"Dragon Ball Super (Manga)" Official Discussion Thread

[Xeztin]

When power levels and Gaps went to hell I convinced myself that the power level was equivalent to the weight of ones sack. Goku and Vegeta's about a 100 pound, Beerus about 150-175. Whis is a freaking G at about 300 which explains why he has to wear big long robes to cover it up to hide his true power level.

[dbzfan7]

When other characters get into the action, it adds more suspense to the story. It adds more speculation to the story. It adds more diversity, and a better utilization of the supporting characters.

I'll give you diversity, but highly disagree with everything else. I don't feel suspense, because Dragon Balls. I don't feel speculation cause Goku and now Vegeta show up is what everyone expects. Better utilization I wouldn't be too sure. I'd say cheap drama. I'm not at all feeling suspense until the most powerful are in trouble in a series like Dragon Ball. That wasn't a problem until the power gap became more and more ridiculous. My favourite comparison is Gohan from the Boo saga and ROF. Boo beating the shit out of Gohan meant something as Goku and Vegeta while stronger, are not that far above him. So if Boo can kick Gohan's ass easily, those two surely are in trouble. That builds suspense. Freeza beating the shit out of Gohan means nothing as that's not impressive anymore. Goku and Vegeta are so far above him, so that feat no longer has much meaning. So I'm not really worrying at all or feeling suspense. The only way to feel suspense in Dragon Ball is to remove the safety nets (And they added another 1 or 2 now), or make us really think there's a threat that can topple the big dogs.

Saiyan saga must have been really boring for you then D: Since the power gap between everyone and nappa was way to big.

Well no we had a decent warm up with the Saibamen, and some nice team up fights against Nappa. The earthlings and Piccolo could potentially have won if they fought together sooner, and if Gohan wasn't a wuss. Some people couldn't be wished back which brought suspense since there wasn't any safety nets for them. We knew Vegeta was even worse than Nappa, but no idea how much worse, which made us worried. We also didn't know how strong Goku was at the time or how he'd handle the two. At first we thought it'd be easy with Nappa being smacked around, but then Nappa turns out to be tough even for Goku. So we think Goku may not stand a chance against Vegeta, til Kaio-Ken. Then the arc had a great final bout, and a huge team effort to defeat Vegeta. It was far from boring. The biggest shame being the earthlings couldn't get better after the arc.

[kinisking]

I'm just waiting for Gohan to be a force to be reckoned with so that I don't have to hear things like him being a joke anymore. Apparently you have to be one of the strongest to be a respectable character nowadays. *In b4 you'll be waiting a long time*

Cause in a sense it's true.

In what sense? He tried his hardest to fight for the world when he doesnt even like fighting. He refused to let goten and trunks help him even though he didn't stand a chance because he didn't want them to get injured. He beat Tagoma in 2 hits when no one besides for him there could have beaten him at all. Yes Freeza tortured him, but freeza at this point was ridiculously strong and it could have been anyone. Even then, he managed to muster enough energy to reach his dad billions of miles away and was willing to do so at the risk of his own life. Afterwards he even learns he has to train. Pretty damn respectable for someone doesn't like fighting.

[pacz360]

It's sad that the z anime cared about the earthlings more than the creator did

[JulieYBM]

It's sad that the z anime cared about the earthlings more than the creator did

Why is it sad? Creators should be allowed to do as they please.

[pacz360]

I'm just waiting for Gohan to be a force to be reckoned with so that I don't have to hear things like him being a joke anymore. Apparently you have to be one of the strongest to be a respectable character nowadays. *In b4 you'll be waiting a long time*

Cause in a sense it's true.

In what sense? He tried his hardest to fight for the world when he doesnt even like fighting. He refused to let goten and trunks help him even though he didn't stand a chance because he didn't want them to get injured. He beat Tagoma in 2 hits when no one besides for him there could have beaten him at all. Yes Freeza tortured him, but freeza at this point was ridiculously strong and it could have been anyone. Even then, he managed to muster enough energy to reach his dad billions of miles away and was willing to do so at the risk of his own life. Afterwards he even learns he has to train. Pretty damn respectable for someone doesn't like fighting.

