I don't mind the stated reason why Broli is mad (at Goku / all the time)

[coola]

I keep reading some Youtube comments, about how dumb it is, that the reason Broly is mad, was because Kakarotto cried a lot, to be honest, that sound lke something Toriyama would do (at least modern Toriyama) in what way it is more bizarre, than God of destruction destroying your planet if, for example, you put two sugar cubes in his tea, instead of three?

[TheGreatness25]

I mean, it is kind of a dumb reason for Dragon Ball -- well, don't get me wrong, Beerus's reasons are also dumb, but Broly is a bit more psychological than other characters. I feel like other characters' motivations are pretty shallow and obvious. Broly has deep-routed psychological motivations. But like the Team Four Star parody addresses, the fact that Broly is driven by his hate for Goku crying as a baby versus King Vegeta trying to murder him in a very primitive way, is a little absurd. But still, all-in-all, it's okay. Psychologically, it's plausible that he'd be traumatized by Goku that way, just not likely.

Honestly, I hated Broly because my first exposure to him was against Gohan, Goten, and Trunks. I always liked movie 8 (where he sort of had some vocabulary), but his fans drove me to hate him much more than I actually realized I did. Now that I've had time to digest it all, he's not bad. In fact, he's probably the best movie villain in my opinion.

There's nothing wrong with Broly or his motivations. The only issue was his ridiculous fan base. But now that the tide has turned and he's one of the most hated things in Dragon Ball, the truth is that he's not that bad. We don't have to go extreme with everyone. It's not necessary to have a "We either love him more than anyone else or wish that Toei burned every frame with him in it!" mentality.

[Gog]

It's just a really dumb, dumb idea. But yeah, different strokes for different folks

[rereboy]

Many take the "Broly is crazy because Goku cried" as fact. I, personally, don't, and I have other interpretation on the movie/Broly. So, I think it's unfortunate that the status quo is the acceptance that "Broly is crazy because Goku cried" notion, instead of a more in-depth analysis regarding the intentions of the guys that made the movie especially regarding the crying scene, its meaning, its placement and repetition as Broly is being defeated.

Therefore, I don't mind the "reason" because I don't interpret the movie that way.

[Gog]

Many take the "Broly is crazy because Goku cried" as fact. I, personally, don't, and I have other interpretation on the movie/Broly. So, I think it's unfortunate that the status quo is the acceptance that "Broly is crazy because Goku cried" notion, instead of a more in-depth analysis regarding the intentions of the guys that made the movie especially regarding the crying scene, its meaning, its placement and repetition as Broly is being defeated.

Therefore, I don't mind the "reason" because I don't interpret the movie that way.

You have a point, we can't look on it as a literal scene, as that would just be plain idiotic. But we also can't look it as a deep, and metaphorical scene, as Goku being weaker than Broly, and still managing to get on his nerves. That also doesn't work, even though its better, as that would require Goku, and Broly to have a history together, for him to get under his skin

[Cetra]

Or we can look at it from both at the same time.

[nickzambuto]

I never understood why it wasn't a fine idea. For a newborn baby to be greeted into the world by nonstop wailing and probably be deprived of sleep for a long period of time over it is certainly traumatic. Let's just get one thing straight; Broli is already a mentally unhinged individual. The crying was just the first trauma. Then he received a near-death experience, and I assume his overflow of power also caused some negative mental effects. Then he spent years under repressive mind control, and when he at last gained freedom, all those emotions just came pouring out at once. He remembers Kakarot because that's how he was greeted into the world. It's definitely the least traumatic of all his experiences, but it also defines all those experiences simply because it came first. If that makes sense.

[SingleFringe&Sparks]

It does sound like what Toriyama would do, but just like the pudding crisis scenario in BoG. Problem is for a serious plot people find it far too trivial to be the basis of an entire character's motivation to define a conflict. At least I do. Of all the lore, behind the Saiyans its very disappointing that the potential of another figure head to the concept is just so poorly characterized. If its a gag, a gag stays within a closed joke, but if its the center of a character's backstory it will follow the character in all their incarnations. The very factor of the crying of all things, sticks out among everything else about the character that could have been more of a plausible basis.

