As we say our final goodbyes to the prince, what do you think will IGNITE prodigious Son Goku?

[ZenkaiBoosts]

Been wanting to make a thread about this to see what more people think. I really hope Super comes full circle with Vegeta's character

Where in, Vegeta's elimination episode next week, Vegeta finally admits Goku is superior, and that Goku is the only one who can beat Jiren.

It would be incredibly awesome if with Vegeta's last breath before being ringed out, Vegeta goes:

"Kakarot, I now realise you are the only one who can beat Jiren. I saw when you went UI. AWAKEN UI damnit.. BEAT JIREN. Dont let our familes get erased. Fight for everything you love. HONOR 17's death. Look at his sister in the stands. Dont let her down. Dont let my bulma down. Dont let your son down. Look at Gohan. FIGHT Kakarot. Fight damn you. You MUST DEFEAT Jiren. You are the last hope."

Then boom, Jiren interupts and Vegeta finally goes down and gets ringed out by Jiren. .Goku screams "Vegeta!!!!"

What if that ^ (Vegeta's last speech) is what triggers these feelings in Goku (that the spoilers talked about) and thats what leads to Goku coming to some kind of realization/breakthrough

What if it drives Goku to really go after Jiren now with a purpose

It completely revitalizes Goku

And what if despite this, Jiren pushes back and Goku still is no match

Goku is starting to lose it "no, this cant be. How can this be. It cant end like this. I cant let anyone down. Its not going to end like this...no..no...no...as each time Goku repeats this (refusing to let this become the fate of U7 and his loved ones) Goku starts exploding with energy and anger with each no as hes crying thinking about his loved ones being erased. 

As all these emotions start to take over Goku, Goku's power starts rising, his eyes start flashing silver....

And then there it is...Goku explodes into the UI perfect transformation - and its even more epic then when Goku first went SSJ on Namek.

The music is epic. Goku's transformation changes the environment more then Toppo did in episode 125. The gods are scared out of their minds as they fear having to come to gripes with the fact that Goku has far surpassed them all now.

Imagine if Jiren fearful of someone's strength for the first ever, tries to stop Goku from completing his transformation, and just starts firing energy blasts at Goku. It does nothing.

Nothing will stop Goku now. He has been "awakened."

UI perfect Goku has risen. As all the smoke clears we see UI perfect Goku in all his glory.

UI perfect Goku starts tooling Jiren. For the first time ever we see the unshakeable confidence of Jiren start to break. UI perfect Goku brings Jiren down to his knees in humbling fashion and for the first time ever we see Jiren start to lose it....and Jiren explodes in permanent lava fire aura....the battle for the ages will commense

[Kamiccolo9]

Vegeta had better literally say "Awaken UI, dammit!" or I will stop ignoring my wife and child to complain about a cartoon on the Internet.

[Zephyr]

Yes, I am also hyped for more retreaded character beats.

And I, too, hope that there's a lot of strange, out of place internal monologue-ing, like when Gohan unleashed his rage against Cell in the Funimation dub.

As for what will IGNITE Son Goku, I'm expecting him to get hit really hard, or maybe get caught up in a really big blast.

It's gonna be epic, but not as epic (read: really, really long) as these past 48 minutes have been.

[JazzMazz]

Been wanting to make a thread about this to see what more people think. I really hope Super comes full circle with Vegeta's character

Where in, Vegeta's elimination episode next week, Vegeta finally admits Goku is superior, and that Goku is the only one who can beat Jiren.

It would be incredibly awesome if with Vegeta's last breath before being ringed out, Vegeta goes:

"Kakarot, I now realise you are the only one who can beat Jiren. I saw when you went UI. AWAKEN UI damnit.. BEAT JIREN. Dont let our familes get erased. Fight for everything you love. HONOR 17's death. Look at his sister in the stands. Dont let her down. Dont let my bulma down. Dont let your son down. Look at Gohan. FIGHT Kakarot. Fight damn you. You MUST DEFEAT Jiren. You are the last hope."

Then boom, Jiren interupts and Vegeta finally goes down and gets ringed out by Jiren. .Goku screams "Vegeta!!!!"

What if that ^ (Vegeta's last speech) is what triggers these feelings in Goku (that the spoilers talked about) and thats what leads to Goku coming to some kind of realization/breakthrough

What if it drives Goku to really go after Jiren now with a purpose

It completely revitalizes Goku

And what if despite this, Jiren pushes back and Goku still is no match

Goku is starting to lose it "no, this cant be. How can this be. It cant end like this. I cant let anyone down. Its not going to end like this...no..no...no...as each time Goku repeats this (refusing to let this become the fate of U7 and his loved ones) Goku starts exploding with energy and anger with each no as hes crying thinking about his loved ones being erased. 

