Is original Dragon Ball really that unpopular?

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

In a similar vein to the GT thread I think it would be worth asking is original Dragon Ball really as unpopular as we're often led to believe?

A trend I've noticed is that a lot of the territories that aired Z first were following in North America's footsteps. For example all European countries that aired the series in English (Ireland, UK, Netherlands, Finland and Belgium) started with the Saban dub of Z, which AB Groupe at the time received from Funimation before they later began distributing the Westwood Media dubs to those territories. Although Belgium is rumoured to have aired the French dub of original Dragon Ball in 1998, before Kanaal 2 picked up the English dubs. South Africa, as far as I'm aware didn't air original Dragon Ball on SABC back in 2003-2005, but Z and GT aired with the American dubs. Australia and New Zealand, which also imported Funimation's dub aired both Dragon Ball Z and original Dragon Ball, but aired the former first.

Of course we all know the story of original Dragon Ball's run on American TV. Harmony Gold likely quit dubbing because they didn't know how to censor it further, and didn't get their dub on many channels. Funimation initially gave up after 13 episodes until they partnered with Saban and jumped to Z, a decision which has probably led to generations thinking the franchise is "Dragon Ball Z" because that's what most people saw first, although it never invalidated original Dragon Ball.

The Philippines aired Dragon Ball Z first, apparently because William and Nancy Co, the owners of Creative Corp Products heard it being advertised as "Asia's number 1 cartoon" and wanted to dub the more action-oriented show. They did however take a break from Z and ended up dubbing most of original Dragon Ball, which was more than they dubbed of Z.

On the other hand there are many other countries where original Dragon Ball aired first, like all of Latin America, the Arabic world, France, Germany, Greece, Hong Kong, Hungary, Malaysia, Poland and possibly Portugal, Switzerland and Turkey too. Other countries like Kosovo and mainland China only ever aired original Dragon Ball. Vietnam also went back and dubbed original Dragon Ball after Kai, when Z had been established as the more popular series worldwide, although that doesn't mean original Dragon Ball didn't do well in its own right.

Clearly many fans around the world were introduced to the original series first and they didn't love Dragon Ball any less than territories that started with Z first, and the fans who caught the original Dragon Ball airings quite enjoyed the show.

[Shiningboltsurge]

I think it has more to do with how the anime industry specifically the old school production companies in Japan, in this case toei’s handling of foreign distribution as a hazard afterthought to then a curated given of which the dragon ball anime adaptation was caught up in the current of that transformation leading the the anime booms in various western territories during the 90’s and 2000’s that caused localization standards to actually become a thing. This is also what all my threads and posts are about discussing.

[MasenkoHA]

I wouldn’t say it's unpopular, just very much in Dragon Ball Z's shadow.

And whereas fans usually have strong opinions on GT and Super, either positive or negative, I usually never really see any strong opinions on the original series. OG Dragon Ball's placement on most fans list seems dependent on how they feel about Super and GT.

On the other hand, I do see fans, although a minority, who actually PREFER the original Dragon Ball to Z. I have never in my life known anyone who liked GT the best and can count on one hand how many times I've seen someone cite Super as their absolute favorite of the 4.

[Goe]

I am a Dragon Ball fan since 90s and this is the first time I read Original Dragon Ball is unpopular.

In Japan, Dragon Ball wasn't popular at the beggining, when the manga started in Shonen Jump, but became popular in the first Tenkaichi Budokai. Toriyama and Torishima remembered that contests were successful in Dr. Slump, so they tried and popularity increased. My only reference about DB being unpopular is that.

[Dragon Ball Ireland]

I usually never really see any strong opinions on the original series. OG Dragon Ball's placement on most fans list seems dependent on how they feel about Super and GT.

