Your personal canon (AGAIN!)

[ABED]

It seems that the people on here, insofar as they actually do understand what is meant by 'headcanon" like it simply because it's shorter than what they think canon should be, which I would consider as asinine reason to create such a term.

Which would you prefer: "What I personally consider as canon" or "Headcanon"? I don't see the issue with the term. It's simply a representation of its meaning.

Neither because what you consider canon is nonsensical. Canon has nothing to do with what you consider it. This is the sort of confusion I'm referring to.

[Anime Kitten]

Neither because what you consider canon is nonsensical. Canon has nothing to do with what you consider it. This is the sort of confusion I'm referring to.

There's people who like to know what's canon, and when something doesn't have an official canon, they have to put together their own. I don't understand the point of going into a thread about personal canon to only say that you consider the idea nonsensical. Why not just ignore it?

[ABED]

Neither because what you consider canon is nonsensical. Canon has nothing to do with what you consider it. This is the sort of confusion I'm referring to.

There's people who like to know what's canon, and when something doesn't have an official canon, they have to put together their own. I don't understand the point of going into a thread about personal canon to only say that you consider the idea nonsensical. Why not just ignore it?

This is what I'm talking about. Even if we assume there's no official canon (a redundant statement), you can't have your own. Canon is by definition something official.

[Anime Kitten]

Canon is by definition something official.

Not in Dragon Ball, there isn't. Which is, again, why people like to have what they see as canon. There isn't anything saying you have to, though. And speaking of which, I noticed that you overlooked the second part of my post:

I don't understand the point of going into a thread about personal canon to only say that you consider the idea nonsensical. Why not just ignore it?

[ABED]

Canon is by definition something official.

Not in Dragon Ball, there isn't. Which is, again, why people like to have what they see as canon. There isn't anything saying you have to, though. And speaking of which, I noticed that you overlooked the second part of my post:

I don't understand the point of going into a thread about personal canon to only say that you consider the idea nonsensical. Why not just ignore it?

Canon is by definition official. This is what I'm talking about. Some don't understand the concept of what canon is to begin with.

[rereboy]

This is what I'm talking about. Even if we assume there's no official canon (a redundant statement), you can't have your own. Canon is by definition something official.

Except that "head canon" or "personal canon" is just a term for saying "what I would like to be canon, or what it would be canon if I was in charge of things". There is no contradiction with the official nature of canon because something being necessarily official and therefore determined only by official sources doesn't stop me from having a preference about what I would like to see as canon or what would be canon if I was in charge.

The term, using just two words, transmits the concept of an choice for canon brought forth by our preference, and that is perfectly consistent with the objective of saying "what I would like to be canon, or what it would be canon if I was in charge of things", which in no way contradicts the official nature of canon.

Honestly, it's abundantly clear by now that your issue with the term pursues no practical objective, your arguments don't really hold and there's no good reason for so much insistence about it on your part. It boils down to you having a dislike for the term, even though you don't offer better alternatives, and since everyone has already understood that you don't like the term, maybe now the topic can move away from that so that the fans that don't have a problem with the term (in other words, most of the fans) can discuss their personal canons at their leisure.

[Zephyr]

So then why are you barging in here and reminding everyone? What is your aim? What discussion value does pointing that out have? The thread isn't asking how people feel about the term itself. It would be like someone going into a thread about "what was this character's battle power?" to remind everyone how silly they find the word "battle power". Like, more power to you, I guess, but nobody asked who found what terms silly.

Battle power isn't a combination of contradictory terms.

That's not my point. That's very clearly not my point, and yet you've missed my point. I'll feign surprise and confusion.

what you consider canon is nonsensical. Canon has nothing to do with what you consider it.

Even if we assume there's no official canon (a redundant statement), you can't have your own. Canon is by definition something official.

Luckily, the thread is not about what is canon. The thread is about what we individually would like to be canon, what we would prefer to be canon, what we would decree to be canon were we in charge.

There is nothing nonsensical about this.

[TheGreatness25]

Damn, the same old never-ending thing. People will continue to call it "head canon" or "personal canon" because everyone here knows what is being referred to. Let's not ague over the English language and its proper use when we all know what's being talked about. The focus of this thread was how some people choose to sequence the series, no?

[ABED]

That's not my point. That's very clearly not my point, and yet you've missed my point. I'll feign surprise and confusion.

Then stop picking the single worst examples you possible could!

The term, using just two words, transmits the concept of an choice

But it doesn't, which has been my point. It implies that it's a type of canon.

People will continue to call it "head canon" or "personal canon" because everyone here knows what is being referred to.

No they don't hence why there were several posts where Anime Kitten doesn't understand the term and despite what all of your insistence that Headcanon is clear, it's crap like this that should give you pause to think it's not that clear. You simply don't like writing a few extra words. Headcanon is shorter, ergo better, is the crux of your entire argument.

even though you don't offer better alternatives

I have, but you complete disregard them. "what I would like to be canon, or what it would be canon if I was in charge of things" is awfully clear to me or are you so lazy that a few extra words bothers you? Instead of confusing people like Anime Kitten, it's much clearer.