As all these emotions start to take over Goku, Goku's power starts rising, his eyes start flashing silver....

And then there it is...Goku explodes into the UI perfect transformation - and its even more epic then when Goku first went SSJ on Namek.

The music is epic. Goku's transformation changes the environment more then Toppo did in episode 125. The gods are scared out of their minds as they fear having to come to gripes with the fact that Goku has far surpassed them all now.

Imagine if Jiren fearful of someone's strength for the first ever, tries to stop Goku from completing his transformation, and just starts firing energy blasts at Goku. It does nothing.

Nothing will stop Goku now. He has been "awakened."

UI perfect Goku has risen. As all the smoke clears we see UI perfect Goku in all his glory.

UI perfect Goku starts tooling Jiren. For the first time ever we see the unshakeable confidence of Jiren start to break. UI perfect Goku brings Jiren down to his knees in humbling fashion and for the first time ever we see Jiren start to lose it....and Jiren explodes in permanent lava fire aura....the battle for the ages will commense

I'm personally fine with Vegeta going out in a desperate fight against Jiren, but please, for the love of god, don't have him repeat the same character beat as in the Buu arc when he admitted Goku was better than him. That is an absolutely horrible idea that would ruin anything Super had going for Vegeta, as well as any potential credibility the series has in terms of writing the character.

I've often defended Super loosely referencing specific scenes, such as when Vegeta used the Final Flash against Jiren, because those scenes often have complete different story beats and tones to the original and at least attempt to be their own thing in some way. If Super literally copied and pasted a speech from Z during Vegeta's final stand, it would definitely diminish Super as a show in my eyes.

[emperior]

Been wanting to make a thread about this to see what more people think. I really hope Super comes full circle with Vegeta's character

Where in, Vegeta's elimination episode next week, Vegeta finally admits Goku is superior, and that Goku is the only one who can beat Jiren.

It would be incredibly awesome if with Vegeta's last breath before being ringed out, Vegeta goes:

"Kakarot, I now realise you are the only one who can beat Jiren. I saw when you went UI. AWAKEN UI damnit.. BEAT JIREN. Dont let our familes get erased. Fight for everything you love. HONOR 17's death. Look at his sister in the stands. Dont let her down. Dont let my bulma down. Dont let your son down. Look at Gohan. FIGHT Kakarot. Fight damn you. You MUST DEFEAT Jiren. You are the last hope."

Then boom, Jiren interupts and Vegeta finally goes down and gets ringed out by Jiren. .Goku screams "Vegeta!!!!"

What if that ^ (Vegeta's last speech) is what triggers these feelings in Goku (that the spoilers talked about) and thats what leads to Goku coming to some kind of realization/breakthrough

What if it drives Goku to really go after Jiren now with a purpose

It completely revitalizes Goku

And what if despite this, Jiren pushes back and Goku still is no match

Goku is starting to lose it "no, this cant be. How can this be. It cant end like this. I cant let anyone down. Its not going to end like this...no..no...no...as each time Goku repeats this (refusing to let this become the fate of U7 and his loved ones) Goku starts exploding with energy and anger with each no as hes crying thinking about his loved ones being erased. 

As all these emotions start to take over Goku, Goku's power starts rising, his eyes start flashing silver....

And then there it is...Goku explodes into the UI perfect transformation - and its even more epic then when Goku first went SSJ on Namek.

The music is epic. Goku's transformation changes the environment more then Toppo did in episode 125. The gods are scared out of their minds as they fear having to come to gripes with the fact that Goku has far surpassed them all now.

Imagine if Jiren fearful of someone's strength for the first ever, tries to stop Goku from completing his transformation, and just starts firing energy blasts at Goku. It does nothing.

Nothing will stop Goku now. He has been "awakened."

UI perfect Goku has risen. As all the smoke clears we see UI perfect Goku in all his glory.

UI perfect Goku starts tooling Jiren. For the first time ever we see the unshakeable confidence of Jiren start to break. UI perfect Goku brings Jiren down to his knees in humbling fashion and for the first time ever we see Jiren start to lose it....and Jiren explodes in permanent lava fire aura....the battle for the ages will commense

I'm personally fine with Vegeta going out in a desperate fight against Jiren, but please, for the love of god, don't have him repeat the same character beat as in the Buu arc when he admitted Goku was better than him. That is an absolutely horrible idea that would ruin anything Super had going for Vegeta, as well as any potential credibility the series has in terms of writing the character.

