Unique DBZ Related Beliefs and Opinions

[The Time Traveller]

Like Puar being a girl. 'Boku' or no 'boku', I'm sorry, I just can't see her as a boy.

I don't really care what gender Puar is, as long as he or she can turn into THIS!

I was going to point out that women can play boys, and that doesn't make them female, like Goku, except we see PLENTY of proof of his gender...

Puar talks in a rather boyish way, it's just kinda high pitched.


Let's see, strange, unique beliefs, what do I believe in...

I don't know, I take what I read in the manga, see in the show and hear from Herms as fact and what I feel personally won't change that.

[Amigo Ten]

I think there is something beyond Super Saiyan 3 within the manga universe because I think only Goku would be able to reach the true pinnacle of Saiyan power.

[rereboy]

I think there is something beyond Super Saiyan 3 within the manga universe because I think only Goku would be able to reach the true pinnacle of Saiyan power.

Well technically its possible that the so called SSJ4 exists in the manga, but it just never appeared because they all lost their tails eventually.

Personally, the idea of the SSJ4 is the only thing I take as canon from GT.

I personally believe that, if they had kept the tails after SSJ was introduced, they would eventually tap into the two separate sets of transformations that sayans are capable of (oozaru and SSJ) and they would eventually combine it.

SSJ4 is not a SSJ state beyond SSJ3. SSJ4 is the combination of the two separate sets of transformations that the sayans have. And there is nothing in the manga that states that those two transformations can not be combined.

So in my opinion, at the very least, golden oozaru would be possible in the manga.

As for SSJ4 itself, its a little more of a stretch to believe it would be possible, but I believe so. I believe that the true form of the sayans, their ultimate form resides in the perfect combination of their two sets of transformations. An imperfect one would result in a golden oozaru and a perfect one would result in a so called SSJ4 or as I like to call it, Ultimate Sayan Form.

But anything else from GT is not canon in my book. Just that idea that never came to life in the manga.

As for Mystic Gohan, I believe that his mystic power up tapped into every last power he had except the power of the oozaru, because he didn`t have his tail at the time. So it would be possible for him to become even stronger if he somehow got his tail back.

[Amigo Ten]

Oh, I'm not saying it would the same as what happened in GT. I just think there would be a Super Saiyan 4 of some kind because I'm a Goku fanboy and think the highest form of Saiyan power would only be achieved by him.

And I don't think the tails would be much of a benefit to the Saiyans by the end of the series. At least not for Goku and Gohan. Goku already had his oozaru power available to him, since the Super God Water brought it out. And Gohan had his full potential brought out, and then some. I think transforming into a giant monkey wouldn't actually make either of them any stronger.

[rereboy]

Oh, I'm not saying it would the same as what happened in GT. I just think there would be a Super Saiyan 4 of some kind because I'm a Goku fanboy and think the highest form of Saiyan power would only be achieved by him.

Granted, but I also don`t think that the Ultimate Sayan Form would be exactly as SSJ4 is in GT.

I just believe that the Ultimate Sayan Form can be achieved by combining the SSJs transformations with the Oozaru transformations.

I do not believe it would be possible to exist a SSJ form higher than SSJ3 because it is several times stated that it just consumes too much energy and its incredibly hard to maintain it in the mortal world. A even higher form would be just crazy.

But, all sayans have also the potential of the Oozaru transformation. So the logically way to get stronger without resorting to fusions of the mystic power up, would be to try to combine the two sets of transformations.

Nothing in the manga implies that it wouldn`t be possible, so at the very least, a golden Oozaru would be possible. But I also believe that a unique kind of transformation would be possible from combining the two sets of transformations. And that would be the Ultimate Sayan Form.

This idea is a very good idea that GT used but GT didn`t use it very well. That and other problems are the reason why disregard GT completely except for this idea.

Anyway, they would have to get their tails back in order to do it. Since they never do in the manga, it never actually happens. But I do believe it would be possible.