All because his dumbass decided to slack off after what happen with buu and beerus situations it cause of him piccolo had to die again saving his ass like he was five again you would've think hey ya know maybe I have dad teach me the god ritual or at least train to keep his ultimate form at very least to make sure this doesn't happen but fuck doing shit with common sense lets go with the opposite.

[pacz360]

It's sad that the z anime cared about the earthlings more than the creator did

Why is it sad? Creators should be allowed to do as they please.

Never said he can't hell it his work besides all I'm saying in z anime they at least got bit of a break where manga they not so much.

[dbzfan7]

All because his dumbass decided to slack off after what happen with buu and beerus situations it cause of him piccolo had to die again saving his ass like he was five again you would've think hey ya know maybe I have dad teach me the god ritual or at least train to keep his ultimate form at very least to make sure this doesn't happen but fuck doing shit with common sense lets go with the opposite.

I'm waiting to see if joke time is over, or if I'll have even more material to ridicule Gohan with. So far ignoring the elephant in the room is a bad start for him. For now I withhold my jokes til I see the next big thing he does. If something good I get to gleefully enjoy myself. If bad I get to make more Gohan sucks jokes. He's still below unborn fetus Pan tier at the moment .

[namekiansaiyan]

In super there has been too much Goku and Vegeta, they do all the fighting and they say all the dialogue aswell, in episode 32 piccolo was with them most of the time but hardly said anything. There needs to be more diversity we could have at least seen piccolo train or meditate before the tournament but instead just more Goku and Vegeta. Buu should have stayed in the tournament to have more variety. Toriyama better not let Goku be the fifth fighter if universe 7 can have one, they should reinstate Buu and do not have gohan as he is a saiyan and we have 3 already. Piccolo needs to win to keep variety and the whole concept of the z-fighters going.

[KidGoku>3]

Oh save me the theatrics. In nearly every Arc in this series, Goku saves the day. It's been a constant pattern for many years, and if someone else gets to shine a little, that shouldn't be a big deal. And when you say other characters such as Piccolo and Gohan have become a "JOKE" as you put it, name me another fighter from the original cast not named Goku or Vegeta that has been relevant so far in Super...

When other characters get into the action, it adds more suspense to the story. It adds more speculation to the story. It adds more diversity, and a better utilization of the supporting characters. Kakarot potentially losing against Frost should not mean the end, the guy has been saving the day since 1984, and seeing that someone else could win the tournament is refreshingly new. Do not get me wrong, I love Kakarot, it is just not something bad to embrace change every once in a while.

You clearly missed my point. Did you even bother reading what I wrote ?
You can't totally ignore a character during an entire arc and then suddenly, without any backstory or proper explanation have them be on certain power levels. That's lazy writing.
Let Piccolo shine. But don't ignore him for 32 episodes, portray him so weak enough he can barely handle a henchman, ignore his training then suddenly make him win against a very strong opponent to which his much much more superior teammate loses out on.

[kidhero1000]

maybe this is why Universe 6's Earth was destroyed

[Ssgvegito30]

maybe this is why Universe 6's Earth was destroyed

Lmao I literally fell of my chair laughing my ass off.....

[apex_pretador]

Maybe Beerus gave him the plans for the android designs.

From what I read, what really happened in terms of 17 & 18 was that he found their human components made them far too powerful.
Basically he enhanced human natural perpetual energy generation which cause them to have an "unlimited" amount of power.
No excuse for 16 though. 19 & 20 could have been made from information gained on 17 and 18.

why the hell did he make androids 1 million times stronger than goku could achieve at best without training with king kai?

[alakazam^]

It's the power of maths.

