"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[Doctor.]

The "good guys" are extremist in their own way by how they selfishly and stupidly cling to caring more about their fighting boners at the cost of everything else and they've repeatedly gotten themselves and other people killed because of it. No matter how many times its happened, its always the same story. A powerful adversary comes, the "good guys" let his plans advance farther than they should and then a whole bunch of terrible things happen. The F material even highlights this and no one learns anything from it. Yet, because say Piccolo doesn't go around kicking puppies in his off time like Freeza or Cell, that means the universe won't bite him in the ass when it really should.

Pretty much the only "good guys" who I'd call that is Future Trunks for wanting to end threats before they can happen, even if he isn't capable of doing so. A great example of this is how Goku & company handle the Majin Boo situation in comparison to Trunks. The main cast clings to their own worldview of "mah fighting boner needs something!" and everything absurdly escalates. What does Trunks do? Kill every single person in Bobidi's little group and Majin Boo never hatches.

Black's motivation at least has a grander scale to it and comes from a place you can understand. I don't understand the kind of person who can let his home planet get destroyed twice just because he wants a good fight. The fact Goku and company get away with such stuff at all and get called "good guys" at all shows the DB world is totally fucked when it comes to morality.

Actually, the extremist thing to do would be, in the Cell arc for instance, killing Gero the moment they find out about the androids, I feel.

[ekrolo2]

Actually, the extremist thing to do would be, in the Cell arc for instance, killing Gero the moment they find out about the androids, I feel.

The Gero situation is a moral grey area but one I think the protagonists handle poorly. Them choosing to fight the Androids instead of just stopping them from happening at all is incredibly selfish but could have been much less so if they did more preparation. It always struck me that it's weird how Goku doesn't bother making Gohan into a Super Saiyan even if he could very easily do that and knows half-breeds can pull it off thanks to Trunks. I honestly wouldn't be shocked if Goku intentionally kept that from Gohan because he didn't want Gohan from just taking the Androids out too easily. After all, Goku lets them go almost solely to fight them. Can't fight them if his kid becomes powerful enough to annihilate them easily.

Too dark for Goku's character? Maybe but after RoF nothing would surprise me about him. Black is an extremist but one who's intentions are good even if his methods are horribly warped. Goku is just an extremist who's out to do stuff for selfish reasons. Him doing good is just a little bonus but never the main objective. Well, outside of GT where they intentionally write him as having mentally grown up a lot.

[Doctor.]

Black's intentions aren't exactly good. He's pratically a racist. He feels like ALL mortals should die. His intentions would be good if he and Zamasu felt like one particular race, like the Saiyans, humans or Namekians, should be gone. As it stands, they just want a world full of Gods because Gods can do no harm whilst mortals are the root of all evil.

Even Beerus in the manga complains about Black having no reason behind his destruction and not paying attention to the balance.

[fadeddreams5]

Black's intentions aren't exactly good. He's pratically a racist. He feels like ALL mortals should die. His intentions would be good if he and Zamasu felt like one particular race, like the Saiyans, humans or Namekians, should be gone. As it stands, they just want a world full of Gods because Gods can do no harm whilst mortals are the root of all evil.

Even Beerus in the manga complains about Black having no reason behind his destruction and not paying attention to the balance.

I don't think he cares about a world full of gods. He doesn't do it for his people. He does it because he feels mortals are tainting the creations of the gods, which are beautiful.

[Pannaliciour]

Black's intentions aren't exactly good. He's pratically a racist. He feels like ALL mortals should die. His intentions would be good if he and Zamasu felt like one particular race, like the Saiyans, humans or Namekians, should be gone. As it stands, they just want a world full of Gods because Gods can do no harm whilst mortals are the root of all evil.

Even Beerus in the manga complains about Black having no reason behind his destruction and not paying attention to the balance.

Wait does that mean Black is immortal as well?

[HeroR]

Black's intentions aren't exactly good. He's pratically a racist. He feels like ALL mortals should die. His intentions would be good if he and Zamasu felt like one particular race, like the Saiyans, humans or Namekians, should be gone. As it stands, they just want a world full of Gods because Gods can do no harm whilst mortals are the root of all evil.

Even Beerus in the manga complains about Black having no reason behind his destruction and not paying attention to the balance.

Wait does that mean Black is immortal as well?

Mortal is another way of saying non-god. Or, human if you use the straight Japanese translation.

[LightBing]

I don't get it. Black is clearly misguided, so why doesn't anyone just sit him down and have a talk?

I'm sure a Naruto-style speech and a friend would change him for the better. He's basically Shadow the Hedgehog before Amy chatted with him.

But no... too many meat heads in this series.

I mean it's not like that even works in reality, power plus idealism equals inflexibility. That's why the villains have to be defeated first, if they are to be redeemed.
Goku kinda does this, when not against irremediable or insane enemies. Although knowing Goku, he likely just wanted to keep his fighting toy intact like he did with Vegeta.

Then like you said, the protagonists are meat-heads, even worse Saiyan meat-heads. Try to tell those guys their having a picnic and not a fight.

[TheMikado]

To be honest I find it incredibly weird that Zamasu after training under Gowasu for probably million of years suddenly decides all mortals in the universe must die and to stop them he will kill his own mentor to do this if he has to. Like I get the mortals are terrible for killing each other but they're mortals, they aren't endangering the universe with destruction yet so for his decision to suddenly kill his own mentor to prevent mortal from killing each other seems kinda strange. I mean to our knowledge he hasn't had a particular enjoyment in killing things right?