[Amigo Ten]

Well, an even higher form would eliminate those negatives. Kind of like Super Saiyan 2 compared to Super Saiyan 2nd or 3rd grade.

But I also think Goku would be able to refine Super Saiyan 3 a great deal with enough time.

[rereboy]

And I don't think the tails would be much of a benefit to the Saiyans by the end of the series. At least not for Goku and Gohan. Goku already had his oozaru power available to him, since the Super God Water brought it out. And Gohan had his full potential brought out, and then some. I think transforming into a giant monkey wouldn't actually make either of them any stronger.

Transforming into an Oozaru is always a x10 increase.

Granted, its not that much of an increase compared to a x100 increase from an SSJ2. But it would always be more power.

And, in my theory, combining the two would result in something more powerful than simply adding the base power x100 with the base power x10 for example.

Also, although the manga illustrates Goku as having the Oozaru behind him, he doesn`t actually have the Oozaru power brought out. If he did and he had a power level of 100 before the holy water, then he would have a power level of 1000. It just doesn`t add up.

Well, an even higher form would eliminate those negatives. Kind of like Super Saiyan 2 compared to Super Saiyan 2nd or 3rd grade.

But I also think Goku would be able to refine Super Saiyan 3 a great deal with enough time.

Goku might be able to refine SSJ3 a little but not much.

Remember that SSJ3 is so powerful that even Gotenks couldn`t stay fused for longer than 5 minutes in that form, even if he transformed right after fusing. That is stated by Trunks and Goten, if I`m not mistaken.
SSJ3 is so powerful that it actually morphs the rules of fusion, and doesn`t allow more than 5 minutes even if they supposedly had 30 full minutes.

So I really don`t think that ir could be improved much. Its just too powerful already. And even more hair would be ridiculous

And you can`t really compare SSJ second grade with a true SSJ form. SSJ second grade and third grade are mere attempts of going beyond SSJ and reaching SSJ2.

SSJ3 is a true SSJ form but it is inherently flawed due to the ridiculous amount of power it requires to maintain such a level of a SSJ transformation. No other SSJ form and even the different grades are like this.
Logic states that if the problem with the SSJ3 is that amount of power, then trying to use even more power to reach an higher form of SSJ would just cause the flaw to worsen even if that state could be reached.

However, by having another kind of transformation come in to play, and biologically change the fighter`s body into something else, I believe it would be possible to reach another transformation.

But the SSJs forms are already maxed out.

[Travis Touchdown]

I guess my unpopular belief is that Gohan does train after the Buu saga. While I don't feel he ever shows the same dedication as Goku, it would be kind of hard for him to with his job and all. Gohan is shown to be a much better family man than Goku, but I would think he's smart enough to have learned his lesson in the Buu arc.

Related to my unpopular belief is in GT, I think GT proves Gohan trained. How though? Gohan is so weak. Well technically everyone is super weak compared to Goku in GT, but Pan is shown to be quite strong for her age and SOMEONE had to be training her in Goku's absence. I tend to think that someone was Gohan.

[Amigo Ten]

I think Super Saiyan 3 could be refined, by Goku at least. This is the "unique beliefs" thread after all.

And Super Saiyan 3 did not limit Gotenks's fusion time. I always see this said but it's not true. Gotenks could only maintain Super Saiyan 3 for 5 minutes, but it did nothing to shorten the time they stayed fused. If it did, they would have defused the instant it ran out, instead of just reverting to base, which is what happened. If they turned Super Saiyan 3 straight away, like they did the second time, it would just run out after 5 minutes and they'd be left in base for the remaining 25 minutes.

As for tails, it may be a 10x increase, but I don't think it would make a difference to Gohan, just as Super Saiyan would make no difference. Both are transformations that afford extra power, but if the Saiyan in question can already use all his power without transforming, it's not going to make a difference.

Goku's slightly different because he didn't have ALL his power brought out by the God Water, just his potential power at that time, which included his oozaru. The power levels may not add up, but that's just because... well, because they don't add up. You can't apply them retroactively and have it make sense. Old King Piccolo nearly killed Goku using only half (or less than half) his full power, and young King Piccolo was much stronger than that. A 10x increase for Goku is perfectly feasible in my eyes.

