What are your ideas for a Grand Finale saga?

[Robo4900]

GT already gave us a fantastic conclusion to Dragon Ball.

However, that particular plotline has been explored now, and the situation of Dragon Ball is different. Retreading old ground would be a bad idea.

Personally, I'd do a concluding story several years in the future; zenkai boosts and such stop properly functioning at Goku and Vegeta's advanced age, perhaps Bulma and Chichi have even passed on at this point, and they're working with the still-living Piccolo and Roshi to train the next generation of fighters to fight a new threat.

In the end, Goku and Vegeta die in the conflict, and are ready to move on. They reunite with their wives, and as a part of the framing device of the storyline, Goku is relaying this all to Kaio, with some interjections from Vegeta, Grandpa Gohan, and the ladies, for some comedy. At the end, Beerus and Whis show up, and explain that as gods, they're free to come to the Dai Kaio's planet, and Beerus uses this chance to get a fight with a youthful form Goku's body was restored to for his afterlife.

Meanwhile on earth, the young generation we saw being trained by Goku, Vegeta, and Piccolo eventually have become adults, and we see their children sharing the legends of their ancestors, though they seem to be confused on some details; some of them seem to think Goku disappeared off on Shen Long's back, some think Goku and Vegeta flew off into the galaxy to have one last fight, some seem to be confused about Beerus's place in the story, one of them is pretty confused about how Goku managed to start gathering the Dragon Balls after the 21st Tenkaichi if it was only a couple of months after the last wish was made on them, etc.
What they can all agree on, however, is that whatever the details of the story, and however it fits (or indeed, doesn't fit) together, they do enjoy these legends, and they're glad to have had them, even if some of them didn't make much sense.

I realise this is a bit lame in places, but this is all in good fun, and personally I stand by the general idea of ending with the legends being passed on but having people be unclear on the details, giving a sort of nod to the fact that we have GT, and Super, and the movies, and other such contradictory stories, but somehow they all do tie together in one way or another...

[Big Boss]

Beaten by Robo. GT's ending was honestly just wonderful, a perfectly beautiful way of ending the franchise.

Dragon Ball is now akin to the MCU/Star Wars. Any notion of the series having a definite ending can be safely thrown out the window. To be honest, I couldn't even give a HYPOTHETICAL ending given its current state. Where the fuck would you even start? There's just too many loose ends and new plot points introduced by the new Broly movie and the end of Super to even consider such an event at this point. Freeza is still on the loose, Broly is a currently ambiguous character, and of course the notions of other universes complicates matters even further. It honestly feels like the franchise has been built up the way it has been over the past few years for it to specifically NOT have an end. From Toei's/Shueisha's perspective, this obviously makes a lot of sense but narratively its opened up a whole can of worms that'll probably come to bite us all in the ass in a couple of years when ideas start to become stale and recycled (which...they kind of already have).

Even the harshest GT critic will be begging for GT's ending come that time, mark my words.

[ABED]

Beaten by Robo. GT's ending was honestly just wonderful, a perfectly beautiful way of ending the franchise.

Dragon Ball is now akin to the MCU/Star Wars. Any notion of the series having a definite ending can be safely thrown out the window. To be honest, I couldn't even give a HYPOTHETICAL ending given its current state. Where the fuck would you even start? There's just too many loose ends and new plot points introduced by the new Broly movie and the end of Super to even consider such an event at this point. Freeza is still on the loose, Broly is a currently ambiguous character, and of course the notions of other universes complicates matters even further. It honestly feels like the franchise has been built up the way it has been over the past few years for it to specifically NOT have an end. From Toei's/Shueisha's perspective, this obviously makes a lot of sense but narratively it's opened up a whole can of worms that'll probably come to bite us all in the ass in a couple of years when ideas start to become stale and recycled (which...they kind of already have).

Even the harshest GT critic will be begging for GT's ending come that time, mark my words.

At least Star Wars has the overarching theme of war. You can tell plenty of stories set in the same galaxy with different characters. It's a world that can go on forever as there's a ton to say about war. The MCU is the same thing. The characters and stories share a universe and can interract, but it's not all one story. It's interconnected franchises that often interact, but not always. It's a conceit that can go on forever as different characters can come and go. DB is at its core a story about one man. Sure, it's fleshed out with a supporting cast and a unique quirky world, but DB is undoubtedly about a character, not the theme or the setting. What more is there to say about Goku?

[Big Boss]

Beaten by Robo. GT's ending was honestly just wonderful, a perfectly beautiful way of ending the franchise.