[LightBing]

To be honest I find it incredibly weird that Zamasu after training under Gowasu for probably million of years suddenly decides all mortals in the universe must die and to stop them he will kill his own mentor to do this if he has to. Like I get the mortals are terrible for killing each other but they're mortals, they aren't endangering the universe with destruction yet so for his decision to suddenly kill his own mentor to prevent mortal from killing each other seems kinda strange. I mean to our knowledge he hasn't had a particular enjoyment in killing things right?

We have no time-frame for his tutelage under Gowasu, millions of years sounds too high taking into account how he seemed ignorant regarding the time-rings and the potara meaning besides fusion. If I was to guess, he must have been promoted very recently.

His dislike towards humans is already part of him from the very first appearance. It's not out of nowhere, the encounter with Goku just gave him the excuse to radicalize his views. The knowledge of the Super Dragon Balls gave him the means to put those views into action,

[Friezacooler]

To be honest I find it incredibly weird that Zamasu after training under Gowasu for probably million of years suddenly decides all mortals in the universe must die and to stop them he will kill his own mentor to do this if he has to. Like I get the mortals are terrible for killing each other but they're mortals, they aren't endangering the universe with destruction yet so for his decision to suddenly kill his own mentor to prevent mortal from killing each other seems kinda strange. I mean to our knowledge he hasn't had a particular enjoyment in killing things right?

What happened to his mentor is Still unknown and killing him one's won't get rid of him just like king Kai and Elder kai. Or does Super just like to make things up. So far they fail at killing fodders from Earth. That Samusa killed a mortal in the past, was just a fluke.

[ChaosLordBrandon]

To be honest I find it incredibly weird that Zamasu after training under Gowasu for probably million of years suddenly decides all mortals in the universe must die and to stop them he will kill his own mentor to do this if he has to. Like I get the mortals are terrible for killing each other but they're mortals, they aren't endangering the universe with destruction yet so for his decision to suddenly kill his own mentor to prevent mortal from killing each other seems kinda strange. I mean to our knowledge he hasn't had a particular enjoyment in killing things right?

He was just promoted to Kaioshin. This was stated almost the first scene he appeared in and by Whis.

[TheMikado]

Fair enough missed that.

[Pannaliciour]

Black's intentions aren't exactly good. He's pratically a racist. He feels like ALL mortals should die. His intentions would be good if he and Zamasu felt like one particular race, like the Saiyans, humans or Namekians, should be gone. As it stands, they just want a world full of Gods because Gods can do no harm whilst mortals are the root of all evil.

Even Beerus in the manga complains about Black having no reason behind his destruction and not paying attention to the balance.

Wait does that mean Black is immortal as well?

Mortal is another way of saying non-god. Or, human if you use the straight Japanese translation.

So black is a god then?

[Shounen]

So black is a god then?

Who knows? It's a mysterious guy. Has god ki. Has Time Ring. Probably created by Dragon Balls (by Whis). That's all we know.

[HeroR]

So black is a god then?

Who knows? It's a mysterious guy. Has god ki. Has Time Ring. Probably created by Dragon Balls (by Whis). That's all we know.

He didn't have god ki until Super Saiyan Rose.

[Khin]

He didn't have god ki until Super Saiyan Rose.

He may already had divine ki before but can't fully utilize the Super Saiyan form, and he only learned to utilize it after his battle with Goku. Which is why he said something like "I finally mastered Son Goku's power completely" after he turned into SSjR, at least that's how i see it. This actually makes sense considering he have a Ki similar to Zamasu, who is a god.

[HeroR]

He didn't have god ki until Super Saiyan Rose.

He may already had divine ki before but can't fully utilize the Super Saiyan form, and he only learned to utilize it after his battle with Goku. Which is why he said something like "I finally mastered Son Goku's power completely" after he turned into SSjR, at least that's how i see it. This actually makes sense considering he have a Ki similar to Zamasu, who is a god.

If he had god ki, Trunks, Piccolo, and Krillin wouldn't have been able to sense him. Black also never called himself a god, only that he's working on behalf of them.

[Alee9977]

He didn't have god ki until Super Saiyan Rose.

He may already had divine ki before but can't fully utilize the Super Saiyan form, and he only learned to utilize it after his battle with Goku. Which is why he said something like "I finally mastered Son Goku's power completely" after he turned into SSjR, at least that's how i see it. This actually makes sense considering he have a Ki similar to Zamasu, who is a god.

If he had god ki, Trunks, Piccolo, and Krillin wouldn't have been able to sense him. Black also never called himself a god, only that he's working on behalf of them.

He never called himself a God but he said he was above everybody else, he may be a god who is using Goku's body. And also he shouldn't be working with Zamasu if he wasn't a god, he should be working for Zamasu, so I have the idea that he is a superior entity or something else.

[HeroR]

He never called himself a God but he said he was above everybody else, he may be a god who is using Goku's body. And also he shouldn't be working with Zamasu if he wasn't a god, he should be working for Zamasu, so I have the idea that he is a superior entity or something else.

He still didn't have god ki since people like Piccolo, Trunks, and Krillin could sense him, and we know god ki can't be sensed by them, as seen with Trunks and Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan Vegeta. Even if we assumed he's more of a Kai, who as far as we have seen do have sensible ki by mortals, he still didn't referred to himself as a god despite coming from a higher place. So, it's possible that Black is a creature associated with the gods, but not a god himself, like Whis.

[Pannaliciour]

If he isn't a god or immortal what the hell is he? If he is mortal why killing mortals? Killing mortals because they are stupid/foolish and/or are non-gods does make sense if you are immortal or a god but doens't make sense if you aren't.