"Dragon Ball Super" Series Official Announcement & Discussion Thread

[Sandubadear]

I guess this absolutely denies Kaioshin of Time's existence lol.

[Sonicjamareiz]

I guess this absolutely denies Kaioshin of Time's existence lol.

Good let her DIE but seriously wasn't she a Toriyama creation?

[TheDevilsCorpse]

I guess this absolutely denies Kaioshin of Time's existence lol.

I wouldn't really say a "Kaioshin Time Ring" absolutely denies her existence. I sincerely doubt Toriyama has any plans of including Chronoa or anything, but it could easily tie in to that material with what little bit of info we have. A more in-depth reveal in Episode 50 could certainly stomp on the concept in Super's continuity though.

but seriously wasn't she a Toriyama creation?

I don't know who came up with the concept in Dragon Ball Online. It could have been Toriyama, but nothing says so difinitively. He definitely didn't design her though. She was only given a design for Xenoverse, and he was consulted on the design for that, but someone else was still doing the actual work.

[dblack]

I hope Goku Black has the same mentality as regular Goku in he wants to fight the strongest people. I'm hoping to see Black whoop Goku and flat out tell him "why don't you fuse with Vegeta so this isn't so boring."

[MaGyunia]

I wonder if Black is strong enough to stand against a SSGSS

The "problem" is that we seem to be dealing with a kind of power which has only very recently been introduced in Dragonball. Up until now and throughout the entirety of the franchise we based the fighters' and characters' strength, regardless of whether they're villains or heroes, on sheer power and level of Ki. With Zen-ou-sama and quite possibly Black (with the help of the still mysterious ring) we seem to be dealing with a kind of power that enables the user to basically manipulate and do absolutely whatever he pleases with absolutely everyone and everything in existence, which is something I don't appreciate. Dragonball was always - and should continue to be - about getting to meet stronger opponents in order to train and surpass both yourself and the opponents themselves, in a never-ending battle for evolution in terms of fighting prowess, and this goes against that. We'll see how it develops. Given this small introduction in my answer, yes, I believe Black has the (type of) power to stand against Goku and Vegeta as Super Saiya-jin God Super Saiya-jins, which, if proven right by time as the episodes come out and are aired, would make it necessary for Goku (or both Goku and Vegeta, with some help from the most powerful entities in existence, hence the presence of the Zen-ou-sama, for example) to also reach that "new" sort of power, which goes beyond merely getting stronger.

Black, on another note, seems smug, evil and arrogant, but he somehow, for some reason I can't really make out, strikes me as the kind of guy who, despite absolute confidence in his abilities, would be smart enough to escape if the circumstances turned against him, though, and look for a solution before he met his opponents in a final battle where he had the upper hand again.

What does this say. I am very curious

Spoiler:

First Part tells about Goku taking the fight agaist Goku Black because he enjoys fighting, but looks like Goku Black isn't fighting seriously.

Second part is something about Goku Black ring being called the Ring of Time and that apparently only the Kaioshinｓ had access to it, and Beerus and Whis notice it.

It's becoming gradually more and more apparent that Black's extreme power (beyond his fighting abilities, I mean the power to travel through time and manipulate reality, etc.) stems from his relationship with Zamasu, who is most likely just the Kaioshin of the Universe Black came from and whom Black had killed in the past at some point and stolen the powerful ring from. Even the Kaioshin shouldn't have a ring with that kind of power, but different Universes have different rules, I guess.

I hope Goku Black has the same mentality as regular Goku in he wants to fight the strongest people. I'm hoping to see Black whoop Goku and flat out tell him "why don't you fuse with Vegeta so this isn't so boring."

I doubt it. While he might beat Goku (in their first battle) and belittle the Saiya-jins as a race in general by making or repeating the same derogatory comments and remarks we already saw him making, I'm sure there are decisive and fundamental differences between his approach to fighting and to adversaries and Goku's. He'll be arrogant as well towards Goku if he does beat him at some point, though, and if Vegeta gets the same treatment it will be another instance reminiscent of all the times Vegeta got beaten by the major antagonist of an arc and failing miserably.

[Cipher]

If you decide to watch a show on a regular basis and really follow it with the proper interest and attention, one of the first pieces of information you should or must get is that (in this case) it's a sequel to quite A LOT of previous events shown in previous animes. How can someone go and watch DBSuper without knowing right off the bat that there's something preceding it called Dragonball Z?