You have a point, we can't look on it as a literal scene, as that would just be plain idiotic. But we also can't look it as a deep, and metaphorical scene, as Goku being weaker than Broly, and still managing to get on his nerves. That also doesn't work, even though its better, as that would require Goku, and Broly to have a history together, for him to get under his skin

I always had my own interpretation for it as well in a collective of the whole situation in sequence of that, as opposed to isolating the absurdity of it being the only thing that directly lead into the sum of his character. However the problem is you're never given a thorough perspective from Boly's side of it beyond the generic, typical villain threats and "Kakarot".

[Thanos]

As much as I've grown to dislike Broli, ya know, basically becoming the Pikachu of Dragon Ball (like in Attack of the Saiyans for DS --here's a bunch of characters from the Saiyan arc... ALSO BROLI!), I never took his reason at face value. It's very simple; Broli hates Goku because Goku cried to much as a baby BECAUSE Broli is a raging mentalist. If he were an otherwise calm, calculated character with complex motives, it would be one thing, but for an insane guy who basically operates under "BROLI SMASH!", a dumb reason like that isn't such a problem for me. Yes, they could have easily done a lot better than what they did, but I think they can get away with it.

I think a more reasonable question would be to ask how Broli knows his name. Even if he did hear the name 'Kakarot' in association with baby Goku, that's quite a feat to not only pick up on that as a fucking infant but remember it some 30 years on. Especially given, ya know, him being crazy and not too bright and all.

[SaiyanZ]

I'm 50/50 on it, but I always thought it was a twist on the Little Albert experiment, where babies were exposed to stimuli of fear and irritation.

[floofychan333]

How would Broly even remember Goku crying? Nobody remembers anything from when they're babies.

[rereboy]

How would Broly even remember Goku crying? Nobody remembers anything from when they're babies.

He doesn't, as I concluded after analyzing the actual movie: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=37309

Also, as I also concluded, nowhere is it stated or even implied that Broly "hates" Goku or that his crying as a baby had any influence on Broly.

[floofychan333]

How would Broly even remember Goku crying? Nobody remembers anything from when they're babies.

He doesn't, as I concluded after analyzing the actual movie: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=37309

Also, as I also concluded, nowhere is it stated or even implied that Broly "hates" Goku or that his crying as a baby had any influence on Broly.

I thought that was the general consensus? More importantly, how does Broly even know Goku exists since they only saw each other as babies?

[Kendamu]

It is dumb, though. I don't remember anything from before age three except for one time I fell down the stairs, one time I was in the back of a car, and one time I was in a playpen watching the end credits of Batman '66 on TV. They're all very faint memories. I have no clue who was to my left at the hospital whenever I was in the... baby room(?) after I was born. I don't remember any of their crying either. I'm pretty sure none of you remember the name of the child to your left or whether they cried a lot based on your own memory, either.

It's just really dumb!

They could've done anything else! Like, maybe Broli felt the energy of a bunch of Super Saiyans on Earth and it caused him to get super excited for a challenge and go on a rampage that destroyed an entire galaxy. Because Paragus couldn't keep Broli under control (and because revenge), he brings Vegeta to the doomed New Vegeta to make sure he dies when the planet is hit with the comet. With him out of the way, there shouldn't be such a huge power to excite him out of his mind-controlled state.

Son Goku, however, also shows up unexpected and does his normal Son Goku thing of prodding a potentially super strong opponent into a fight. He even shows off his Full Power Super Saiyan state that him and Son Gohan mastered for the upcoming Cell Game. That pushes Broli over the edge and the rest of the movie happens.

Still dumb, but it's regular old Dragon Ball dumb fun (like villains killing and causing mass destruction over minor inconveniences). Instead, they do this extra dumb crying baby thing. I guess it might've worked when I was nine years old, though. So it has that going for it.