I've often defended Super loosely referencing specific scenes, such as when Vegeta used the Final Flash against Jiren, because those scenes often have complete different story beats and tones to the original and at least attempt to be their own thing in some way. If Super literally copied and pasted a speech from Z during Vegeta's final stand, it would definitely diminish Super as a show in my eyes.

I agree with you. It would be terrible.
Although, they could have Vegeta openly admit it to Goku, but it has to be worded differently. I'm sick to my stomach of them rehashing the same exact lines from the past.

[Saturnine]

You really have an unhealthy obsession about Goku being superior to Vegeta and admitting this. You clearly dislike Vegeta, which is fine and all, but you're getting a bit too much into it, don't you think? Not really that healthy to fret over an anime character. Believe me, I know, I used to frequent Naruto forums

[Firebolt]

It's probably just gonna be the sheer amount of power Jiren has that makes Goku transform into Mastered Ultra Instinct. Goku went Ultra Instinct Omen the first time because of the Genki Dama, and the second time because of Kefla.

I would love if Goku transformed because of rage or Vegeta giving a speech before he falls, but let's be honest will Toriyama and Toei give Goku any character development in Super?

[Baggie_Saiyan]

It's probably just gonna be the sheer amount of power Jiren has that makes Goku transform into Mastered Ultra Instinct. Goku went Ultra Instinct Omen the first time because of the Genki Dama, and the second time because of Kefla.

I would love if Goku transformed because of rage or Vegeta giving a speech before he falls, but let's be honest will Toriyama and Toei give Goku any character development in Super?

Being angry is not character development.

As a character Goku has been developed as far as he can go, it basically stopped after the Freeza arc.

[Firebolt]

It's probably just gonna be the sheer amount of power Jiren has that makes Goku transform into Mastered Ultra Instinct. Goku went Ultra Instinct Omen the first time because of the Genki Dama, and the second time because of Kefla.

I would love if Goku transformed because of rage or Vegeta giving a speech before he falls, but let's be honest will Toriyama and Toei give Goku any character development in Super?

Being angry is not character development.

As a character Goku has been developed as far as he can go, it basically stopped after the Freeza arc.

Yeah you're right, my mistake.

[JazzMazz]

It's probably just gonna be the sheer amount of power Jiren has that makes Goku transform into Mastered Ultra Instinct. Goku went Ultra Instinct Omen the first time because of the Genki Dama, and the second time because of Kefla.

I would love if Goku transformed because of rage or Vegeta giving a speech before he falls, but let's be honest will Toriyama and Toei give Goku any character development in Super?

Being angry is not character development.

As a character Goku has been developed as far as he can go, it basically stopped after the Freeza arc.

I do think they could do something interesting if they added some kind of genuinely interesting internal monologue or conflict in the next episode, but I'm not hoping for too much.

[Kataphrut]

My hope is that it will be something he triggers of his own volition, either through pushing himself to the max (elsewhere I theorised he could basically keep multiplying his Kaioken until his limits broke) or simply gaining that moment of zen resolve. Mainly, I don't want it to be directly caused by Jiren beating him up. We've had that twice now, the final trigger needs to be something a little different.

Alternatively, since the only ally left in the ring would likely be Freeza at that point, it might be funny if he triggered it. I picture the two of them hiding out from Jiren among the rubble, with Goku trying to strategise as to what they could possibly do to win. Freeza tells him to use Ultra Instinct, but Goku doesn't know how, except that he has to break through his shell somehow. Freeza nods and then just blasts Goku point blank with all his energy. "Oops, my hand slipped".

[Kanious]

As Dragon Ball always does thing simple, i don't expect anything great from Goku achieving the mastered UI. I think he will just achieve it, and fight, then win (which in turn will make no sense to me, in fact Jiren is already flawed IMO)

[BlueBasilisk]

It's probably just gonna be the sheer amount of power Jiren has that makes Goku transform into Mastered Ultra Instinct. Goku went Ultra Instinct Omen the first time because of the Genki Dama, and the second time because of Kefla.

I would love if Goku transformed because of rage or Vegeta giving a speech before he falls, but let's be honest will Toriyama and Toei give Goku any character development in Super?

Being angry is not character development.

As a character Goku has been developed as far as he can go, it basically stopped after the Freeza arc.

I do think they could do something interesting if they added some kind of genuinely interesting internal monologue or conflict in the next episode, but I'm not hoping for too much.

