Disappointments/let-downs?

Storm · Post by **Storm** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 10:31 pm

Now, we're all here because we love Dragon Ball, right? Manga or anime, whichever. But like any piece of fiction, it's not perfect. Or at least, not completely whole in everyone's eyes. What were some let-downs that you thought might be built up to or shown, or ones you were just plain hoping for that had a chance of happening? For me, one comes to mind immediately...

Gohan fighting Super Perfect Cell. I mean, he completely throttles Perfect Cell, and now he's come back, stronger than ever, completely unafraid of SSJ2 Gohan's power...but Gohan isn't any more intimidated of him, either. I think it would've been far more interesting if they duked it out at least for a little bit, just so we could see how well Cell could do. I mean, if one blast could cripple his arm...

StarrDust · Post by **StarrDust** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 12:29 am

Teen Gohan is a let down for me. Not that I don't like Gohan (he's one of my favorite characters) I just found it really disappointing that after becoming the strongest fighter alive and having Goku pass the tourch to him, he doesn't maintain his powers/status as Earth's protector.

mAcChaos · Post by **mAcChaos** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 12:37 am

Storm wrote:Now, we're all here because we love Dragon Ball, right? Manga or anime, whichever. But like any piece of fiction, it's not perfect. Or at least, not completely whole in everyone's eyes. What were some let-downs that you thought might be built up to or shown, or ones you were just plain hoping for that had a chance of happening? For me, one comes to mind immediately...

Gohan fighting Super Perfect Cell. I mean, he completely throttles Perfect Cell, and now he's come back, stronger than ever, completely unafraid of SSJ2 Gohan's power...but Gohan isn't any more intimidated of him, either. I think it would've been far more interesting if they duked it out at least for a little bit, just so we could see how well Cell could do. I mean, if one blast could cripple his arm...

I think from the final Kamehameha we saw that even with his arm crippled Gohan still had more than enough power to easily crush Cell, it's just that after Goku died he lost the confidence he had and went back to the scared kid that didn't know how to use his power, that made it a close fight.

Snail · Post by **Snail** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 12:47 am

A battle between Nail and the Ginyu Force was a missed opportunity.

Raz · Post by **Raz** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 12:51 am

Overall I didn't find much of Dragon Ball Z disappointing. I dont mind topics like these but they do tend to turn negative quickly.

In a slight deviation from this category I will say Dragon Ball Z was not immediately impressive to me visually. Over the course of the first 191 episodes however it increased substantially as well as the quality of the storyline; which is part of the goal of an epic.

Due to how long it seemed to take for the story to evolve statside (transition from Pioneer to Funi, oddly positioned video releases, Cell Saga along Great Saiyaman) I think occassionally the story seemed to be more grandiose in my head. Not to mention the non stop speculation by mutual fans who seemed to pump one another up in high school waiting for the new episodes to air.

If I have any complaint whatsoever with the story is that it never did really move on from Goku. Watching Dragon Ball GT finally after years of moving on to different shows, I loved every moment of it. But I couldn't help but think again and again that as wonderful a character as Goku is there really needed to either end the series (which they did) or move on to other characters as seemed to be the intention of Toriyama post Cell Games.

Casual Matt · Post by **Casual Matt** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 12:52 am

I was disappointed at the lack of a sword fight between Trunks and Gokua in Movie 9.

Snail · Post by **Snail** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 12:58 am

Another missed event that would have been hella moving; if it had occured would have to be a possible meeting between Goku, and his father if done right with the correct mood and tone and all.

Storm · Post by **Storm** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 1:07 am

One thing that I can understand why it was done, but was still a lost opportunity: the fact that 95% of battles take place in barren canyons. Again, I can understand from both an artistic and plot purpose: it's simpler to animate and the fighters don't want to fight in a city with people or something. But there could've been at least a battle in an abandoned city in the Buu saga or something (kind of like that one section in the Gotenks fight, but more expanded on). I will say, though, that having a battle in the ROSAT was genius.