And yeah, with a certain effort you could even watch DBZ without watching DB, but DBSuper contains Super Saiya-jin 3, the Fusion, a huge number of characters, planets, references to the past, etc., which make sense to the viewer only if he has thoroughly watched or got A LOT of information on previous events. DBSuper definitely isn't one of those stand-alone cases. And the flashbacks aren't nearly enough either. In DBSuper's case, you definitely NEED to know about at least the most important events, transformations and characters of DBZ, at least the later stages of it, in order to understand it and connect to it, otherwise you have no idea what the hell you're watching.

It's a little less heavy on explanations of past material than Z, due mainly to its brisker pace, but there isn't that much a difference between watching Super and, say, the equally brisk Kai. Think of all the things that crop up in Z/Kai that are of huge import and completely depend on knowledge of the previous series to really grasp: all the deaths and revelations in the Saiyan arc, Piccolo's relationship with Goku, Piccolo's relationship with Kami, the Red Ribbon Army, etc. It's not all explained, but it's straight forward enough for anyone to be on board moving forward.

For that matter, it's not like everyone came into the series squarely at the beginning of one of the series or even a particular arc. It was serialized in print and on television for a decade. People drifted in on random chapters all the time, and if they wanted to continue it from there, they just had to follow along, or wait until they could get all the tankobon, catch anime reruns (no home video), etc.

Super's really no different in this regard. It will be some people's introduction to the series. They're not likely to not realize it's a sequel due to the amount of marketing of pre-Super material that still targets children in Japan (and Z's ubiquity in the West), but it'll still be plenty of kids' jumping-on point. Some people's very first Dragon Ball arc is airing right now. It doesn't matter that they don't know a Super Saiyan 3 from a Super Saiyan Blue. They can still get into the story.

[MaGyunia]

Someone mentioned their "annoyance" or disappointment at Goku not wearing Black's outfit, but that sort of über-cool uniform is reserved for evil guys only. Being sleeker and especially the long sleeves, along with the pricelessly evil expression on his face, along with other stuff related to his history and background, etc., give him the potential to be the most serious villain in DBSuper and one of the most serious in the entirety of Dragonball. In fact, as far as only DBSuper goes, he's the FIRST and ONLY true villain (yes, I'm deliberately taking Golden Freeza out of the picture, and no, I don't have anything against Fukkatsu no F) that can be taken seriously up until now, hence potentially all the hype surrounding him, his background and scenarios and his potential to be a serious menace to the good guys just like Piccolo Daimao, Vegeta and Nappa, Freeza, Cell and Majin Buu were.

I really hope that Black isn't that much more powerful than Goku. I really want to see an even fight not just a one sided beatdown. And seeing Goku gaining SSJ Blue+Kaioken and still get stomp just annoy me.

He might be more "powerful" in their first encounter in a different way, as in, fighting-wise Goku might be much more skilled, but Black probably has (or has been given) a "kind" of power Goku just doesn't have, giving Black the upper hand. According to that theory, which has been recurrently postulated not just by me, it will take Goku reaching that same "type" (not level) of power to overcome this new foe, and make no mistake about it, DBSuper, even more than DBZ, has to have Goku be the one to finally put a decisive and final end to the villain in each arc.

Although, some of you guys have a serious obsession with Goku and Vegeta's Resurrection 'F' outfits.

Damn right, and I'm proud of it.

I saw them as serving a specific purpose and I liked them, but I also liked the surprise I got when they decided to go back to the original outfits both of them are known for, and the reason for that has to do mostly with the fact it's another aspect reminiscent of the Cell arc who we are all reminded of when just thinking of Mirai no Trunks for a second.

I also really hope Goku Black just flat out kicks Goku's ass.
I think Black not taking Goku seriously is a hint that Goku and Vegeta isn't in his league which means a new transformation or fusion is in order

Agreed with both elements. My main favorite characters in all of Dragonball are all - or have been previously - villains, and I did enjoy watching Goku get his sh*t beat out by Piccolo Daimao, or, in another sense, the sense of desperation Goku experienced during the nearly 10 episodes of the fight between non-SSJ Goku and Freeza on Namek, which made the series and the outcome and the consequences of Goku's apparently inevitable defeat even more dramatic. THAT'S when I root for Goku. When he shows up to save the day, but even that must be made and approached in the right way. He needs to take a beating at some points instead of being all powerful and be the one to save the day every single time. But there's something totally different about Goku's "I'll handle this myself, alone" shown in the Saiya-jin and Freeza arcs that's beyond badass, he's the ray of hope, the absolute good, and that feeling is entirely different from the reasons I have to have evil guys as my favorite characters. If they somehow manage to pull off something along the lines of Goku's sudden appearances to save the Universe in that absolutely badass manner, then good, but if he's just there to deliver the final blow like he did in Fukkatsu no F, then definitely NO.

