Hindsight makes Frieza look like a hero for destroying the Saiyans

[DragonBallFoodie]

If the Saiyan race hosts members so powerful they could destroy the universe or multiple universes, then Frieza wiping them out can be interpreted as an act of heroism.

The argument that driving a race to extinction (near-extinction?) is wrong is there, but what if this particular race was too powerful? What if not just Frieza but the whole galaxy felt the same way about them?

[VegettoEX]

It's not heroism if it's explicitly for the wrong reasons.

There are grades of this along the way. Gohan wants to be a superhero to help people for the right reasons (because it's the right thing to do). Goku often times inadvertently helps people (or, like, saves the planet), but does know it's the right thing to do, and probably would anyway, even if he might have other motivations.

Freeza... uhh... was afraid and just liked committing genocide. That ain't no hero.

[SupremeKai25]

But Freeza didn't do it because he was driven by some heroic goal to preserve the universe, he did it because he feared the saiyans would become too dangerous to his regime in the long run. It was for a completely selfish reason. There's no nuance here.

[DragonBallFoodie]

We don't know, and probably never will know the level of opinion about the Saiyans.

But if the galaxy thought the Saiyans were the most feared people in the galaxy, then at least some of them may have felt grateful to Frieza for wiping them out (assuming that they knew he did it).

There's no disputing that Freeza is a monster, the dispute is if his action was the lesser of two evils.

[SuperSaiyaManZ94]

Though of course for a while Freeza was using the Saiyans more or less as underling grunts in his planet operations, and even then his extermination of them came from a fear/paranoia of them rising up against him and his organization in rebellion plus the fact that he never really trusted them to remain allegiant in that role to begin with, which the Bardock special clearly shows in spades. His decision to wipe out Planet Vegeta and the entire Saiyan race didn't come from a pure or noble reason. Though of course, depending on if people on other worlds elsewhere had found out he was behind it rather than thinking it was a meteor collision perhaps quite a few really did feel grateful in some way that he did away with them. The Saiyans were ultimately barbaric savages who lived to kill, and it's likely that more than a few worlds in the greater area of the universe feared them. Even though what Freeza did wasn't heroic in of itself, it can be considered somewhat so in disguise given their reputation which spared a lot of other worlds and their people the fate of being massacred by them.

[It_Is_Ayna_You_Flips]

I wouldn't call it heroism but killing off a (almost always) chaotic evil race of blood thirsty super warriors is probably something the rest of the galaxy appreciated. It's an example of evil people doing (arguably) good things for entirely evil reasons.

[JulieYBM]

Going to make the incredibly brave decree that genocide is wrong no matter what.

[SupremeKai25]

Most species in the universe would hate Freeza and his family a lot more than the saiyans. They killed many more people and pretty much devastated the U7 along with Buu.

[Matches Malone]

Not really, as he wasn't doing it for heroic reasons, it was due to his fear from them. That's not to say they didn't deserve it, but he's no better than they were.

[Vijay]

I'm the kind of guy who considers more than the henchmen, it's the mind that ordered the hit is considered evil.

Saiyans invaded Planet Plant, took it by force from Tuffles & made it their home. Pretty sure it was Frieza/King Cold who ordered Saiyans on mass conquest/genocide across the Galaxy

Not sayin Saiyans were innocent, but pretty sure whatever invasion those barbaric monkey would've done is considerably on small-scale. It was Frieza's intrusion which made Saiyans atrocities/menace to spread across the universe.

And yeah, Frieza (despite being afraid of Super Saiyan legend) can be considered a hero for eradicating Saiyans. Just imagine another 10K Nappa/Raditz/Veggie roaming around...humans/Z fighters had enuf screw-ups Veggie inflicted with Frieza, Cell & Boo. So yeah. A clean no with Saiyans

[MasenkoHA]

Of all the bad takes this is pretty bad.

Wiping out an entire race just because you don't want any of them staging a coup and overthrowing you so you can reign supreme as emperor of the universe does not make you a hero. Even in hindsight.

Freeza was no better than the Saiyans. It's made pretty clear that the only thing separating Vegeta from Freeza is Freeza has power that Vegeta only wishes he had.

[jjgp1112]

We don't know, and probably never will know the level of opinion about the Saiyans.

