MistareFusion's Dragon Ball Dissection! (Updated 4/1/24!)

[FoolsGil]

Since Super was brought up a couple of times, I thought to point out that with the Super Anime canon, based on Super: Broly, Vegeta is now the 4th, and King Vegeta was the 3rd. So they may not ever be mentioned in Super, or perhaps ever again, but if there was a war against the Tuffles for the Planet, it would have been Vegeta's great grandfather who lead the charge, and became the first King.

See, I've been hearing this multiple times, but why is that the assumption? Why would the Saiyans have to be in charge of the whole planet before they start naming a Vegeta line?

I think its a tale as old as fanfic, at least some that I read: the planet was re-named after the revolutionary who made it all possible, the other Saiyans made him a King, and his lineage was named after him

[Gaffer Tape]

Since Super was brought up a couple of times, I thought to point out that with the Super Anime canon, based on Super: Broly, Vegeta is now the 4th, and King Vegeta was the 3rd. So they may not ever be mentioned in Super, or perhaps ever again, but if there was a war against the Tuffles for the Planet, it would have been Vegeta's great grandfather who lead the charge, and became the first King.

See, I've been hearing this multiple times, but why is that the assumption? Why would the Saiyans have to be in charge of the whole planet before they start naming a Vegeta line?

I think its a tale as old as fanfic, at least some that I read: the planet was re-named after the revolutionary who made it all possible, the other Saiyans made him a King, and his lineage was named after him

A lot of that is indeed true. And I certainly don't claim that Super is leaving these events intact. It's certainly possible and logical. I'm just not sure if one need necessarily follow the other. There could be lots of reasons why Vegeta's father is Vegeta IV.

[DanielSSJ]

A lot of that is indeed true. And I certainly don't claim that Super is leaving these events intact. It's certainly possible and logical. I'm just not sure if one need necessarily follow the other. There could be lots of reasons why Vegeta's father is Vegeta IV.

I think you mean Vegeta III.

[Gaffer Tape]

I think you mean Vegeta III.

I never learned how to count.

[Ashur]

I agree, the Vegeta line could have started way before they renamed the planet "Vegeta", after all the king's name was first anyway, it's not like the king was named at the same time as the planet in the old canon.

Still in Super continuity there is no Tsufurujin in sight, but we do know the Saiyans came from Salad to Plant.

[Scsigs]

I agree, the Vegeta line could have started way before they renamed the planet "Vegeta", after all the king's name was first anyway, it's not like the king was named at the same time as the planet in the old canon.

Still in Super continuity there is no Tsufurujin in sight, but we do know the Saiyans came from Salad to Plant.

Only question is...what happened to Sadala?

[Ashur]

I agree, the Vegeta line could have started way before they renamed the planet "Vegeta", after all the king's name was first anyway, it's not like the king was named at the same time as the planet in the old canon.

Still in Super continuity there is no Tsufurujin in sight, but we do know the Saiyans came from Salad to Plant.

Only question is...what happened to Sadala?

I like to headcanon that the Universe 7 Saiyans destroyed their own home planet with their violent and barbaric way of living, possibly fighting each other all the time until the planet was left uninhabitable, forcing them to search for a new planet, and this cycle continued for a few more planets until they reached Vegeta, this would explain why the Universe 6 Saiyans are still on Sadala given that at some point they evolved into a more functional civilization (or were always like that).

But officially there is no concrete answer.

[Gaffer Tape]

It's Goku Time! - Dragon Ball Dissection: The Baby Arc Part 14

The gang returns to Earth only to find it taken over by Baby! It's four heroes against the world. It's three heroes against the world. Two heroes...? Oh, who am I kidding. It's Goku time. And it's Dragon Ball Dissection time!

There were a lot of fun topics to discuss this time around, from the suddenness of writing Trunks and Giru out of the show, to the very inconsistent versions of Baby's followers, to the lack of motivation Baby has for singling out Goku. There's a lot going on with these episodes!

[DanielSSJ]

I like to headcanon that the Universe 7 Saiyans destroyed their own home planet with their violent and barbaric way of living, possibly fighting each other all the time until the planet was left uninhabitable, forcing them to search for a new planet, and this cycle continued for a few more planets until they reached Vegeta, this would explain why the Universe 6 Saiyans are still on Sadala given that at some point they evolved into a more functional civilization (or were always like that).

But officially there is no concrete answer.

Is that even a headcanon? I thought this was the actual explanation: Planet Sadala was destroyed from all the infighting among the Saiyans so they had to find a new planet.

[Ashur]

I like to headcanon that the Universe 7 Saiyans destroyed their own home planet with their violent and barbaric way of living, possibly fighting each other all the time until the planet was left uninhabitable, forcing them to search for a new planet, and this cycle continued for a few more planets until they reached Vegeta, this would explain why the Universe 6 Saiyans are still on Sadala given that at some point they evolved into a more functional civilization (or were always like that).

But officially there is no concrete answer.

Is that even a headcanon? I thought this was the actual explanation: Planet Sadala was destroyed from all the infighting among the Saiyans so they had to find a new planet.

I don't remember such a thing being said.

[Grimlock]

I thought this was the actual explanation: Planet Sadala was destroyed from all the infighting among the Saiyans so they had to find a new planet.

While it was never outright named, it is assumed that the planet the Saiyans lived before Plant was Sadala. "Sadala" is only mentioned as the name of the home planet of the Saiyans from Universe 6. Considering how much Universe 6 and Universe 7 are alike (as they should...), it is quite possible that the planet the Universe 7 Saiyans lived before Plant was Sadala as well. All of this is supported by Vegeta recognizing Cabba's armor somehow... (Did Saiyans have a museum or something?).