As far as the fusion goes, I've been thinking of just how powerful a Super Saiya-jin Blue Vegitto would be. But that's the problem I've been talking about recurrently here. This time around it'll take more than sheer power to beat the enemy, it will take a different "kind" of power (ability to travel through time, manipulate reality and space, etc., in other words, near-absolute power to do ANYTHING and EVERYTHING as they please). Can't state my disappointment and frustration and anger at having that sort of power brought to Dragonball at this point, even though I know I'm repeating myself with the risk of becoming annoying.

I hope we're given more of Black's maniacal laughs when fighting. It's good to see Goku isn't shit to him (based on what the text said).
Given his insane laugh when punched by Trunks (Which knocked the spit out of him) almost like he liked the pain, I'm hoping he's somewhat a Joker character.

The Joker isn't the only fictional character who's a psychopath who laughs at destruction even when that destruction is aimed towards him. However, Nozawa's absolutely fantastic job when doing Black much in the same wavelength as she did Turles reached its climax with that laugh. I have a thing for insane psychopaths. If I can find them in Dragonball, they automatically move up in my list of potential new favorite all-time characters.

[MaGyunia]

If you decide to watch a show on a regular basis and really follow it with the proper interest and attention, one of the first pieces of information you should or must get is that (in this case) it's a sequel to quite A LOT of previous events shown in previous animes. How can someone go and watch DBSuper without knowing right off the bat that there's something preceding it called Dragonball Z?

And yeah, with a certain effort you could even watch DBZ without watching DB, but DBSuper contains Super Saiya-jin 3, the Fusion, a huge number of characters, planets, references to the past, etc., which make sense to the viewer only if he has thoroughly watched or got A LOT of information on previous events. DBSuper definitely isn't one of those stand-alone cases. And the flashbacks aren't nearly enough either. In DBSuper's case, you definitely NEED to know about at least the most important events, transformations and characters of DBZ, at least the later stages of it, in order to understand it and connect to it, otherwise you have no idea what the hell you're watching.

It's a little less heavy on explanations of past material than Z, due mainly to its brisker pace, but there isn't that much a difference between watching Super and, say, the equally brisk Kai. Think of all the things that crop up in Z/Kai that are of huge import and completely depend on knowledge of the previous series to really grasp: all the deaths and revelations in the Saiyan arc, Piccolo's relationship with Goku, Piccolo's relationship with Kami, the Red Ribbon Army, etc. It's not all explained, but it's straight forward enough for anyone to be on board moving forward.

For that matter, it's not like everyone came into the series squarely at the beginning of one of the series or even a particular arc. It was serialized in print and on television for a decade. People drifted in on random chapters all the time, and if they wanted to continue it from there, they just had to follow along, or wait until they could get all the tankobon, catch anime reruns (no home video), etc.

Super's really no different in this regard. It will be some people's introduction to the series. They're not likely to not realize it's a sequel due to the amount of marketing of pre-Super material that still targets children in Japan (and Z's ubiquity in the West), but it'll still be plenty of kids' jumping-on point. Some people's very first Dragon Ball arc is airing right now. It doesn't matter that they don't know a Super Saiyan 3 from a Super Saiyan Blue. They can still get into the story.

They might, but they'll be leagues apart from grabbing the entire Dragonball experience. First of all, they missed DB and DBZ and all of the enormity of events they contain, and they are truly enormous and fantastic, and I'm not criticizing them or saying it's their fault. Most of them weren't even born or were small children when it was happening. But setting off with the aim to watch DBSuper without knowing with a particularly high level of detail what the previous transformations, the characters, the story, the events are equals pretty much watching a new show that's based almost entirely in something you missed, hence it's virtually (not virtually, totally) impossible for them to grasp just what the hell is going in DBSuper most of the times, let alone the entire atmosphere most of us have known and experienced with DB and DBZ.