I would say fan's feelings on original Dragon Ball depends on how they feel about Z, particularly when it comes to fans of Funimation's reversioning. Generally original Dragon Ball is seen as inferior by fans who argue Z has more action, less adventure and wacky comedy, or superior by fans that see it as Toriyama's writing peak. I'd lean more towards the latter, but I have seen strong defenses for both. I think Funimation's reversioning has influenced the former, as many fans like to argue the series evolved when Z came along into something more action and sci-fi focused that appeals to them more. Of course most of us here see Z as being no different from original Dragon Ball, which always had sci-fi elements like hoi poi capsules, hovering cars and big battles even if they were less spectacle and more choreography-based, and it's all one story from Pilaf to Boo.

[Dr. Casey]

I am a Dragon Ball fan since 90s and this is the first time I read Original Dragon Ball is unpopular.

In Japan, Dragon Ball wasn't popular at the beggining, when the manga started in Shonen Jump, but became popular in the first Tenkaichi Budokai. Toriyama and Torishima remembered that contests were successful in Dr. Slump, so they tried and popularity increased. My only reference about DB being unpopular is that.

As someone that knows close to nothing about Dr. Slump: contests?

[VegettoEX]

As someone that knows close to nothing about Dr. Slump: contests?

Dr. Slump is generally episodic-to-the-chapter for most of its early run, and then starts dabbling in two-chapter stories. Around the 100-chapter mark, we start getting longer four-to-five chapter "story arcs" (hesitant to use that phrase, but it's the most appropriate) for things like races (yes, actual like running/biking/cycling/skateboarding races through town), and then even fighting competitions. Around this time, Dr. Mashirito is also repeatedly returning (more often) to attack Arale with the Caramel Men.

[Hellspawn28]

Maybe to the North American audience because most of them saw DBZ first and feel like the first DB show is not really needed to them. I think skipping straight to DBZ after the Pilaf saga in North America was a double edge sword. It help the series become more popular, but it also called many people just to assume that you don't need to watch the other half of the series. Most people watch DBZ on Toonami were small children that didn't pay much detail to the story and just watch it for the fight scenes.

When I was getting to DB, I was confused by some of the flashbacks in DBZ because it felt like if I missed a episode or two. Later learning that Funimation didn't dub the rest of the first DB show.

[Cure Dragon 255]

I am a Dragon Ball fan since 90s and this is the first time I read Original Dragon Ball is unpopular.

In Japan, Dragon Ball wasn't popular at the beggining, when the manga started in Shonen Jump, but became popular in the first Tenkaichi Budokai. Toriyama and Torishima remembered that contests were successful in Dr. Slump, so they tried and popularity increased. My only reference about DB being unpopular is that.

I was going to mention this one exact thing too. Dragon Ball as awesome as it is, takes a while to make a homerun and this makes less patient people overlook it. And back when it premiered in Latin America it was a sensational success and when it hit the Piccolo Daimao arc became MUST SEE TV like it was when it premiered in Japan. But now that all the twists have been spoiled and there is no hype or build up excitement its way harder to see what was so good about OG Dragon Ball.

Huh, this post wasnt meant to be this thoughtful and rational. I actually just wanted to put "OG Dragon Ball is just less atractive to international licensee's than Z" wow.

[WittyUsername]

I don’t know if “unpopular” is the right word, but in terms of English speaking countries at the very least, it’s easily the most overlooked. Even Japan seems to overlook it to some extent, as the games tend to ignore anything that predates Raditz, and Kai skims over it in the prologue of the first episode.

[MCDaveG]

I wouldn't say unpopular, but as many said, in DBZ shadow... DBZ is kinda like the Original Trilogy in Star Wars, setting up overall standards.
Dragon Ball was huge hit in Germany and pretty much around Europe. I remember it being advertised in teasers and trailers on RTL II with kung fu movie vibes, with Giran stepping into the bar and taking people out plus the Budokai.
Kung fu/Wuxia movies were incredibly popular in Europe, from classics with Bruce Lee, 36th Chamber Of Shaolin up to Jackie Chan and those action flicks with cops. Also, The Monkey King/Saiyuki series was huge. It aired probably everywhere.
DBZ ran afterwards and was marketed as next step.