[Cipher]

He doesn't, as I concluded after analyzing the actual movie: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=37309

Also, as I also concluded, nowhere is it stated or even implied that Broly "hates" Goku or that his crying as a baby had any influence on Broly.

I think he actually does have some recollection of the crying though, right? In Movie 11, hearing Goten's is what sets him off.

I've always been okay with this one, as far as stupid villain origins go. I've never interpreted it as him having literal, crystal-clear memories from his time as a baby. Just the vaguest memory of discomfort and Kakarot's name, with the idea that Goku is special enough to have rattled even this monstrously powerful Saiyan.

As far as applying dubious real-world logic to it, no one retains memories from their time as babies, so remembering a name is a bit of a stretch, but infants can definitely pick up lifelong discomfort triggers and phobias. In a silly cartoon world, I'm like whatever about this. Sure; maybe encountering Goku again later in life is enough to break Paragus' control.

This is also the same species that sends babies out to cleanse sentient life from planets. Maybe Saiyan babies are a little more receptive than humans. I feel dumb typing that.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

It is dumb, though. I don't remember anything from before age three except for one time I fell down the stairs, one time I was in the back of a car, and one time I was in a playpen watching the end credits of Batman '66 on TV. They're all very faint memories. I have no clue who was to my left at the hospital whenever I was in the... baby room(?) after I was born. I don't remember any of their crying either. I'm pretty sure none of you remember the name of the child to your left or whether they cried a lot based on your own memory, either.

It's just really dumb!

I'm not disagreeing that it's dumb, but it was implied in the anime that Saiyan babies have a better memory long before the Broly movies came around. Comparing it to real life isn't very useful, a precedent for Broly's (admittedly bullshit) trauma had already been set.

[Kendamu]

It is dumb, though. I don't remember anything from before age three except for one time I fell down the stairs, one time I was in the back of a car, and one time I was in a playpen watching the end credits of Batman '66 on TV. They're all very faint memories. I have no clue who was to my left at the hospital whenever I was in the... baby room(?) after I was born. I don't remember any of their crying either. I'm pretty sure none of you remember the name of the child to your left or whether they cried a lot based on your own memory, either.

It's just really dumb!

I'm not disagreeing that it's dumb, but it was implied in the anime that Saiyan babies have a better memory long before the Broly movies came around. Comparing it to real life isn't very useful, a precedent for Broly's (admittedly bullshit) trauma had already been set.

When was it implied that Saiyan babies have such amazing memory? I don't remember (ha!) what part of the story you're talking about and I've never heard it referenced by anybody else. You'd think it would've come up at least once in a fan discussion about Son Gohan being super smart or something.

[Metalwario64]

I still think movie 8 is one of the better films, and I still feel that the Broly hate is as overblown as the fanboyism. He's not a great, deep character, but he's better than most of the movie villains.

[Cipher]

When was it implied that Saiyan babies have such amazing memory? I don't remember (ha!) what part of the story you're talking about and I've never heard it referenced by anybody else. You'd think it would've come up at least once in a fan discussion about Son Gohan being super smart or something.

They send them off to be independent planet-murderers and assume they won't drown by laying face up in the rain, so that's, uh, something, I guess.

I still think movie 8 is one of the better films, and I still feel that the Broly hate is as overblown as the fanboyism. He's not a great, deep character, but he's better than most of the movie villains.

Agreed.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

When was it implied that Saiyan babies have such amazing memory? I don't remember (ha!) what part of the story you're talking about and I've never heard it referenced by anybody else. You'd think it would've come up at least once in a fan discussion about Son Gohan being super smart or something.

Mainly the fact that Raditz was surprised when Goku didn't remember his "mission", even though he was shown to only have been a baby when he was sent to destroy Earth, that's the first thing that comes to mind. The only reason Goku didn't remember was because of the head injury. Hell, the fact that they're able to get babies to destroy life on planets to begin with shows that Saiyan babies have higher than average intelligence.