Dragon Ball is now akin to the MCU/Star Wars. Any notion of the series having a definite ending can be safely thrown out the window. To be honest, I couldn't even give a HYPOTHETICAL ending given its current state. Where the fuck would you even start? There's just too many loose ends and new plot points introduced by the new Broly movie and the end of Super to even consider such an event at this point. Freeza is still on the loose, Broly is a currently ambiguous character, and of course the notions of other universes complicates matters even further. It honestly feels like the franchise has been built up the way it has been over the past few years for it to specifically NOT have an end. From Toei's/Shueisha's perspective, this obviously makes a lot of sense but narratively it's opened up a whole can of worms that'll probably come to bite us all in the ass in a couple of years when ideas start to become stale and recycled (which...they kind of already have).

Even the harshest GT critic will be begging for GT's ending come that time, mark my words.

At least Star Wars has the overarching theme of war. You can tell plenty of stories set in the same galaxy with different characters. It's a world that can go on forever as there's a ton to say about war. DB is at its core a story about one man. Sure, it's fleshed out with a supporting cast and a unique quirky world, but DB is undoubtedly about a character, not the theme or the setting. What more is there to say about Goku?

I agree with you, and that's precisely the problem. Star Wars is not about a singular character/event but a whole universe built specifically that authors/screen writers can create their own stories so there's logic to it continuing indefinitely. It feels as though Toei and Shueisha are desperately trying to set up Dragon Ball in a similar vein, despite the core of the franchise being centered around a very small set of characters and formula. Unfortunately, this is a recipe for disaster and perhaps a catalyst for lazy writing in the future as Toriyama and Toei hastily come up with new forms/enemies to one-up the last with no end (which we're already starting to see, and we already saw at the end of Z).

With the original manga, we always had the fallback of Toriyama simply ending the series and calling it a day when he get burned out. We all know Toei attempted to continue the series with GT, but the audience was similarly burned out of the franchise just as Toriyama had been, so it failed.

I think the writers need to tread carefully over the next couple years or we'll see a similar situation.

[sintzu]

It honestly feels like the franchise has been built up the way it has been over the past few years for it to specifically NOT have an end.

Even the harshest GT critic will be begging for GT's ending come that time, mark my words.

Shueisha established an entire division (DB Room) for the franchise so the plan is currently to have DB go on for as long as possible (in other words, until it stops making money). DB is no longer a story, it's a franchise and those are made to last forever.

As flawed as GT is, at least it gave the story a definitive ending, something not even the original manga did.

What more is there to say about Goku?

Not much, and the same goes for the other characters. Apart from BOG, the new material has just been recycled ideas which won't change anytime soon based on Broly's success.

[ABED]

The manga did give a definitive ending. Uub represented the idea that there were more mountains to climb for Goku. That said, either GT's ending or even Battle of Gods' revelation that there are more universes out there with beings stronger than Goku imagined was possible are better endings for Goku and the series as a whole.

Given the theme of hard work and self-improvement, I don't think an even bigger tournament is what the story needs. I don't know what to do for an ending, and honestly don't care to give a specific idea, I just hope it actually happens, that it's surprising, but most important, that it's satisfying.

[WittyUsername]

The idea of Dragon Ball going on indefinitely bothers me in the same way that Star Wars going on indefinitely bothers me, though I would argue that it’s worse in Dragon Ball’s case, not just for reasons others in this thread have mentioned, but also because the writers for Dragon Ball seem hellbent on keeping everything within the 10 year gap at the end of the manga. If you’re going to have Dragon Ball continue indefinitely, at least allow the characters to grow, (both figuratively and literally in some cases). How are we supposed to get invested in the adventures of Goku and friends if we’re following such a rigid status quo? Even GT, for all its faults, at least had the freedom to do things like permanently killing off Piccolo and having Goku become one with the Dragon Balls.

I guess some would argue that the status quo of the series has been altered, thanks to the addition of Beerus, other universes and the umpteenth return of Freeza, but none of those things factor in to the chronological end of Goku’s story, so they just feel like window dressing at this point. It doesn’t help that so far, Freeza seems to be functioning like an 80s Saturday morning cartoon villain.

[Bullza]

What they need to do is write the Dragon Balls out of the story entirely. At least going into the last arc, you should feel like anything could happen.

Dragon Ball has always had that flaw where any consequence is undone with the Dragon Balls. They should see about having a story where they destroy them all so they can't count on them anymore.

[emperior]

It’s hard to come up with a good idea for a grand finale of Dragon Ball.

