What if Vegeta's UI is...?

[KingKaash]

What if Vegeta's UI is the offensive side of UI? In Episode 117, when Vegeta goes on the offensive against Katopesla, Whis states that the offensive attacks are more suited for Vegeta. Before that, Vegeta was trying to awaken UI within himself. So would you find it interesting if Vegeta learned how to attack on instinct while Goku is able to defend on instinct? As we all know, Goku manages to defend himself from almost any harm but using UI to dodge almost any attack but he struggles to focus an attack with being in UI. So therefore, Vegeta would be able to attack almost anyone but be so focused on attacking that he'd leave himself open on defense. I think it'd be an interesting way to have Vegeta keep pace with Goku without exactly copying him. But I didn't think Vegeta needs to unlock a new technique here in the ToP with all that's going on.

[Avenant]

If this is true, it would be a good setup for Vegetto.

[sintzu]

They'd balance each other in a team fight, goku would defend vegeta while vegeta would attack for goku.

[Ki Breaker]

They'd balance each other in a team fight, goku would defend vegeta while vegeta would attack for goku.

Vegetto would be crazy strong..

Although, I think whis meant Vegeta is simply better off fighting like he usually does right now, punching stuff really hard

[TBMx]

They'd balance each other in a team fight, goku would defend vegeta while vegeta would attack for goku.

Vegetto would be crazy strong..

Although, I think whis meant Vegeta is simply better off fighting like he usually does right now, punching stuff really hard

Whis was all like, remember your place Vegeta. That of the useless jobber. Don't get any ideas.

[Simere]

They'd balance each other in a team fight, goku would defend vegeta while vegeta would attack for goku.

There's no reason to attack Goku if Vegeta can't defend himself. It'd be as stupid as an AI in a video game ignoring your caster they can one shot to instead attack your unkillable tank.

[GodKaio-Ken]

It's a silly idea. So Jiren is going to punch at Goku who can't inflict any damage while Vegeta punches him?

Also Whis already stated the offensive side is much harder to master.

[TBMx]

They'd balance each other in a team fight, goku would defend vegeta while vegeta would attack for goku.

Vegeta would be able to defend himself just fine.

This is how Attack UI would work for Vegeta as this is likely Toriyama's inspiration behind the form:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0_LnvJrLo4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xyGQdzv-5kk

[sintzu]

They'd balance each other in a team fight, goku would defend vegeta while vegeta would attack for goku.

There's no reason to attack Goku if Vegeta can't defend himself. It'd be as stupid as an AI in a video game ignoring your caster they can one shot to instead attack your unkillable tank.

Both of course would be able to attack and defend but with each being better at one than the other it'll make a team fight interesting as each will make up what the other isn't perfect at.

Vegeta could attack in ways Goku couldn't while Goku would defend against attacks Vegeta wouldn't see coming.

[Simere]

They'd balance each other in a team fight, goku would defend vegeta while vegeta would attack for goku.

Vegeta would be able to defend himself just fine.

This is how Attack UI would work for Vegeta as this is likely Toriyama's inspiration behind the form:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N0_LnvJrLo4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xyGQdzv-5kk

When the opponent expands, I contract. You're ignoring the defensive foundation before the attack. Every dodge, every parry, every block, every slip is a defensive movement before the opportunity to hit presents itself. You can't attack if you can't defend.

Both of course would be able to attack and defend but with each being better at one than the other it'll make a team fight interesting as each will make up what the other isn't perfect at.

Talking about Jiren, The only way Goku can defend against him is because of UI. You can't have Vegeta defending in any way against Jiren without UI.

[TBMx]

When the opponent expands, I contract. You're ignoring the defensive foundation before the attack. Every dodge, every parry, every block, every slip is a defensive movement before the opportunity to hit presents itself. You can't attack if you can't defend.

No I'm not. If you can attack in the right spot everytime and with perfect timing, which is the only thing UI attack could conceivably be, then you can defend yourself by hitting them before they connect with their attack, and intercepting energy beams with your own.

[Simere]

When the opponent expands, I contract. You're ignoring the defensive foundation before the attack. Every dodge, every parry, every block, every slip is a defensive movement before the opportunity to hit presents itself. You can't attack if you can't defend.

No I'm not. If you can attack in the right spot everytime and with perfect timing, which is the only thing UI attack could conceivably be, then you can defend yourself by hitting them before they connect with their attack, and intercepting energy beams with your own.

Rather than argue that those are defensive actions you would need so-called "defensive UI" for, I'll instead point out that there would be no need for "defensive UI" if you can use your "offensive UI" to defend(but not "defensive UI" defend, ) against every incoming attack.

[TBMx]

When the opponent expands, I contract. You're ignoring the defensive foundation before the attack. Every dodge, every parry, every block, every slip is a defensive movement before the opportunity to hit presents itself. You can't attack if you can't defend.

No I'm not. If you can attack in the right spot everytime and with perfect timing, which is the only thing UI attack could conceivably be, then you can defend yourself by hitting them before they connect with their attack, and intercepting energy beams with your own.

Rather than argue that those are defensive actions you would need so-called "defensive UI" for, I'll instead point out that there would be no need for "defensive UI" if you can use your "offensive UI" to defend(but not "defensive UI" defend, ) against every incoming attack.

