Dragon Ball Super Strength Discussion Thread

[Helios518]

Future Zamasu is only shown standing up to Blue Goku because he is immortal. He's more or less around Trunks' level before the new form. So even if he is stronger than Present Zamasu, it's not by much. Having the abillity to no-sell damage is huge and is making up for the gap between their powers. It's been repeatedly shown Goku can stomp him, but he keeps coming back up because he can't actually be hurt.

The difference between the Vegetto vs Boohan situation and Merged Zamasu is that it's been shown before in the series that unless charactersare around the same power, the fusion result is not that effective. Merged Zamasu's boost would be more akin to Kibitoshin's rather than Vegetto's.

The difference between Zamasu's fusion and Kibitoshin's fusion is that the latter fused with some one a lot weaker than himself and he himself is like below Boo Saga SSJ Goku while Zamasu's fusion has two power houses very similar in power just like Vegetto's.

[Draconic]

My point is that Zamasu's contribution is not that high since he isn't that close to Black's. Zamasu is about as strong as base Black and Rose Black is at least dozens of times stronger than that if Rose is his regular SSJ substitute or even greater if it's a Blue substitute. Zamasu's major contribution is the immortality. Of course, he gives a power boost too and to the already more powerful-than-SSB Black, but it's nothing major like Vegetto's, who has a rival boost on top of the natural strength of fusion.

[HeroR]

Future Zamasu is only shown standing up to Blue Goku because he is immortal. He's more or less around Trunks' level before the new form. So even if he is stronger than Present Zamasu, it's not by much. Having the abillity to no-sell damage is huge and is making up for the gap between their powers. It's been repeatedly shown Goku can stomp him, but he keeps coming back up because he can't actually be hurt.

The difference between the Vegetto vs Boohan situation and Merged Zamasu is that it's been shown before in the series that unless charactersare around the same power, the fusion result is not that effective. Merged Zamasu's boost would be more akin to Kibitoshin's rather than Vegetto's.

Being an immortal wouldn't increase his speed and the ability to hit people. He pushed Goku back several times when they fought. If Gotenks became an immortal, he wouldn't suddenly be able to hit Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan Goku as a Super Saiyan 3, if Goku's base can no sell his attacks. Being immortal only made Zamasu durable.

And that's the Fusion Dance you're thinking of.

[Draconic]

He also got stabbed by Trunks in his first appearence, was barely able to keep up with enraged Goku, who downright kicked his ass with two hits and was paired up with SSJ2 Trunks after Black turned Rose the first time.

What does the Fusion Dance have to do with anything? Kibitoshin or the potential Goku-Dende/Satan potara fusions barely get any stronger because one half is much weaker than the other.

[HeroR]

He also got stabbed by Trunks in his first appearence, was barely able to keep up with enraged Goku, who downright kicked his ass with two hits and was paired up with SSJ2 Trunks after Black turned Rose the first time.

What does the Fusion Dance have to do with anything? Kibitoshin or the potential Goku-Dende/Satan potara fusions barely get any stronger because one half is much weaker than the other.

It has been said several times that Zamasu drops his guard all the time since he's an immortal. Or are you saying Super Saiyan 2 Trunks can hit Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan Goku. It should also be noted that Super Saiyan 2 Trunks kicked Black into a building and blocked his blade. So is Black only a little stronger than Trunks? Enrage Goku got a power boost that overwhelmed Black until he improved, so that isn't a mark of Zamasu being weak.

We don't know how strong Kibito-Kai was. Only that he was weaker than Buu who absorbed Gotenks who was kicking Gohan's ass. And Denda is a terrible example since he isn't even a fighter.

[Bullza]

Unless I'm missing some part of the scan, it doesn't specifically say that. Atsushi Kido states that Beerus is "overwhelmingly strong, but if we leave him out, then I think the strongest fighter is Goku Black" - it's clear that he wasn't even including fused characters in his comparison.

Yeah I'm wondering what everyone is going on about. Herms did this translation



Obviously that wouldn't be taking into account Merged Zamasu because the anime already said he was stronger or Vegito. So where's everyone getting this stuff about Beerus > Vegito from?

All it really confirms is Beerus > Black > Goku ~ Vegeta.

[HeroR]

Unless I'm missing some part of the scan, it doesn't specifically say that. Atsushi Kido states that Beerus is "overwhelmingly strong, but if we leave him out, then I think the strongest fighter is Goku Black" - it's clear that he wasn't even including fused characters in his comparison.

Yeah I'm wondering what everyone is going on about. Herms did this translation



Obviously that wouldn't be taking into account Merged Zamasu because the anime already said he was stronger or Vegito. So where's everyone getting this stuff about Beerus > Vegito from?

All it really confirms is Beerus > Black > Goku ~ Vegeta.

Any reason you think Goku is stronger than Vegeta?

[Mazingerdestro]

Any reason you think Goku is stronger than Vegeta?

