Dragon Ball Super: Manga Chapter 98 - Official Discussion Thread

[Kazuya Mishima]

Well I was hoping the new arc was going to start with chapter 100 but at this rate it'll be lucky if this arc ends with chapter 100.

[Mr Baggins]

Cute redraw of the Toriyama Cell Max promo illustration for the Chapter.

I knew I saw that somewhere before. Good catch!

Also, I think it's funny that people are quick to call the gigantification thing an "error" when here I was thinking it's already goofy that Piccolo had to be reminded of a technique he could apparently still use like second nature in the movie anyway. While I'm sure this is unintentionally a result of Toyotaro being faithful to the script, it ain't that big a deal.

[Hugo Boss]

Solid chapter for me. Pan was fantastic in this chapter, much better use of her than in the movie. Gohan catching the senzu bean from her was cute and his character arc is finally complete, lol.

I noted also that Ultimate Gohan used the same attacks on Cell Max that he used on 2nd Form Freeza, when he thought Krillin was killed. It was one of my favorite Gohan’s moments. Nice reference.

[GreatSaiyaman123]

Lol, Toyo didn't change Gohan's line about giant Piccolo so that's another error added to the list for the manga.

It's like AT & Uchida told Toyo "You can only change 3 things from the entire script" and his ideas were: More Goten and Trunks, make the Beerus Planet scene even worse and make a mini-plot out of Gohan eating a senzu.

[kemuri07]

Cute redraw of the Toriyama Cell Max promo illustration for the Chapter.

I knew I saw that somewhere before. Good catch!

Also, I think it's funny that people are quick to call the gigantification thing an "error" when here I was thinking it's already goofy that Piccolo had to be reminded of a technique he could apparently still use like second nature in the movie anyway. While I'm sure this is unintentionally a result of Toyotaro being faithful to the script, it ain't that big a deal.

It's also weird to take seriously enough to call an error when it's obviously a fun "wink and nod" to the original Dragon Ball.

[ZombieVito]

Cute redraw of the Toriyama Cell Max promo illustration for the Chapter.

I knew I saw that somewhere before. Good catch!

Also, I think it's funny that people are quick to call the gigantification thing an "error" when here I was thinking it's already goofy that Piccolo had to be reminded of a technique he could apparently still use like second nature in the movie anyway. While I'm sure this is unintentionally a result of Toyotaro being faithful to the script, it ain't that big a deal.

I don't know man. In the anime continuity, I can buy Piccolo not remembering a form he never used again after 25 or so years instead of the manga one where he used it regularly for Gohan to know it "better than anyone else" and saw someone else copying it not 3 years before.

Piccolo and Gohan end up looking like idiots in the manga.

Lol, Toyo didn't change Gohan's line about giant Piccolo so that's another error added to the list for the manga.

It's like AT & Uchida told Toyo "You can only change 3 things from the entire script" and his ideas were: More Goten and Trunks, make the Beerus Planet scene even worse and make a mini-plot out of Gohan eating a senzu.

He's not a great writer. I'm sure he just forgot. He literally wrote that Fused Zamasu wasn't a Kaioshin so he will defused an hour later but but both Zamasu and Black used them without issue during the whole arc.

[Cipher]

He's not a great writer. I'm sure he just forgot. He literally wrote that Fused Zamasu wasn't a Kaioshin so he will defused an hour later but but both Zamasu and Black used them without issue during the whole arc.

??? Black and Zamasu do defuse in the arc.

[ZombieVito]

He's not a great writer. I'm sure he just forgot. He literally wrote that Fused Zamasu wasn't a Kaioshin so he will defused an hour later but but both Zamasu and Black used them without issue during the whole arc.

??? Black and Zamasu do defuse in the arc.

Ugh I didn't write Time Ring in there.

Fused Zamasu wasn't a Kaioshin so he defuses like mortals do but then for the entire arc both Zamasu and Black use the Time Rings which are said many times that you can only use if you are a Kaioshin. A clear error.

[Yuji]

Piccolo is consistently really, really dumb in-universe despite the series trying its best to portray him as the smart tactician of the group. This is just another one of his blunders, no big deal.

He's not a great writer. I'm sure he just forgot. He literally wrote that Fused Zamasu wasn't a Kaioshin so he will defused an hour later but but both Zamasu and Black used them without issue during the whole arc.

??? Black and Zamasu do defuse in the arc.

Ugh I didn't write Time Ring in there.

Fused Zamasu wasn't a Kaioshin so he defuses like mortals do but then for the entire arc both Zamasu and Black use the Time Rings which are said many times that you can only use if you are a Kaioshin. A clear error.

No, you can use the time ring as long as you have the Potara. That's how Zamasu and Gowasu were able to go into the future in both versions despite Zamasu still being an apprentice even in the anime.