The line between defence and attack is blurred anyway. When Goku skids on the kamehameha to get in the perfect position to shoot it point blank, That's using UI to attack and defend. IF Vegeta got UI attack, (I don't think he will get anything at all cos, y'know, Toriyama.) It won't be a strict divide between defence and attack, just like it's not right now, when Goku uses it. It won't be the case that Vegeta becomes defenceless against very strong opponents, just like it isn't the case that Goku's incapable for effective attacks against very strong opponents with UI defence.

It's fine to give Vegeta nothing at all - but actually have it change him as a person. Instead of the usual damn you kakarot, or I'm still the best, or I'll master it better than you - or whatever. It's tiresome. Nobody, but nobody believed him when he said he will master it first. In fact it'd be more appropriate to insert a laughter track at that moment.

[Kaiosama]

Vegeta will not be getting UI in this tourney. They just used him as a gag this last episode

[Simere]

The line between defence and attack is blurred anyway. When Goku skids on the kamehameha to get in the perfect position to shoot it point blank, That's using UI to attack and defend. IF Vegeta got UI attack, (I don't think he will get anything at all cos, y'know, Toriyama.) It won't be a strict divide between defence and attack, just like it's not right now, when Goku uses it. It won't be the case that Vegeta becomes defenceless against very strong opponents, just like it isn't the case that Goku's incapable for effective attacks against very strong opponents with UI defence.

Yes, quite blurred; that's why I argue breaking UI up into separate parts of a whole only makes surface level sense. Saying it'd be more like "emphasized offense" is better...but still runs contrary to the concept, and wouldn't naturally force them to team up like the two halves idea.

It's fine to give Vegeta nothing at all - but actually have it change him as a person. Instead of the usual damn you kakarot, or I'm still the best, or I'll master it better than you - or whatever. It's tiresome. Nobody, but nobody believed him when he said he will master it first. In fact it'd be more appropriate to insert a laughter track at that moment.

Your cynicism keeps producing great ideas for belittling Vegeta. I think I'll go add that laugh track myself.

[GodKaio-Ken]

No I'm not. If you can attack in the right spot everytime and with perfect timing, which is the only thing UI attack could conceivably be, then you can defend yourself by hitting them before they connect with their attack, and intercepting energy beams with your own.

Rather than argue that those are defensive actions you would need so-called "defensive UI" for, I'll instead point out that there would be no need for "defensive UI" if you can use your "offensive UI" to defend(but not "defensive UI" defend, ) against every incoming attack.

The line between defence and attack is blurred anyway. When Goku skids on the kamehameha to get in the perfect position to shoot it point blank, That's using UI to attack and defend. IF Vegeta got UI attack, (I don't think he will get anything at all cos, y'know, Toriyama.) It won't be a strict divide between defence and attack, just like it's not right now, when Goku uses it. It won't be the case that Vegeta becomes defenceless against very strong opponents, just like it isn't the case that Goku's incapable for effective attacks against very strong opponents with UI defence.

It's fine to give Vegeta nothing at all - but actually have it change him as a person. Instead of the usual damn you kakarot, or I'm still the best, or I'll master it better than you - or whatever. It's tiresome. Nobody, but nobody believed him when he said he will master it first. In fact it'd be more appropriate to insert a laughter track at that moment.

That's the whole reason Goku used the Kamehameha. It was the only attack he could unconsciously charge while in the state of UI. In other words the only attack he could use in UI. He WAS using it offensively and defensively that was the entire point. He could use his defensive UI with an attack that didnt require any thought more or less.

[Jigurashi]

More than likely Goku will get "both aspects" of UI in time for his second bout with Jiren. Vegeta will get UI off-screen for the next saga at some point.

[TBMx]

Rather than argue that those are defensive actions you would need so-called "defensive UI" for, I'll instead point out that there would be no need for "defensive UI" if you can use your "offensive UI" to defend(but not "defensive UI" defend, ) against every incoming attack.

The line between defence and attack is blurred anyway. When Goku skids on the kamehameha to get in the perfect position to shoot it point blank, That's using UI to attack and defend. IF Vegeta got UI attack, (I don't think he will get anything at all cos, y'know, Toriyama.) It won't be a strict divide between defence and attack, just like it's not right now, when Goku uses it. It won't be the case that Vegeta becomes defenceless against very strong opponents, just like it isn't the case that Goku's incapable for effective attacks against very strong opponents with UI defence.

It's fine to give Vegeta nothing at all - but actually have it change him as a person. Instead of the usual damn you kakarot, or I'm still the best, or I'll master it better than you - or whatever. It's tiresome. Nobody, but nobody believed him when he said he will master it first. In fact it'd be more appropriate to insert a laughter track at that moment.

That's the whole reason Goku used the Kamehameha. It was the only attack he could unconsciously charge while in the state of UI. In other words the only attack he could use in UI. He WAS using it offensively and defensively that was the entire point. He could use his defensive UI with an attack that didnt require any thought more or less.

He managed to knee Jiren and land the hit clean because of the offensive abilities of the transformation. He could never land a clean hit in any other form.

[KingKaash]

More than likely Goku will get "both aspects" of UI in time for his second bout with Jiren. Vegeta will get UI off-screen for the next saga at some point.

Ultimately I think this will be the outcome. The off-screen part would be lame though. I kind of hoped we'd see SSJG Vegeta in the ToP since we'd never seen it before but that probably won't come to fruition

Also Whis already stated the offensive side is much harder to master.

True Whis did say attacking while in UI is more difficult

[GodVegetto91]

More than likely Goku will get "both aspects" of UI in time for his second bout with Jiren. Vegeta will get UI off-screen for the next saga at some point.

Yeah that sounds like the most probable thing to happen indeed.