Did Super ruin some characters for you?

[Legion]

Maybe it's just me, but one thing that ruins the characters are the exaggerated and unnecessary Toei gag scenes. The manga is more serious, for example...

[Jinzoningen MULE]

I don't mind the comedy like most people seem to. Toei didn't "ruin" any characters for me, but lord, have they turned Vegeta into the stalest thing on the planet. I'd rather watch paint dry. He hasn't had a solitary interesting moment since the early FT Arc (I really want to say since Cabba, but a lot of people liked Vegeta in episode 54).

[Ki Breaker]

I don't mind the comedy like most people seem to. Toei didn't "ruin" any characters for me, but lord, have they turned Vegeta into the stalest thing on the planet. I'd rather watch paint dry. He hasn't had a solitary interesting moment since the early FT Arc (I really want to say since Cabba, but a lot of people liked Vegeta in episode 54).

Since cabba is a good place to put the mark on..
That seems to be around the time Vegeta lost his appeal to me

[Basaku]

but lord, have they turned Vegeta into the stalest thing on the planet

Super Videl still exists so no

[Jinzoningen MULE]

but lord, have they turned Vegeta into the stalest thing on the planet

Super Videl still exists so no

At least Videl was already uninteresting. The only time she ever shined was in the Saiyaman and very early Boo Arcs.

[Beyond]

Vegeta is still more interesting than most of the cast.

[TheUltimateNinja]

I don't mind the comedy like most people seem to. Toei didn't "ruin" any characters for me, but lord, have they turned Vegeta into the stalest thing on the planet. I'd rather watch paint dry. He hasn't had a solitary interesting moment since the early FT Arc (I really want to say since Cabba, but a lot of people liked Vegeta in episode 54).

I've felt that way about Vegeta since the start of Super. Apparently his "Number One" speech at the end of the Buu Arc never happened.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

I've felt that way about Vegeta since the start of Super. Apparently his "Number One" speech at the end of the Buu Arc never happened.

That speech was made under the pretense that the series was about to permanently end, so I can understand if Toriyama wants to backpedal on that for the sake of indefinite continuation. However, they actually have to do something with him.

[Beyond]

I've felt that way about Vegeta since the start of Super. Apparently his "Number One" speech at the end of the Buu Arc never happened.

That speech was made under the pretense that the series was about to permanently end, so I can understand if Toriyama wants to backpedal on that for the sake of indefinite continuation. However, they actually have to do something with him.

What would you recommend they do?

[Jinzoningen MULE]

I've felt that way about Vegeta since the start of Super. Apparently his "Number One" speech at the end of the Buu Arc never happened.

That speech was made under the pretense that the series was about to permanently end, so I can understand if Toriyama wants to backpedal on that for the sake of indefinite continuation. However, they actually have to do something with him.

What would you recommend they do?

Maybe they could actually follow through on the mentor role they seem to want him in, rather than displaying it in passing once in a blue moon. No matter what, they can't have him be a main character and not progress at all, that only works with Goku.

[TheUltimateNinja]

Maybe they could actually follow through on the mentor role they seem to want him in, rather than displaying it in passing once in a blue moon. No matter what, they can't have him be a main character and not progress at all, that only works with Goku.

Goku's lack of development is essentially a character trait of his, given that he's characterized as being very simpleminded except when it comes to combat it's expected he wouldn't progress much except for the subtle things like starting to do bows and whatnot after his grandpa tells him to and becoming a bit more mature over the years.

On the other hand, most of Z is spent progressing Vegeta's character and his arc finally ends satisfactorily at the end of the Buu Arc, however in Super he's somehow regressed to his Cell Arc-Early Majin Buu Arc self and is apparently permanently stuck there.

[TheMathemagician]

Maybe they could actually follow through on the mentor role they seem to want him in, rather than displaying it in passing once in a blue moon. No matter what, they can't have him be a main character and not progress at all, that only works with Goku.

Goku's lack of development is essentially a character trait of his, given that he's characterized as being very simpleminded except when it comes to combat it's expected he wouldn't progress much except for the subtle things like starting to do bows and whatnot after his grandpa tells him to and becoming a bit more mature over the years.

On the other hand, most of Z is spent progressing Vegeta's character and his arc finally ends satisfactorily at the end of the Buu Arc, however in Super he's somehow regressed to his Cell Arc-Early Majin Buu Arc self and is apparently permanently stuck there.