But if the galaxy thought the Saiyans were the most feared people in the galaxy, then at least some of them may have felt grateful to Frieza for wiping them out (assuming that they knew he did it).

There's no disputing that Freeza is a monster, the dispute is if his action was the lesser of two evils.

...But having Frieza around is even WORSE for those same planets. Frieza didn't solve anything for those other races but give them a new face to see before they die.

The Saiyan genocide was a bunch of bullsharks being taken out by a big ass Great White Shark. The sea is still unsafe for human swimming.

[Polyphase Avatron]

Going to make the incredibly brave decree that genocide is wrong no matter what.

Maybe in real life, but against certain fictional nonhuman species it could be justified. For example, I doubt anyone would shed a tear over the genocide of monsters like this.

[Peach]

Going to make the incredibly brave decree that genocide is wrong no matter what.

Maybe in real life, but against certain fictional nonhuman species it could be justified. For example, I doubt anyone would shed a tear over the genocide of monsters like this.

Or the flood in Halo.

[Sadala Elite]

There's also no real evidence that the Saiyans were any real threat to the existence of the Universe 7.

The Supreme Kais ignored them, Beerus ignored them and they had a planet trade business of their own. They werent just mindlessly killing everyone around them.

Freeza was motivated by his own cowardice and self-interest, there's nothing heroic about what he did.

[JulieYBM]

Going to make the incredibly brave decree that genocide is wrong no matter what.

Maybe in real life, but against certain fictional nonhuman species it could be justified. For example, I doubt anyone would shed a tear over the genocide of monsters like this.

It's definitely bad in real life and even from the context of within a story FREEZA IS STILL A HORRIBLE PERSON FOR COMMITTING GENOCIDE BECAUSE GENOCIDE IS FUCKING HORRIFIC. Freeza is a bad boy who needs to be jailed for his horrific crimes, not celebrated as a hero.

[SupremeKai25]

Going to make the incredibly brave decree that genocide is wrong no matter what.

Maybe in real life, but against certain fictional nonhuman species it could be justified. For example, I doubt anyone would shed a tear over the genocide of monsters like this.

It's definitely bad in real life and even from the context of within a story FREEZA IS STILL A HORRIBLE PERSON FOR COMMITTING GENOCIDE BECAUSE GENOCIDE IS FUCKING HORRIFIC. Freeza is a bad boy who needs to be jailed for his horrific crimes, not celebrated as a hero.

Well he was jailed in Hell, before the dumbass Goku decided to bring him back.

Unsurprisingly, that was a bad idea in the long run. Cause at the end of the Broly movie we can see that Freeza is back to slaughtering innocent civilizations.

[JulieYBM]

It's a fictional story, so I can understand ignoring and overlooking things for the sake of plot and character interaction but to actively paint a character's genocide as a good thing is exhausting.

[Polyphase Avatron]

Going to make the incredibly brave decree that genocide is wrong no matter what.

Maybe in real life, but against certain fictional nonhuman species it could be justified. For example, I doubt anyone would shed a tear over the genocide of monsters like this.

It's definitely bad in real life and even from the context of within a story FREEZA IS STILL A HORRIBLE PERSON FOR COMMITTING GENOCIDE BECAUSE GENOCIDE IS FUCKING HORRIFIC. Freeza is a bad boy who needs to be jailed for his horrific crimes, not celebrated as a hero.

I never said he was, just that in some cases fictional species are bad enough to deserve genocide.

[DragonBallFoodie]

...But having Frieza around is even WORSE for those same planets. Frieza didn't solve anything for those other races but give them a new face to see before they die.

The Saiyan genocide was a bunch of bullsharks being taken out by a big ass Great White Shark. The sea is still unsafe for human swimming.
[/quote]
LOL I think that analogy fits well enough that it seals this discussion IMO.

The "big fish encounters bigger fish" theme present in DB means that while Saiyans can surpass their limits, Freeza and his race was one of the few who could match/go beyond them and in fact had kept them as workers. So in the end they weren't too different in power, just in mindset.

And if the Universe 6 Saiyans are similar enough to Universe 7's, then it means that the Saiyans would have eventually stabilized into affable relations with the rest of the universe.