And DBSuper is composed of entirely new material. Kai isn't. Quite in fact, one of the quickest and easiest ways to go and watch DBSuper weekly while knowing what led the story to that is by watching Kai. I don't even regard Kai as a full-fledged series in some aspects and according to some definitions, it's basically a version of DBZ without all some might call the bullsh** that came along with it (as in, filler material), even though it completely lacks and fails in most crucial moments when compared to DBZ at its best scenes.

I don''t criticize those who set off to watch DBSuper while not knowing the different between what a Super Saiya-jin and a Super Saiya-jin Blue is, or not even knowing what a Saiya-jin actually is or how hard it used to be to reach any SSJ transformation, and all of these are absolutely ESSENTIAL elements of the story (and just a percentage of it...), but come on, man, it's like being a football fan, trying to watch the Euro 2016 enthusiastically while not even knowing who won the World Cup 2014 or who Cristiano Ronaldo is. This stuff needs to be put into context, and for newcomers that means a lot of work and time which they might not have or might not bother to spend.

[Bullza]

I'd be all for Zamasu being the canonical Supreme Kai of Time. The one in Xenoverse didn't have the best character design.

[Kanassa]

.

This might come across a little bit as self-serving, but I think it helps illustrate the point I want to make about how important the forum has become.

How does this illustrate that point? It just eans a lot of people use it, if the fourm wasn't here people would just go to another one.

[Pannaliciour]

For those people that think that Goku will AGAIN beat the main villain: how many times did Goku actually won from dbz-dbs in a fight without the help of his friends? 1 time right? Frieza.

[Kanassa]

it will take a different "kind" of power (ability to travel through time, manipulate reality and space, etc., in other words, near-absolute power to do ANYTHING and EVERYTHING as they please). Can't state my disappointment and frustration and anger at having that sort of power brought to Dragonball at this point, even though I know I'm repeating myself with the risk of becoming annoying.

From what the previews imply, the ring just allows Black to travel through time. No where near the power to anything and everything as he pleases.

[worrior_v1]

Is dragon ball super on tommorow?

[VegettoEX]

Is dragon ball super on tommorow?

Dragon Ball Super airs Sunday mornings at 9:00 a.m. on Fuji TV in Japan.

[sintzu]

Is dragon ball super on tommorow?

It'll air in 10 hours from now.

[Grimlock]

Great, another thing related to time, but apparently not related to Kaioshin of Time herself...

[Anime Kitten]

Great, another thing related to time, but apparently not related to Kaioshin of Time herself...

I second this.

[HeroR]

For those people that think that Goku will AGAIN beat the main villain: how many times did Goku actually won from dbz-dbs in a fight without the help of his friends? 1 time right? Frieza.

I don't soloing mean that much for the main villain since not even Freeza was a solo effort. Freeze fought Vegeta, Krillin, and Gohan, before fighting Piccolo, then a power-up Vegeta, before fighting Goku who was nearly killed until Piccolo interfered and acted as a decoy while Goku finished the Spirit Bomb. The Japanese in general also put more emphasis on teamwork than one person soloing the entire act.

So, although Goku beat Freeza by himself after turning a Super Saiyan, he still needed help before that point. The point is, Goku was the major reason why the heroes won. Against Vegeta, he gave Krillin the Spirit Bomb that crippled Vegeta and was able to communicate with his son so Gohan could attack Vegeta in his Great Ape form. Before then, he beat Nappa who murdered everyone else. In the Cell Saga, it was his guidance and encouragement that helped Gohan beat Cell and he gave his life to save the planet. The same with the Buu Saga. It was his Spirit Bomb that finished off Buu.

In Super, in Battle of Gods, it was Super Saiyan God Goku given Beerus one hell of a fight that made Beerus spared the Earth. So although Goku lost the battle, he still ended up winning since he did save the world. Resurrection 'F', he did beat Freeza in a fair match, then Freeza cheated, Vegeta stepped in, screwed up and took too long to kill Freeza and the Earth got destroyed, and Goku ended up finishing Freeza. In the Champa Saga, much like with Beerus, Goku may have forfeited, but it was given Hit one hell of a fight, stroking his warrior spirit, and flipping off their respective gods that led to U7's victory.

In short, Goku may not have a solid solo win since Freeza, if you want to count that, but his influence in the victory or success of each saga cannot be understated.

[Kanassa]

Great, another thing related to time, but apparently not related to Kaioshin of Time herself...

If there is one character I want to become canon, it's that barrel of cutness!

[Grimlock]

A lot of awesome stuff from Online could become be involved properly in the series... Why Toriyama insist in ignoring it?