in 11 and something months. It's not said in the Japanese version, so I don't know about the level of validity, but it's interesting to know.

Dayspring · Post by **Dayspring** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 2:06 pm

Except for the pre-dragonball stuff, things outside the manga/anime (like Satan wins budoukai and Videl wins the kids' devision) and an explanation of the timelines I never really liked the chronology section. It more or less decides to stick to plot-only stuff once it reaches the Dragonball stuff. Randomly however, ESPECIALLY in the Saiyan saga era, there's dates like when Gohan meets the robot, the pendulum room and Arlia episodes, etc. It includes movies 1+5 as part of the main events! 1 can be argued since the Garlick Jr crap led to a whole saga in the anime, but 5?! How the bloody H-E-L-L-O can everybody sense Freeza+King Cold's ki, yet after 2-3 years of training later they're incapable of picking up on someone stronger who on top of which can still transform?! And randomly Goku CAN'T achieve SSJ at will anymore?! It makes no sense!!!

I take back what I say about the timelines! I defy the Daizenshuu! There are only 3 timelines now! BAH!!!

Zackarotto · Post by **Zackarotto** » Sat Feb 07, 2004 2:12 pm

Looks like somebody needs to take their un-crazy pills.

Just kidding. I think I'm with you on this one.

Deus ex Machina · Post by **Deus ex Machina** » Thu Feb 26, 2004 9:10 pm

I just noticed something from the Cell saga, something that hasn't already been brought up. I'm not sure if it would be inconsistency or what, but in the manga Cell's first 'imperfect' form had only 3 fingers per hand. However in the anime he had 5. It might be worth mentioning somewhere.

Kanzenshuu

Filler Guide (General + Inconsistencies)

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