He's not really stuck there. It's only really the fact that Super has him still getting jealous of Goku. I have no problem with him wanting to stay competitive, but I cringe whenever I see him get jealous.

[Basaku]

At least Videl was already uninteresting. The only time she ever shined was in the Saiyaman and very early Boo Arcs.

That's just brutal Mule Even if true

[TheUltimateNinja]

Maybe they could actually follow through on the mentor role they seem to want him in, rather than displaying it in passing once in a blue moon. No matter what, they can't have him be a main character and not progress at all, that only works with Goku.

Goku's lack of development is essentially a character trait of his, given that he's characterized as being very simpleminded except when it comes to combat it's expected he wouldn't progress much except for the subtle things like starting to do bows and whatnot after his grandpa tells him to and becoming a bit more mature over the years.

On the other hand, most of Z is spent progressing Vegeta's character and his arc finally ends satisfactorily at the end of the Buu Arc, however in Super he's somehow regressed to his Cell Arc-Early Majin Buu Arc self and is apparently permanently stuck there.

He's not really stuck there. It's only really the fact that Super has him still getting jealous of Goku. I have no problem with him wanting to stay competitive, but I cringe whenever I see him get jealous.

That's literally him regressing, though. His jealousy was kind of his whole thing back then, he finally learned to accept Goku's superiority at the end of the Buu Arc but now he's back to his old ways.

[Dbzk1999]

Goku's lack of development is essentially a character trait of his, given that he's characterized as being very simpleminded except when it comes to combat it's expected he wouldn't progress much except for the subtle things like starting to do bows and whatnot after his grandpa tells him to and becoming a bit more mature over the years.

On the other hand, most of Z is spent progressing Vegeta's character and his arc finally ends satisfactorily at the end of the Buu Arc, however in Super he's somehow regressed to his Cell Arc-Early Majin Buu Arc self and is apparently permanently stuck there.

He's not really stuck there. It's only really the fact that Super has him still getting jealous of Goku. I have no problem with him wanting to stay competitive, but I cringe whenever I see him get jealous.

That's literally him regressing, though. His jealousy was kind of his whole thing back then, he finally learned to accept Goku's superiority at the end of the Buu Arc but now he's back to his old ways.

Until we see him literally sell his soul in an attempt to one up Goku, I wouldn't say that he's back to his old ways.

[TheUltimateNinja]

He's not really stuck there. It's only really the fact that Super has him still getting jealous of Goku. I have no problem with him wanting to stay competitive, but I cringe whenever I see him get jealous.

That's literally him regressing, though. His jealousy was kind of his whole thing back then, he finally learned to accept Goku's superiority at the end of the Buu Arc but now he's back to his old ways.

Until we see him literally sell his soul in an attempt to one up Goku, I wouldn't say that he's back to his old ways.

That was out of desperation since Goku would only be there for one day and he realized he was still far below him. Right now he's almost as strong as Goku and Goku is around to spar whenever he wants, it's not nearly the same.

[Jinzoningen MULE]

Until we see him literally sell his soul in an attempt to one up Goku, I wouldn't say that he's back to his old ways.

The only reason he "sold his soul" was because Goku was dead at the time. Vegeta saw his opportunity to best Kakarot waning, he knew that it was his last chance, so he went for broke. Keep in mind that by this time, he intimately cared for his family, there's no way he would have done what he did unless he thought that it was necessary for sustaining his pride as a man (Saiyan, whatever). Even at that, he almost immediately regretted the decision, and took back his rationality like it was nothing.

It was a totally different situation, you can't judge his peacetime personality against his desperate state of mind in this way.

[GodVegetto91]

Well i'll tell you who it ruined..

Vegetto!!!

[Jinzoningen MULE]

Well i'll tell you who it ruined..

Vegetto!!!

By nerfing him? Cheat codes are a bad thing. The fact that they brought Vegetto down a few pegs wasn't a problem, the fact that they blatantly contradicted previous explanations was.

If anything, Vegetto is better now that they don't have the option of abusing him.

[Cipher]

At least Videl was already uninteresting. The only time she ever shined was in the Saiyaman and very early Boo Arcs.

So ... basically any time she's given something to do?