Wait what? Vegeta isn't even mentioned.

[ekrolo2]

Yeah I don't see how Black is the strongest non-fused person, just two episodes ago Vegeta made him his bitch so what, did he just power up again and we didn't get a chance to see it? Cause I assume he'd just kill Goku & Vegeta if he got a boost from his pseudo, plot Zenkai bullshit.

[HeroR]

Any reason you think Goku is stronger than Vegeta?

Wait what? Vegeta isn't even mentioned.

If you read Bullza's post, they had Goku above Vegeta. I wasn't referring to the interview at all.

[Legion]

Beerus killed Present Zamasu, who is much weaker than Future Zamasu. Present Zamasu was weaker than Super Saiyan 2 Goku. Zamasu can trade blows with Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan Goku.

He literally erased him, not just kill.

That's nothing special, it's just a technique. Cell could've done the same to Freeza if he had the technique.

How can be "nothing special", if we don't know the limits of this technique? .-. Erase the existence is pretty much OP.

For all we know, Beerus probably can't erase only people stronger than him, like Whis etc.

[HeroR]

How can be "nothing special", if we don't know the limits of this technique? .-. Erase the existence is pretty much OP.

For all we know, Beerus probably can't erase only people stronger than him, like Whis etc.

That's a fandom head canon that Beerus erased Zamasu from existence.

[Legion]

How can be "nothing special", if we don't know the limits of this technique? .-. Erase the existence is pretty much OP.

For all we know, Beerus probably can't erase only people stronger than him, like Whis etc.

That's a fandom head canon that Beerus erased Zamasu from existence.

Come on, now.....That Beerus erased Zamasu is clear....

[Bullza]

Any reason you think Goku is stronger than Vegeta?

Isn't ~ supposed to mean around as? I suppose I should have put the = sign, I think they're just equal.

Yeah I don't see how Black is the strongest non-fused person, just two episodes ago Vegeta made him his bitch so what, did he just power up again and we didn't get a chance to see it?

Perhaps he did just surpass when he upgraded to the scythe. It wouldn't be too far-fetched they do keep passing each other up back and forth. I suppose if you included the clones as well it would make him more dangerous at least.

Plus someone brought up something Black said which pointed to him being superior though I can't remove exact comment now.

[HeroR]

Come on, now.....That Beerus erased Zamasu is clear....

Beerus vaporized him, which is par the course for this series and is hardly special. It also doesn't mean he erased Zamasu from existence.

Any reason you think Goku is stronger than Vegeta?

Isn't ~ supposed to mean around as? I suppose I should have put the = sign, I think they're just equal.

Yeah I don't see how Black is the strongest non-fused person, just two episodes ago Vegeta made him his bitch so what, did he just power up again and we didn't get a chance to see it?

Perhaps he did just surpass when he upgraded to the scythe. It wouldn't be too far-fetched they do keep passing each other up back and forth. I suppose if you included the clones as well it would make him more dangerous at least.

Plus someone brought up something Black said which pointed to him being superior though I can't remove exact comment now.

I mean, Vegeta power up after training for six months and surpassed Black for a time. Why do think Goku is still stronger than Vegeta?

It could be me. My argument was that Black surpassed Vegeta because his clones were able to hit and harm Vegeta. Unless you think the clones were stronger than Black, that shouldn't be possible if Vegeta was still superior.

[Alruneia]

Any reason you think Goku is stronger than Vegeta?

Isn't ~ supposed to mean around as? I suppose I should have put the = sign, I think they're just equal.

Yes, using ~ in that context means "about equal to". It represents the wavy equals sign.

[Legion]

Come on, now.....That Beerus erased Zamasu is clear....

Beerus vaporized him, which is par the course for this series and is hardly special. It also doesn't mean he erased Zamasu from existence.

I don't want starting a discussion about something so clear. That Beerus erased Zamasu is obvious, that scene is clear, is not so strange since we know that Beerus can also erase any ki blast and he's a God of Destruction (so he has godly powers, like Whis, all other Gods and now even merged Zamasu). But think what you want.

[HeroR]

I don't want starting a discussion about something so clear. That Beerus erased Zamasu is obvious, that scene is clear, is not so strange since we know that Beerus can also erase any ki blast and he's a God of Destruction (so he has godly powers, like Whis, all other Gods and now even merged Zamasu). But think what you want.

He destroyed him, not erased his existence.

[Legion]

I don't want starting a discussion about something so clear. That Beerus erased Zamasu is obvious, that scene is clear, is not so strange since we know that Beerus can also erase any ki blast and he's a God of Destruction (so he has godly powers, like Whis, all other Gods and now even merged Zamasu). But think what you want.

He destroyed him, not erased his existence.

No. Rewatch the scene.

[HeroR]

No. Rewatch the scene.

I have seen the scene several times, thank you. Unless it shows that Zamasu's very soul got destroyed, he wasn't erased.