[jcogginsa]

To speculate: It’s known that the Dragonballs can’t grant wishes against the will of someone more powerful than their creator. Since the black star balls were created by the nameless namekian, who was definitely stronger than Kami, it makes some amount of sense that a wish from the regular dragonballs couldn’t overcome the power of the Blackstar Dragonballs. However I definitely wouldn’t call that an obvious conclusion

[DanielSSJ]

I don't remember such a thing being said.

While it was never outright named, it is assumed that the planet the Saiyans lived before Plant was Sadala. "Sadala" is only mentioned as the name of the home planet of the Saiyans from Universe 6. Considering how much Universe 6 and Universe 7 are alike (as they should...), it is quite possible that the planet the Universe 7 Saiyans lived before Plant was Sadala as well. All of this is supported by Vegeta recognizing Cabba's armor somehow... (Did Saiyans have a museum or something?).

Just looked it up. It's brought up when Goku and Vegeta meet Cabba in the Champa arc. According to Vegeta, in their universe, Planet Sadla fell after a civil war broke out, so they conquered another planet and named it Vegeta.

Spoiler:

[Grimlock]

Damn. I was going off the top of my head, I remembered Vegeta recognizing Cabba's armor but I couldn't remember "planet Sadala" actually being name dropped for Universe 7 (it's also in the anime continuity). But yeah, Saiyans lived on Sadala and then they went straight to Plant.

My question remains, though: how does Vegeta know any of this? Did Saiyans have History class? Did they have school!? I mean, if we maintain that Vegeta was born in AGE 732 and that he got out of the incubator by AGE 734/5, he lived about four years on the planet. Bit of a stretch to have such a deep knowledge of the Saiyan history, if you ask me. Let's recall he didn't know about Super Saiyan God...

[DanielSSJ]

Damn. I was going off the top of my head, I remembered Vegeta recognizing Cabba's armor but I couldn't remember "planet Sadala" actually being name dropped for Universe 7 (it's also in the anime continuity). But yeah, Sayans lived on Sadala and then they went straight to Plant.

My question remains, though: how does Vegeta know any of this? Did Saiyans have History class? Did they have school!? I mean, if we maintain that Vegeta was born in AGE 732 and that he got out of the incubator by AGE 734/5, he lived about four years on the planet. Bit of a stretch to have such a deep knowledge of the Saiyan history, if you ask me. Let's recall he didn't know about Super Saiyan God...

I don't think it's that much of a stretch for Vegeta to know these things, regardless of how young he was when the Planet went up in smoke. He was the Prince. Knowng the history and culture would've been his job.

Regarding Super Saiyan God, the lore behind the form is quite different in DBS from how it was in DBZ: Battle of Gods.

Spoiler:

Unlike in Battle of Gods, there was no prior Super Saiyan God in Dragon Ball Super's continuity, and the legend of it was only ever recorded in the Namekian Book of Legends (ugh), so no Saiyan would've ever heard of it.

[Ashur]

I don't remember such a thing being said.

While it was never outright named, it is assumed that the planet the Saiyans lived before Plant was Sadala. "Sadala" is only mentioned as the name of the home planet of the Saiyans from Universe 6. Considering how much Universe 6 and Universe 7 are alike (as they should...), it is quite possible that the planet the Universe 7 Saiyans lived before Plant was Sadala as well. All of this is supported by Vegeta recognizing Cabba's armor somehow... (Did Saiyans have a museum or something?).

Just looked it up. It's brought up when Goku and Vegeta meet Cabba in the Champa arc. According to Vegeta, in their universe, Planet Sadla fell after a civil war broke out, so they conquered another planet and named it Vegeta.

Spoiler:

I see, is it in the anime as well? Perhaps i thought it was a headcanon because it's been 7 years since i read that manga chapter lol.

[Grimlock]

Regarding Super Saiyan God, the lore behind the form is quite different in DBS from how it was in DBZ: Battle of Gods.

Spoiler:

Unlike in Battle of Gods, there was no prior Super Saiyan God in Dragon Ball Super's continuity, and the legend of it was only ever recorded in the Namekian Book of Legends (ugh), so no Saiyan would've ever heard of it.

I think they would have heard of it because Super Saiyan God appeared amongst other Saiyans. In fact, Super Saiyan God appeared after Yamoshi transformed into Super Saiyan, when the Saiyans were already living on Plant. If anything, it's Super Saiyan God that should have been the more known legend (though it still doesn't make sense that Dragon Ball Minus brought it up, but then it went completely unheard of in the entirety of Freeza saga).

[DanielSSJ]

I think they would have heard of it because Super Saiyan God appeared amongst other Saiyans. In fact, Super Saiyan God appeared after Yamoshi transformed into Super Saiyan, when the Saiyans were already living on Plant. If anything, it's Super Saiyan God that should have been the more known legend (though it still doesn't make sense that Dragon Ball Minus brought it up, but then it went completely unheard of in the entirety of Freeza saga).

Between the way Toriyama's explanation is worded, and the changes the anime makes to the Battle of Gods storyline, it sounds like Goku was the first actual Super Saiyan God in this continuity. If you watch the episode where Shenlong explains it, all he does is describe the ritual and explain that it was recorded in the Namekian Book of Legends. The story about the previous Super Saiyan God is completely ommitted.

[Grimlock]

I guess I should say I don't follow the anime continuity for this particular portion of the series. So whatever changes there are in there, I don't really care. Although that is an explanation for Vegeta's ignorance towards it.

[DanielSSJ]

I mean, going by the old Battle of Gods continuity, I'd just assume the Super Saiyan God legend is even older than the Super Saiyan legend, to the point where the Saiyans themselves have completely forgotten it.