While being one series in manga, what didn't help in the long run was the "midway" rebranding in anime to Z.
DB failing in US and Z being the mainstay virtually without it's first half of story is also not helping the show at all.
But many people love it. Many people outside of US grew watching it and followed with the Z sequel.
What doesn't help in general besides it being different brand on screen is that the focus is usually on the most recent stories and characters – the fighting, power scaling, techniques, the character models and their transformations in Z are the staple of the show overall and when the games are produced, the focus is clear and it's hard to bring in Dragon Ball in the mix – as all the characters would need different models and being different versions of their Z selves, plus they fly now and the combat mechanics are something else.
And while the 23rd Budokai era is basically proto Z from anime standpoint and the characters are halfway there (you can use the Saiyan arc characters more or less), it again comes down to the different branding on screen and our beloved companies not willing to mesh DB and Z together like that. It's either kid Goku stories hence DB, or adult Goku and DBZ. Funnily enough, the 23rd Budokai gets lost somewhere in the middle very often, for few exceptions on SNES and Nintendo DS and Game Boy if I remember right, where it kicks off the Z story.

So, long story short, an underused but popular series

I think it's different from GT in a way that GT is spin-off of original material not done by the original author except for few designs, while Dragon Ball is there with Z but getting the short straw because of all the various reasons.

[ABED]

I am a Dragon Ball fan since 90s and this is the first time I read Original Dragon Ball is unpopular.

In Japan, Dragon Ball wasn't popular at the beggining, when the manga started in Shonen Jump, but became popular in the first Tenkaichi Budokai. Toriyama and Torishima remembered that contests were successful in Dr. Slump, so they tried and popularity increased. My only reference about DB being unpopular is that.

I was going to mention this one exact thing too. Dragon Ball as awesome as it is, takes a while to make a homerun and this makes less patient people overlook it. And back when it premiered in Latin America it was a sensational success and when it hit the Piccolo Daimao arc became MUST SEE TV like it was when it premiered in Japan. But now that all the twists have been spoiled and there is no hype or build up excitement its way harder to see what was so good about OG Dragon Ball.

Huh, this post wasnt meant to be this thoughtful and rational. I actually just wanted to put "OG Dragon Ball is just less atractive to international licensee's than Z" wow.

That's the perception, but I don't think I'm alone in believing that the 21st Tenkaichi Budokai is one of the best arcs in the entire story. It doesn't take Toriyama long to hit his stride. Sadly many don't agree and overlook DB like it's a prequel.

[Cure Dragon 255]

I am a Dragon Ball fan since 90s and this is the first time I read Original Dragon Ball is unpopular.

In Japan, Dragon Ball wasn't popular at the beggining, when the manga started in Shonen Jump, but became popular in the first Tenkaichi Budokai. Toriyama and Torishima remembered that contests were successful in Dr. Slump, so they tried and popularity increased. My only reference about DB being unpopular is that.

I was going to mention this one exact thing too. Dragon Ball as awesome as it is, takes a while to make a homerun and this makes less patient people overlook it. And back when it premiered in Latin America it was a sensational success and when it hit the Piccolo Daimao arc became MUST SEE TV like it was when it premiered in Japan. But now that all the twists have been spoiled and there is no hype or build up excitement its way harder to see what was so good about OG Dragon Ball.

Huh, this post wasnt meant to be this thoughtful and rational. I actually just wanted to put "OG Dragon Ball is just less atractive to international licensee's than Z" wow.

That's the perception, but I don't think I'm alone in believing that the 21st Tenkaichi Budokai is one of the best arcs in the entire story. It doesn't take Toriyama long to hit his stride. Sadly many don't agree and overlook DB like it's a prequel.

That doesnt contradict anything I said. That's 30 episodes in. That's way more patience needed than most people would ever give out these days.

EDIT:WHOOPS IT WAS ACTUALLY 19 EPISODES. MY BAD SORRY!