I would say that at least it should be set after the end of the manga, and the main enemy should be someone important.
I guess Freeza would be perfect as the last foe. Maybe I would have him take over the two Zenos by tricking both into killing each other and becoming Zeno himself, with Grand Priest as his servant and the two bodyguards Zeno has too.
That would establish him as the biggest threat of the multiverse as he would probably try to do some very messed up evil stuff, like sparking a multiversal war.

But I could also see a mortals vs Gods arc as the final one, possibly with either Whis or Beerus (or both) as main enemies for Goku and the others.

[Cursed Lemon]

I don't know, but it absolutely MUST involve the heroes and the villains literally fighting through the fabric of time - portaling in and out of previous encounters in the series all through the fight, leaving the peanut gallery completely dumbfounded.

[ABED]

I don't know, but it absolutely MUST involve the heroes and the villains literally fighting through the fabric of time - portaling in and out of previous encounters in the series all through the fight, leaving the peanut gallery completely dumbfounded.

I understood that reference

I just don't know if it's a criticism or just a joke.

[sintzu]

If you’re going to have Dragon Ball continue indefinitely, at least allow the characters to grow, (both figuratively and literally in some cases).

For a franchise like DB, allowing the characters to grow and develop limits the number of stories that can be told because eventually things will have to end. Look at Vegeta's character for example, in Super he's gone back to his Cell arc self so they could recapture his obsessive rivalry with Goku from that period. I'm not saying he should've been put on the side like in GT but going backwards wasn't the answer. Gohan's character went back to losing his power so they could have an epic moment of him getting them back like he did in the Buu arc. I don't think anyone was expecting him to be as strong as Goku or Vegeta but did he really need to lose his powers AGAIN ? That kind of set status quo allows them to tell an unlimited number of stories but by doing so they sacrifice plot and character development.

[ABED]

If you’re going to have Dragon Ball continue indefinitely, at least allow the characters to grow, (both figuratively and literally in some cases).

For a franchise like DB, allowing the characters to grow and develop limits the number of stories that can be told because eventually things will have to end. Look at Vegeta's character for example, in Super he's gone back to his Cell arc self so they could recapture his obsessive rivalry with Goku from that period. I'm not saying he should've been put on the side like in GT but going backwards wasn't the answer. Gohan's character went back to losing his power so they could have an epic moment of him getting them back like he did in the Buu arc. I don't think anyone was expecting him to be as strong as Goku or Vegeta but did he really need to lose his powers AGAIN ? That kind of set status quo allows them to tell an unlimited number of stories but by doing so they sacrifice plot and character development.

Was Vegeta back to his Cell arc self or is it that he just wanted to be better than Goku that makes you believe he's taken two steps back? Hyper competitiveness with Goku doesn't mean he's regressed. Last I saw him in DB Super: Broly, he was competitive but not in a homicidal way. He was even mature when faced with Broly. He didn't egg him on for the sake of a fight. I think that's progress.

[sintzu]

Was Vegeta back to his Cell arc self or is it that he just wanted to be better than Goku that makes you believe he's taken two steps back? Hyper competitiveness with Goku doesn't mean he's regressed. Last I saw him in DB Super: Broly, he was competitive but not in a homicidal way. He was even mature when faced with Broly. He didn't egg him on for the sake of a fight. I think that's progress.

I guess it depends on the writer. One minute he's his mature Buu arc self like he was In Broly but the next he's all "how dare you surpass me again Kakarot" Cell arc self.

[Koitsukai]

To me GT and Super ended on a really high note. Both could be the end of the series to me and I would be fine with it. The ToP arc was to me the perfect way to end the show for good, even with the Zenos fist bumping with Goku and him saying that we'll met again soon. Goku surpassing the GoDs, attaining a great form and all, Vegeta openly supporting Goku, it felt like the World Cup Final.

I guess now I would need to go beyond that kind of stakes, so a brawl involving every universe and having the Hakaishins finally join the fight(something not even DB Heroes is doing) could do that. Villains that can defeat Hakaishins and finally see Goku train with the GP. I like what Heroes is doing, but should be done way better, would love to see Broly, Jiren, Toppo, Kefla, Hit, Goku, Vegeta and Beerus fighting together. Or Champa and Beerus teaming up. IDK, I think the GoDs should step up some day.

My greatest fear is to become The Simpsons or Saint Seiya Omega.

[WittyUsername]

My greatest fear is to become The Simpsons or Saint Seiya Omega.

Unfortunately, that’s apparently what they’re going for.