Maybe they'll have Goku develop some kind of deeper respect for Vegeta's persistence and determination or something like that. I'm kinda hoping he decides to pick up the torch for Vegeta (so to speak) after he falls.

[Chuquita]

It's about Goku's feelings though, right? Or so Weekly Jump wrote. Maybe there's no speech to counter Vegeta's number 1 speech after all; maybe it's Goku's facial expressions and body language that'll tell the tale.

[TheOtherDude]

Been wanting to make a thread about this to see what more people think. I really hope Super comes full circle with Vegeta's character

Where in, Vegeta's elimination episode next week, Vegeta finally admits Goku is superior, and that Goku is the only one who can beat Jiren.

It would be incredibly awesome if with Vegeta's last breath before being ringed out, Vegeta goes:

"Kakarot, I now realise you are the only one who can beat Jiren. I saw when you went UI. AWAKEN UI damnit.. BEAT JIREN. Dont let our familes get erased. Fight for everything you love. HONOR 17's death. Look at his sister in the stands. Dont let her down. Dont let my bulma down. Dont let your son down. Look at Gohan. FIGHT Kakarot. Fight damn you. You MUST DEFEAT Jiren. You are the last hope."

Then boom, Jiren interupts and Vegeta finally goes down and gets ringed out by Jiren. .Goku screams "Vegeta!!!!"

What if that ^ (Vegeta's last speech) is what triggers these feelings in Goku (that the spoilers talked about) and thats what leads to Goku coming to some kind of realization/breakthrough

What if it drives Goku to really go after Jiren now with a purpose

It completely revitalizes Goku

And what if despite this, Jiren pushes back and Goku still is no match

Goku is starting to lose it "no, this cant be. How can this be. It cant end like this. I cant let anyone down. Its not going to end like this...no..no...no...as each time Goku repeats this (refusing to let this become the fate of U7 and his loved ones) Goku starts exploding with energy and anger with each no as hes crying thinking about his loved ones being erased. 

As all these emotions start to take over Goku, Goku's power starts rising, his eyes start flashing silver....

And then there it is...Goku explodes into the UI perfect transformation - and its even more epic then when Goku first went SSJ on Namek.

The music is epic. Goku's transformation changes the environment more then Toppo did in episode 125. The gods are scared out of their minds as they fear having to come to gripes with the fact that Goku has far surpassed them all now.

Imagine if Jiren fearful of someone's strength for the first ever, tries to stop Goku from completing his transformation, and just starts firing energy blasts at Goku. It does nothing.

Nothing will stop Goku now. He has been "awakened."

UI perfect Goku has risen. As all the smoke clears we see UI perfect Goku in all his glory.

UI perfect Goku starts tooling Jiren. For the first time ever we see the unshakeable confidence of Jiren start to break. UI perfect Goku brings Jiren down to his knees in humbling fashion and for the first time ever we see Jiren start to lose it....and Jiren explodes in permanent lava fire aura....the battle for the ages will commense

I'm personally fine with Vegeta going out in a desperate fight against Jiren, but please, for the love of god, don't have him repeat the same character beat as in the Buu arc when he admitted Goku was better than him. That is an absolutely horrible idea that would ruin anything Super had going for Vegeta, as well as any potential credibility the series has in terms of writing the character.

I've often defended Super loosely referencing specific scenes, such as when Vegeta used the Final Flash against Jiren, because those scenes often have complete different story beats and tones to the original and at least attempt to be their own thing in some way. If Super literally copied and pasted a speech from Z during Vegeta's final stand, it would definitely diminish Super as a show in my eyes.

I agree with you. It would be terrible.
Although, they could have Vegeta openly admit it to Goku, but it has to be worded differently. I'm sick to my stomach of them rehashing the same exact lines from the past.

Zenkai. I don’t know what your obsession is with Vegeta losing and Goku winning is, but it comes across as someone who does not have a realistic perspective on what’s going on. There’s just so much bias in your statements that it makes it hard to have any kind of discussion with you. Even in your title, you always have to take unnecessary steps to throw shade at the 2nd most important character in the series.

Anyways, I’m sure Vegeta is going to have a moment with Goku. Don’t think it’s worth making a thread over. This topic seems like it belongs in a fan fiction page. You literally copied and pasted a statement you made in another topic and made a thread about it.

[Asura]

I pray that Goku will actually think about his universe being erased, because it doesn't seem like he's thought about that at all. Hopefully that'll be the lead up to Ultra Instinct, but I think Ultra Instinct has to come from power like the Genki Dama or Kefla, not really through an emotional reaction.