[ABED]

14 episodes. The training is part of the arc. And given that One Piece is 1000+, I don't think patience is an issue. People have more patience than you give them credit for.

[Cure Dragon 255]

14 episodes. The training is part of the arc. And given that One Piece is 1000+, I don't think patience is an issue. People have more patience than you give them credit for.

First this still doesnt contradict anything. I dont expect people to give One Piece 19 episodes to get good, In fact despite how much I love Dragon Ball I dont think I would give it 19 episodes to get good nor did I give One Piece that big a chance, I liked what I saw from the get go you are confusing the two, there's patience for sticking with a show and patience you give to a show to see if you like it. and its this second one that is lacking in people nowadays.

You should be saying "Dragon Ball is good from the get go" if you want to be right about this.

[ABED]

14 episodes. The training is part of the arc. And given that One Piece is 1000+, I don't think patience is an issue. People have more patience than you give them credit for.

First this still doesnt contradict anything. I dont expect people to give One Piece 19 episodes to get good, In fact despite how much I love Dragon Ball I dont think I would give it 19 episodes to get good nor did I give One Piece that big a chance, I liked what I saw from the get go you are confusing the two, there's patience for sticking with a show and patience you give to a show to see if you like it. and its this second one that is lacking in people nowadays.

You should be saying "Dragon Ball is good from the get go" if you want to be right about this.

14, and I kept hearing "wait until you get to this storyline, that's when it hits its stride." I don't believe people's patience is that thin nor do I think those THIRTEEN episodes are so off putting to people. Yes, the first DBZ episodes with Raditz are exciting but not everyone who jumped on board with DBZ started with episode 1. And to add to that while those first 5 episodes are pretty tense and action packed, the next nearly 20 episodes aren't so action packed. It's a lot of anticipation and waiting. If we're gonna include opinion, I liked Dragon Ball from the start. The first episode of DB is a lot of fun. It's simple, but very funny.

There's a world of difference between saying a show isn't good from the start and saying it takes some time to hit its stride. DB takes some time to reach its peak, but its enjoyable from the jump, and it doesn't take that long to become great.

So much of this boils down to the show jumping to the middle of the story when it in its prime, which was a great place to jump on board the already moving train, and the unintended consequence being people didn't want to go back before many of the things they enjoyed were there. The very beginning may be the obvious roots but there's a stark contrast. Sadly it gives off the impression that it's not the show they enjoy.

I get what you're saying, but I wasn't confusing those two situations regarding patience. They aren't the same, but there is a link. If you are willing to stick with a show that's THAT long, and I guarentee it's not great through its entire run, then you gotta have enough patience for a story to find its footing. The weird thing is, we're not talking hypotheticals. If someone started watching with DBZ, they know the show becomes something they like. Why not start the story at the beginning? A problem I have with many starting any show is that it's always something of a leap of faith. I don't know if the show will become something I enjoy or even if it starts off as enjoyable, there's a good chance my patience and enjoyment won't be rewarded. At least with DB, I knew it became something I loved.

[Cure Dragon 255]

14 episodes. The training is part of the arc. And given that One Piece is 1000+, I don't think patience is an issue. People have more patience than you give them credit for.

First this still doesnt contradict anything. I dont expect people to give One Piece 19 episodes to get good, In fact despite how much I love Dragon Ball I dont think I would give it 19 episodes to get good nor did I give One Piece that big a chance, I liked what I saw from the get go you are confusing the two, there's patience for sticking with a show and patience you give to a show to see if you like it. and its this second one that is lacking in people nowadays.

You should be saying "Dragon Ball is good from the get go" if you want to be right about this.

14, and I kept hearing "wait until you get to this storyline, that's when it hits its stride." I don't believe people's patience is that thin nor do I think those THIRTEEN episodes are so off putting to people. Yes, the first DBZ episodes with Raditz are exciting but not everyone who jumped on board with DBZ started with episode 1. And to add to that while those first 5 episodes are pretty tense and action packed, the next nearly 20 episodes aren't so action packed. It's a lot of anticipation and waiting. If we're gonna include opinion, I liked Dragon Ball from the start. The first episode of DB is a lot of fun. It's simple, but very funny.