Although admittedly the 10x thing is also applying a later story element retroactively, but it makes more sense that the actual power levels do. Either way, Goku had the power of his oozaru made available to him when he drank the Super God Water, which is why I don't think transforming would make him any stronger. He was already as strong as that transformation would make him.

[JulieYBM]

I guess my unpopular belief is that Gohan does train after the Buu saga. While I don't feel he ever shows the same dedication as Goku, it would be kind of hard for him to with his job and all. Gohan is shown to be a much better family man than Goku, but I would think he's smart enough to have learned his lesson in the Buu arc.

I can completely concur with such.


I really think Toriyama just doesn't know what he's doing this late in the game. Gohan in the Cell Games proves this, I think. Gohan supposedly worked his ass off for years, and then all of the sudden he can't grasp and accept he needs to go out there and kill Cell? A part of me really thinks Gohan should have been portrayed as more competant during that arc. I think the 'fighting genius' aspect really could have been better integrated into Gohan's base personality. Give Gohan an 'genius-level' control of ki, or sharp 'Piccolo-esque' level of intelligence.

I don't remember if there was a lot of coverage of Gohan's training in the RoST in the Manga, but you look at how gutsy he is in the Anime filler...and it sort of just...looks like somebody somewhere dropped the ball.

[SHINOBI-03]

When I first heard of GT, the first thing I knew about was Pan who was descriped from a site as "the Granddaughter of Goku" , and I thought this new series is about her and friends at school without any of the original cast because they were all... dead...!!

I know you'd say "That's what happened in the TV Special!". The point is... I only saw one picture of her young self in that site. And so, you get the rest ....

[Super Sonic]

When I first saw the Trunks preview, I thought maybe Frieza missed a couple of Saiyans. Then again, when watching the eps, when hearing who his mother was, I called Bulma a whore. I don't think of her in that way now.

[Metalwario64]

Not my belief, but people at school in the 4th or 5th grade swore that in GT that Frieza came back to life, killed Vegeta again, and just before Vegeta died, he admitted to Goku that they were really brothers. After Vegeta died, Goku then apparently transformed into a Super Saiyan 5 and had one last epic battle with Frieza, coming out victorious in the end...

Even as a kid I called BS on that one.

It wasn't just one person either... I wonder what fanfic they were reading?

[Hellspawn28]

Freeza and Cell where stronger in GT then they where in the past. From what I can remember they don't seem that stronger.

[yunzabit]

I see Dragonball as ending with the Freeza arc. There are obvious indications that DB should have ended here but Toriyama continued it.

Granted, some loose ends are left, like where is Goku, but I prefer this ending vastly over the alternative.

[Freeza.exe]

One more that I can think of, I despise the Boo saga. Not many people do so I guess that would fall under "unique".

[Herms]

I've always thought the 23rd Tenkaichi Budoukai would have been the best ending point overall. I guess that's kind of unique.

[penguintruth]

I think I would have preferred it end with Gohan defeating Cell, inheriting his father's place as the world's savior. All of DBZ seemed like the story of Gohan coming into his own.

It's too bad that didn't last. Not that I didn't enjoy some parts of the Buu Saga, mind you.

[Bussani]

Freeza and Cell where stronger in GT then they where in the past. From what I can remember they don't seem that stronger.

They claim to have been training in Hell (seriously, why is that allowed?), but when they power up, Goku asks them if they've forgotten how to use their ki. Usually when Goku says something like that he's being honest, but since it's GT I'm not sure. He certainly destroyed them without even going Super Saiyan, but...strength levels are also inconsistent in GT.

[Amigo Ten]

One more that I can think of, I despise the Boo saga. Not many people do so I guess that would fall under "unique".

It always seemed more disliked than liked among fans to me.

I've always thought the 23rd Tenkaichi Budoukai would have been the best ending point overall. I guess that's kind of unique.

I think that too.