SSj_Rambo · Post by **SSj_Rambo** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 2:18 am

East Kaioshin really made my heart drop, he was made out to be some mystical person that know one had ever seen, but he was really a nobody as far as fighters go, during that saga anyway. He was a really good opportunity to introduce some much needed new heroes, since the last one we got was Videl.

djkalteraphine · Post by **djkalteraphine** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 3:10 am

My biggest disappointment in the entirety of Dragon Ball is the so-called Trunks saga. Moreover, Freeza's involvement in it. I really feel like it undermined everything that had being built up since the beginning of Dragon Ball, which was Goku encountering Freeza. By having Trunks killing Freeza, or more so, having Freeza survive his fight with Goku, takes the wind out of my sails, and leaves a sour taste in my mouth throughout the Android/Cell arcs. Wouldn't it have been sufficient to just have King Cold go to Earth, seeking revenge? Ugh, it frustrates me.

I'm also not fond of the lack of reappearances of characters such as 8-chan, Sno, Upa, and Bora. And Tenshinhan taking a back seat to other fighters (which as been discussed to death lately.

). One more reattempting take over by Pilaf and crew would've been a great distraction between Freeza and the Androids I think, too.

Snail wrote:A battle between Nail and the Ginyu Force was a missed opportunity.

I totally agree with this.

Storm · Post by **Storm** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 3:25 am

Wow...that's actually a really good idea: having King Cold go alone to get revenge. It always did seem ridiculously anti-climatic for that epic battle between Goku and Freeza...only for Freeza to survive and be chopped up into bits by a mysterious Super Saiyan.

djkalteraphine · Post by **djkalteraphine** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 3:27 am

Storm wrote:Wow...that's actually a really good idea: having King Cold go alone to get revenge. It always did seem ridiculously anti-climatic for that epic battle between Goku and Freeza...only for Freeza to survive and be chopped up into bits by a mysterious Super Saiyan.

Thanks. I've been brooding over it for seven years.

Chuquita · Post by **Chuquita** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 4:24 am

Cell killing Goku. And Goku asking not to be wished back afterwards (because he was under the bizarre impression that he was a bad luck magnet). If Mr. Toriyama wanted to focus on Gohan instead, that's fine; but do you really need to kill off Goku in order to do so? Really?

And Chi-Chi being pregnant during all of this was heart-breaking. I'm sure if Goku knew she was pregnant he would've agreed to the others wishing him back.

Karrit · Post by **Karrit** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:24 am

Chuquita wrote:Cell killing Goku. And Goku asking not to be wished back afterwards (because he was under the bizarre impression that he was a bad luck magnet). If Mr. Toriyama wanted to focus on Gohan instead, that's fine; but do you really need to kill off Goku in order to do so? Really?

And Chi-Chi being pregnant during all of this was heart-breaking. I'm sure if Goku knew she was pregnant he would've agreed to the others wishing him back.

I agree. Especially in the Japanese version. Goku's not a dumbass, despite his simpleness. And Chichi's not so mean neither.

One thing I also didn't like was the execution with Uub. I think Goku's farewell should have been in the manga and a little more understanding on the anime. Also GT is another thing I dislike with a few exceptions. My biggest distaste for GT is Goku turning back into a kid, too many characters taking a back seat to Goku and Goku/Veggie Jr. Going super if Pan's blood was stated to be too diluted. Theirs should have been too. Though part of me wanted to see Pan go ssj and I would have preferred her to have been handles better. I think she whines more than Bulma in the original DB.

BTW: Chuquita are you the same person on FF.net who writes those hysterical DBZ fanfics?

Chuquita · Post by **Chuquita** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:43 am

Karrit wrote:
Chuquita wrote:Cell killing Goku. And Goku asking not to be wished back afterwards (because he was under the bizarre impression that he was a bad luck magnet). If Mr. Toriyama wanted to focus on Gohan instead, that's fine; but do you really need to kill off Goku in order to do so? Really?

And Chi-Chi being pregnant during all of this was heart-breaking. I'm sure if Goku knew she was pregnant he would've agreed to the others wishing him back.
I agree. Especially in the Japanese version. Goku's not a dumbass, despite his simpleness. And Chichi's not so mean neither.