[Kamiccolo9]

He's disregarding your points because you are being intentionally obtuse.

[Anime Kitten]

I'm not confused about headcanon; I understand it full well. What my knowledge lacks in is what you hope to accomplish by coming into a thread about what one considers canon and boldly proclaiming that you think it's nonsensical. I don't believe you're going to convince anyone else of the same mindset.

I'll quote it again:

I don't understand the point of going into a thread about personal canon to only say that you consider the idea nonsensical. Why not just ignore it?

[Ajay]

Since everyone has already understood that you don't like the term, maybe now the topic can move away from that so that the fans that don't have a problem with the term can discuss their personal canons at their leisure.

Agreed.

Look, canon and Dragon Ball are not easy things to talk about, but ABED, you're being disruptive, and I think you know that.

There's a conversation to be had about this stuff, but not in a place with clearly outlined terms and obvious intentions.

By all means open up a thread about the definition of canon and how it relates to Dragon Ball, but let's try and keep things on-topic, here.

Thanks!

[rereboy]

I have, but you complete disregard them. "what I would like to be canon, or what it would be canon if I was in charge of things" is awfully clear to me or are you so lazy that a few extra words bothers you? Instead of confusing people like Anime Kitten, it's much clearer.

That's not an alternative term, that's actually the full and detailed description/definition of the concept.

The objective of the term is to refer to the concept in an easy and effective manner instead of an full and detailed description/definition. You offered no term that does the job better than the ones being used.

And no, someone using a term that refers to a concept that could otherwise be refereed to in a detailed and full explanation/description is not lazy. That's actually basically how language works. Every single term in a dictionary or encyclopedia has a full and detailed explanation and description. Are we lazy then whenever we use a term instead of a full and detailed explanation/description about the concept that the term refers to?

If you or anyone else wants to use a full description every time you want to refer the concept, no one will stop you. But the terms being used here instead of it confuse basically no one and you have no actual arguments or alternatives to their use besides your dislike for them, so I see no point in insisting that people shouldn't use them.

[FreddleFrooby]

My personal canon:

- Bardock - The Father of Goku
- Original Dragon Ball anime
- Dragon Ball Z Kai (Saiyan and Namek arcs and the Mecha Freeza bit of the Android arc)
- Coola's Revenge
- History of Trunks
- Dragon Ball Z Kai (rest of the Android arc and Cell arc)
- Bojack Unbound
- Dragon Ball Z Kai: The Final Chapters (Boo arc)
- Wrath of the Dragon
- Dragon Ball Super (anime)
- End of Z
- Dragon Ball GT (as an alternate reality where Super doesn't happen, as Xenoverse suggests)
- Dragon Ball Online's backstory
- Dragon Ball Xenoverse
- Dragon Ball Xenoverse 2

[ABED]

I have, but you complete disregard them. "what I would like to be canon, or what it would be canon if I was in charge of things" is awfully clear to me or are you so lazy that a few extra words bothers you? Instead of confusing people like Anime Kitten, it's much clearer.

That's not an alternative term, that's actually the full and detailed description/definition of the concept.

The objective of the term is to refer to the concept in an easy and effective manner instead of an full and detailed description/definition. You offered no term that does the job better than the ones being used.

And no, someone using a term that refers to a concept that could otherwise be refereed to in a detailed and full explanation/description is not lazy. That's actually basically how language works. Every single term in a dictionary or encyclopedia has a full and detailed explanation and description. Are we lazy then whenever we use a term instead of a full and detailed explanation/description about the concept that the term refers to?

If you or anyone else wants to use a full description every time you want to refer the concept, no one will stop you. But the terms being used here instead of it confuse basically no one and you have no actual arguments or alternatives to their use besides your dislike for them, so I see no point in insisting that people shouldn't use them.

You don't need a term for it. It's short and easy enough. "What I would like to be canon" is seven short clear words. And of course this is lazy. Language doesn't work the way you claim it does. Definitions subsume similar items. Canon and what you want are NOT the same. Full descriptions? Good lord, it's seven words. And the irony is so delicious. Someone not a few posts ago was in fact confused.

[Anime Kitten]

You don't need a term for it. It's short and easy enough. "What I would like to be canon" is seven short clear words.

Canon and what you want are NOT the same.

I have nothing to add to this but another quote:

The irony is so delicious.

[ABED]

I have no idea what you are getting at especially since you were the one that didn't understand what "canon" means. I've done what Ajay asked and created another thread regarding this issue.

[Anime Kitten]

I have no idea what you are getting at especially since you were the one that didn't understand what "canon" means.

All I was saying was that you contradicted many of your previous points by defining headcanon. And I didn't say I didn't understand canon; I said there is no "official" canon.

But I'll stop dragging this on, seeing as it's been moved.

[ABED]

How was that a contradiction?

[Anime Kitten]

How was that a contradiction?

Because, the entire time here, you've been opposed to the idea of personal canon, and then you outright say that it's a simple seven-word phrase, and return once more to your previous stance by saying that canon and what someone wants are not the same.