[Lionel]

In super there has been too much Goku and Vegeta, they do all the fighting and they say all the dialogue aswell, in episode 32 piccolo was with them most of the time but hardly said anything. There needs to be more diversity we could have at least seen piccolo train or meditate before the tournament but instead just more Goku and Vegeta. Buu should have stayed in the tournament to have more variety. Toriyama better not let Goku be the fifth fighter if universe 7 can have one, they should reinstate Buu and do not have gohan as he is a saiyan and we have 3 already. Piccolo needs to win to keep variety and the whole concept of the z-fighters going.

The Namekian Book of Legends could give Piccolo the biggest power up of his life and allow him to form a trinity of protagonists with the Saiyans and I believe it would still get tiresome after awhile. You can only write so much for three antiquated one-note characters whose stories were already told and resolved years ago. What makes it worse is the fact that both Piccolo and Vegeta principally share the same character archetype. If you don't keep the roster fresh and varied enough along with providing interesting new stories then it's going to become dull for a lot of fans. Piccolo by himself wouldn't be enough to mitigate this issue, even if he did become a series regular like Vegeta which I doubt he will.

[Xeztin]

I think they just need to make better use of the cast or introduce new main stays like Jaco. I agree that their story and character development hit its peak years ago but it'd be a lot better if they had people as strong as Goku and Vegeta on the cast. I hope in U6 we get more non-Saiyan mainstays for the cast thats just as strong because Jaco has already filled the comedy spot. With all these new characters, I think they will have Cabba and Monaka as new cast members. Beerus and Whis sort of feel like part of the crew as well. I really hope the entire cast goes to U6 except for Tien and Yamcha as it seems they arent used for anything, not even comedy. I hope the rest goes to U6 and they meet new people who become the new "z" warriors to speak bluntly.

[immakillya]

crazy thought, but what if the manga does something different with the fights than the anime? maybe Goku beats frost in the manga, but in the anime the fighters actually take turns? because nothing has been revealed in the manga or anime that Goku loses. We just know piccolo fights frost in the anime >.> just saiyan

Both the anime and manga pretty clearly state that the winner stays in to fight. For the anime, if Piccolo is fighting Frost in Episode 34, then Goku is out of the tournament, regardless of if he's defeated or steps down of his own free will. For the manga? Who knows. We won't officially find out what's going on with Goku vs. Frost and beyond until after Episode 36.

correct me if I'm wrong, but the anime has not clearly stated that the winner stays in the fight.... it has been said in the manga but not in the anime as of yet >.>

[Araki]

correct me if I'm wrong, but the anime has not clearly stated that the winner stays in the fight.... it has been said in the manga but not in the anime as of yet >.>

That was made even clearer in the anime, when Champa and co. decided the rules. He flat out said that in episode 28:


Champa: "Let's see... How about a team competition with five fighters each? We both send in a single fighter first. If that fighter wins he gets to fight the next one. And then the first to defeat the final fighter on the opponent's team wins!"

[apex_pretador]

It's the power of maths.

I'm not saying how, but WHY.
1. Gero observed goku vs raditz:

Goku max ~= 1000
#17 ~= 200,000,000 = 200,000x stronger than goku

2. Gero was observing goku vs vegeta on earth

Goku's highest reading ~= 24,000 (KK x4 KHH)

Android #16 >= 240,000,000 = 10,000x stronger than goku, who gero expected not to rise much.

[ekrolo2]

Maybe Beerus gave him the plans for the android designs.

From what I read, what really happened in terms of 17 & 18 was that he found their human components made them far too powerful.
Basically he enhanced human natural perpetual energy generation which cause them to have an "unlimited" amount of power.
No excuse for 16 though. 19 & 20 could have been made from information gained on 17 and 18.

why the hell did he make androids 1 million times stronger than goku could achieve at best without training with king kai?

He didn't make himself and the rest based on information without training from King Kai. He observed everything up until they left for Namek and calculated Goku's projected rate of growth even to the most unlikely extreme. Where is that extreme? Hard to say but if I were a betting man, I'd say the absolute best Gero's calculations put Goku at was around the PL of Vegeta's second to last zenkai plus whatever Kaio-Ken would do him so he'd cap off somewhere in the low millions range at his absolute peak.