[MajinVegetaPD]

Been wanting to make a thread about this to see what more people think. I really hope Super comes full circle with Vegeta's character

Where in, Vegeta's elimination episode next week, Vegeta finally admits Goku is superior, and that Goku is the only one who can beat Jiren.

It would be incredibly awesome if with Vegeta's last breath before being ringed out, Vegeta goes:

"Kakarot, I now realise you are the only one who can beat Jiren. I saw when you went UI. AWAKEN UI damnit.. BEAT JIREN. Dont let our familes get erased. Fight for everything you love. HONOR 17's death. Look at his sister in the stands. Dont let her down. Dont let my bulma down. Dont let your son down. Look at Gohan. FIGHT Kakarot. Fight damn you. You MUST DEFEAT Jiren. You are the last hope."

Then boom, Jiren interupts and Vegeta finally goes down and gets ringed out by Jiren. .Goku screams "Vegeta!!!!"

What if that ^ (Vegeta's last speech) is what triggers these feelings in Goku (that the spoilers talked about) and thats what leads to Goku coming to some kind of realization/breakthrough

What if it drives Goku to really go after Jiren now with a purpose

It completely revitalizes Goku

And what if despite this, Jiren pushes back and Goku still is no match

Goku is starting to lose it "no, this cant be. How can this be. It cant end like this. I cant let anyone down. Its not going to end like this...no..no...no...as each time Goku repeats this (refusing to let this become the fate of U7 and his loved ones) Goku starts exploding with energy and anger with each no as hes crying thinking about his loved ones being erased. 

As all these emotions start to take over Goku, Goku's power starts rising, his eyes start flashing silver....

And then there it is...Goku explodes into the UI perfect transformation - and its even more epic then when Goku first went SSJ on Namek.

The music is epic. Goku's transformation changes the environment more then Toppo did in episode 125. The gods are scared out of their minds as they fear having to come to gripes with the fact that Goku has far surpassed them all now.

Imagine if Jiren fearful of someone's strength for the first ever, tries to stop Goku from completing his transformation, and just starts firing energy blasts at Goku. It does nothing.

Nothing will stop Goku now. He has been "awakened."

UI perfect Goku has risen. As all the smoke clears we see UI perfect Goku in all his glory.

UI perfect Goku starts tooling Jiren. For the first time ever we see the unshakeable confidence of Jiren start to break. UI perfect Goku brings Jiren down to his knees in humbling fashion and for the first time ever we see Jiren start to lose it....and Jiren explodes in permanent lava fire aura....the battle for the ages will commense

You have this weird obsession.....overly attached Goku fan or something. Sorry, Vegeta will not be kissing Goku's ass this time around. His development puts him way past that at this point.

[MajinVegetaPD]

I pray that Goku will actually think about his universe being erased, because it doesn't seem like he's thought about that at all. Hopefully that'll be the lead up to Ultra Instinct, but I think Ultra Instinct has to come from power like the Genki Dama or Kefla, not really through an emotional reaction.

It would make sense it comes from that. Goku has pretty much mentioned nothing about wanting to save his Universe, which IMO makes him come across as selfish. It's like we're living in some bizarro world where Goku is obsessed with strength, and Vegeta is fighting for his loved ones? Doesn't exactly sit well with me, as that is not who Goku is as a character. Yes, he cares about fighting strong enemies, but at the end of the day it's always been about his loved ones.

[Vegeta_Sama]

My hope is that it will be something he triggers of his own volition, either through pushing himself to the max (elsewhere I theorised he could basically keep multiplying his Kaioken until his limits broke) or simply gaining that moment of zen resolve. Mainly, I don't want it to be directly caused by Jiren beating him up. We've had that twice now, the final trigger needs to be something a little different.

Alternatively, since the only ally left in the ring would likely be Freeza at that point, it might be funny if he triggered it. I picture the two of them hiding out from Jiren among the rubble, with Goku trying to strategise as to what they could possibly do to win. Freeza tells him to use Ultra Instinct, but Goku doesn't know how, except that he has to break through his shell somehow. Freeza nods and then just blasts Goku point blank with all his energy. "Oops, my hand slipped".

Man, with the amount of hand slipping that has been in this arc, this wouldn't surprise me.

[KingKaash]

That Vegeta speech you have is nice. If Vegeta drops that then that's true character development. I didn't really feel the character development when Vegeta defeated Toppo because he just thought of Cabba and his own family which he's used as a source of power before. Including Gohan and 17 would make it show Vegeta cares about everyone in U7 and I would like that