You may think whatever you may want to think, but be aware it will not always reflect reality. And also you are correct, not all people begin with episode 1. But the same still applies, whatever first impression you have of a show is VITAL to ensuring you keep watching. Even that first impression must be AT LEAST good for someone to give a show a chance. Also I did admit people CAN like the very first episodes, and in fact made a new thread that these episodes were VITAL to making OG DB a hit in Latin America, who got OG DB in order.

[ABED]

First this still doesnt contradict anything. I dont expect people to give One Piece 19 episodes to get good, In fact despite how much I love Dragon Ball I dont think I would give it 19 episodes to get good nor did I give One Piece that big a chance, I liked what I saw from the get go you are confusing the two, there's patience for sticking with a show and patience you give to a show to see if you like it. and its this second one that is lacking in people nowadays.

You should be saying "Dragon Ball is good from the get go" if you want to be right about this.

14, and I kept hearing "wait until you get to this storyline, that's when it hits its stride." I don't believe people's patience is that thin nor do I think those THIRTEEN episodes are so off putting to people. Yes, the first DBZ episodes with Raditz are exciting but not everyone who jumped on board with DBZ started with episode 1. And to add to that while those first 5 episodes are pretty tense and action packed, the next nearly 20 episodes aren't so action packed. It's a lot of anticipation and waiting. If we're gonna include opinion, I liked Dragon Ball from the start. The first episode of DB is a lot of fun. It's simple, but very funny.

You may think whatever you may want to think, but be aware it will not always reflect reality. And also you are correct, not all people begin with episode 1. But the same still applies, whatever first impression you have of a show is VITAL to ensuring you keep watching. Even that first impression must be AT LEAST good for someone to give a show a chance. Also I did admit people CAN like the very first episodes, and in fact made a new thread that these episodes were VITAL to making OG DB a hit in Latin America, who got OG DB in order.

All the more reason to think I have a good point. Most people don't (or didn't, not so sure that holds true these days) start shows from the first episode, but that means that something that happened later drew their attention. If they go back to the beginning, they KNOW for certain that they will get to something they liked.

The first episode I ever saw of Community was the paintball episode. The show had a good pilot, but it took some time to find its footing, but because I knew it would become great, it allowed me to trust that my patience would be rewarded.

[Cure Dragon 255]

I know. That's fair and I agree.

[MasenkoHA]

[]All the more reason to think I have a good point. Most people don't (or didn't, not so sure that holds true these days) start shows from the first episode, but that means that something that happened later drew their attention. If they go back to the beginning, they KNOW for certain that they will get to something they liked.

The first episode I ever saw of Community was the paintball episode. The show had a good pilot, but it took some time to find its footing, but because I knew it would become great, it allowed me to trust that my patience would be rewarded.

I think the idea of just jumping into a show whenever you happened to catch it is pretty unthinkable these days. Nowadays, in the age of streaming and the extreme ease of pirating, its just assumed you'll start at the very first episode. Even back when Game of Thrones was on, and more and more people were getting into it, it seemed everyone started with the first episode and got caught up via torrents rather than start at its most recently aired episode on tv.

And weirdly enough, I think it makes it much harder to get into a tv show. Like you said, a lot of shows do take time to find their footing. Of the 4 Dragon Ball series, I'd argue Dragon Ball Z is the only Dragon Ball show to start off strong in it's first episode and that's really only because it's just the illusion of a first episode and is really episode 154. While it does make sense to start with the first episode of Dragon Ball, I really do almost want to recommend potential newcomers skip ahead to the 21st Tenkaichi Budokai arc and then go back and watch the Shen Long arc. Both it and GT change course after the first arc anyways, and Super really does work best skipping ahead to the Champa arc, as opposed to powering through 29 episodes retelling 2 movies pretty much every Dragon Ball fan saw anyways