[Mr Baggins]

Piccolo and Gohan end up looking like idiots in the manga.

Good, so they're in character. That's the charm of DB's cast – they're all basically goofballs, often wildly incompetent.

You're overthinking a cute, quick nod to the 23rd tenkaichi budokai. This is a non-issue.

[Hugo Boss]

It’s also possible that, when writing Moro Arc, Toyotaro knew beforehand that Toriyama was writing a story in which Piccolo was going to be giant again, since they were working together on the planning stage of all these modern Dragon Ball content. So, he prepared accordingly. At least until before Super Hero, Gohan would only have seen Giant Piccolo off-panel. The confusion likely happened because Super Hero ended up happening after Moro and Granolah and they didn’t adjust everything perfectly.

[ZombieVito]

No, you can use the time ring as long as you have the Potara. That's how Zamasu and Gowasu were able to go into the future in both versions despite Zamasu still being an apprentice even in the anime.

Nope.

Gowasu specifically says he raised Zamasu's status to that of a Kaioshin temporarily to able to use them.

It is stated that you flat out can't use the rings if you are not a Kaioshin.



And it's even said Zamasu DID become a Kaioshin.

[ankokudaishogun]

Basically the Potara are the proof of a Kaiohshin, so anybody wearing one would count as a Kaioshin even if that's not their title

[SupremeKai25]

No, you can use the time ring as long as you have the Potara. That's how Zamasu and Gowasu were able to go into the future in both versions despite Zamasu still being an apprentice even in the anime.

In both mediums, Gowasu temporarily raised Zamasu to the rank of Kaioshin so that he could use the Time Ring. Just wearing a Kaioshin's potara is not enough. For example, some random earthling like Yamcha or Tien wouldn't be able to use the Time Ring just because they're wearing Shin or Gowasu's earring. Zamasu actually needed to be fully promoted to the rank of Kaioshin first. When Zamasu goes forward in time at Planet Babari, he is considered a fully-fledged (albeit temporary) Kaioshin, and not just apprentice.

Basically the Potara are the proof of a Kaiohshin, so anybody wearing one would count as a Kaioshin even if that's not their title

This is disproven by the Manga. Fused Zamasu and Vegito were wearing Kaioshin earrings (the former from Gowasu, the latter from Shin, both of who can use the Time Rings), yet they both defused, because the Potara magic somehow didn't count them as Kaioshin despite wearing the correct earrings.

It is certainly not unprecedented for Toyotaro to insert a plot hole in his manga that is not present in other versions of the same storyline.

[LightBing]

Highlight is Pan's flying save. Chapter is enjoyable, it's stretching the fighting for way too long.

Once again Toyotarõ keeps copying the original manga, it's beyond the point of references. I hated when the anime did it, I hate it here. I wouldn't be surprised if 10% of this manga was straight up copied from the original.

[ZombieVito]

Basically the Potara are the proof of a Kaiohshin, so anybody wearing one would count as a Kaioshin even if that's not their title

Why did Gowasu temporarily made Zamasu a Kaioshin before using the rings then?

[kemuri07]

Highlight is Pan's flying save. Chapter is enjoyable, it's stretching the fighting for way too long.

Once again Toyotarõ keeps copying the original manga, it's beyond the point of references. I hated when the anime did it, I hate it here. I wouldn't be surprised if 10% of this manga was straight up copied from the original.

1. Don’t really understand what this means.

2. Dragon Ball super is a legacy comic, of course it’s going to reference the past—that’s literally the appeal.

[Jiren The Alpha]

Toriyama forgets
Fanbase: Your fucking donkey.

Toyotarou forgets
Fanbase: oh dear, oh dear, Gorgeous.

[Cipher]

I actually thought the pacing of the chapter was great, and it got in a good mix of character beats (Gamma 2, Pan, Kuririn, Piccolo) and genuinely fun/exciting action. The chapter went through a handful of strategies for the fight, while keeping the cast on the backfoot. It feels perfectly in line with other DB climaxes, and quite enjoyable. Good illustrations and paneling too.

It’s really only suffering under closely adapting an existing story. More than in months (possibly the most of the arc?), I quite liked what we got here on its own.

[nineko]

I agree, this would have been a nice chapter in a vacuum, with an ensemble cast of characters and strategies, except... we all already know how it's going to end.

This is the main difference from the Granolah arc, that arc dragged on for too long because it was flat-out boring and repetitive, while this arc would indeed be interesting and feel like a classic Dragon Ball arc if we didn't have a movie spoil everything for us, so it ends up dragging on for too long as well, and not for its own fault.

There's not much else to say here without sounding like a broken record. I just hope that the next arc, whatever it will be, is going to be more interesting than the Granolah arc and not a retelling of something we already know. I don't want to derail the discussion away from this specific chapter, but there are just so many loose ends that could be touched