One thing I also didn't like was the execution with Uub. I think Goku's farewell should have been in the manga and a little more understanding on the anime. Also GT is another thing I dislike with a few exceptions. My biggest distaste for GT is Goku turning back into a kid, too many characters taking a back seat to Goku and Goku/Veggie Jr. Going super if Pan's blood was stated to be too diluted. Theirs should have been too. Though part of me wanted to see Pan go ssj and I would have preferred her to have been handles better. I think she whines more than Bulma in the original DB.

BTW: Chuquita are you the same person on FF.net who writes those hysterical DBZ fanfics?

I'm so sleepy I forgot all about the whole thing with Uubu at the end. I too was kind of disappointed in that. Though I realize it was partly to set up for GT and the fact that Mr. Toriyama went back so many years later and redid the ending for the Kanzenban releases to something a little less sudden/harsh made me feel better.

Many things disappointed me about GT, but that could turn into a speech if I got started so I'll just sum it up with a simple "Vegeta's haircut/moostache and Goku-being-turned-into-a-kid".

Yup! I am her. :3
Aw, thank you; I'm glad you like them.

Captain Awesome · Post by **Captain Awesome** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 6:02 am

One thing I found disappointing was that there was no closure with the Goku and Piccolo rivalry, I would have liked to see another fight, even if it was just some sparring, to kind of close up their relationship.

But no, instead we get Uncle Piccolo in the Boo arc

djkalteraphine · Post by **djkalteraphine** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 6:06 am

Captain Awesome wrote:One thing I found disappointing was that there was no closure with the Goku and Piccolo rivalry, I would have liked to see another fight, even if it was just some sparring, to kind of close up their relationship.

But no, instead we get Uncle Piccolo in the Boo arc

I totally concur. A final battle between Goku and Piccolo, say, while training for the Androids, would've been sweet.

Captain Awesome · Post by **Captain Awesome** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 6:14 am

djkalteraphine wrote: I totally concur. A final battle between Goku and Piccolo, say, while training for the Androids, would've been sweet.

My thoughts exactly, Piccolo at that point is still relevant to the storyline, and isn't completely outclassed by Goku yet.

StarrDust · Post by **StarrDust** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 11:04 am

Captain Awesome wrote:One thing I found disappointing was that there was no closure with the Goku and Piccolo rivalry, I would have liked to see another fight, even if it was just some sparring, to kind of close up their relationship.

But no, instead we get Uncle Piccolo in the Boo arc

The "Uncle Piccolo" thing bothers me more than anything since, well during those seven years between Cell and Buu it seemed that everyone had stopped training seriously, but Piccolo seems to always be training. So why is he so damn unimportant and reduced to nothing more than a babysitter? Piccolo having a connection with Gohan is one thing, but Goten and Trunks...

Rocketman · Post by **Rocketman** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 12:14 pm

That the series continued after SSJ Goku killed Freeza, then died in Namek's explosion.

Basically, everything got worse and worse from the point where Goku is said to be alive somehow. But, if I had to name specifics (and if I have to assume the series continues)...

-That the emotional changes of Super Saiyan are never brought up again, because a lil' bit o' training suppresses them. Going Super Saiyan should have been dangerous every time. Dangerous as in 'he might flip the fuck out and kill us all'.

-That there was more than one Super Saiyan. Goku should have been the only one. Combining this with the above would cut out the 'Super Saiyan inflation' before it begins. If there absolutely has to be a SSJ to counter Goku, make it Vegeta and have their rematch be the final battle.

-That there was more than one Super Saiyan level. One and one alone. No USSJ, no Mastered SSJ, and no 2 or 3 or 4.

-That Gohan ever became the hero.

-That ChiChi probably doesn't really know Kaioken.

I'm sure if Goku knew she was pregnant he would've agreed to the others wishing him back.

Shenron had already said he couldn't bring Goku back.

Kanzenshuu

Disappointments/let-downs?

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