Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

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sintzu
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by sintzu » Fri May 03, 2019 11:48 am

Cooler doesn't play around. He didn't wait for Freeza to transform or anything...just shot a beam through his head and that was that. So many problems could have been avoided if more characters acted that way.
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Brikikoz » Fri May 03, 2019 2:08 pm

Kanassa wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 10:54 am

I can believe that Frieza would be arrogant enough to fuck himself over in this way, but the oddness fo this scene comes from how easily it occured and was to do. It stands out as awkward because if something so simple was enough to make Cooler finally murder Frieza, why has it taken until now to happen? How did this not occur in all the other timelines? This whole conversation before the killing blow sounds like it would be a usual thing for the two, so why is it now that Cooler decides that he'll go through with killing Frieza?

Hell, from the way the conversation went, it almost looks like Cooler just can't tolerate Frieza's lack of manners. "We may be tyrannical overlords, but by god, you better say your pleases and thank yous or you're getting a death beam up the ass. You can't piss on hospitality, I WON'T ALLOW IT!"
That is 100% in character for the poser Frost Demons, who think of themselves as dignified kings but are just barely above savages when even slightly pushed.


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And we get another reminder that Cooler had always intended to take over Freeza's territory eventually, he just got angry enough to do it now.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by HeroR » Fri May 03, 2019 2:48 pm

Brikikoz wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 2:08 pm
Kanassa wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 10:54 am

I can believe that Frieza would be arrogant enough to fuck himself over in this way, but the oddness fo this scene comes from how easily it occured and was to do. It stands out as awkward because if something so simple was enough to make Cooler finally murder Frieza, why has it taken until now to happen? How did this not occur in all the other timelines? This whole conversation before the killing blow sounds like it would be a usual thing for the two, so why is it now that Cooler decides that he'll go through with killing Frieza?

Hell, from the way the conversation went, it almost looks like Cooler just can't tolerate Frieza's lack of manners. "We may be tyrannical overlords, but by god, you better say your pleases and thank yous or you're getting a death beam up the ass. You can't piss on hospitality, I WON'T ALLOW IT!"
That is 100% in character for the poser Frost Demons, who think of themselves as dignified kings but are just barely above savages when even slightly pushed.


Image

And we get another reminder that Cooler had always intended to take over Freeza's territory eventually, he just got angry enough to do it now.
This entire panel is eye rolling dumb since it takes Cooler killing some random Saiyan baby for him to go, ‘fuck it, I’ll take over everything, KILL EM’ ALL’. He literally didn’t do this in another timeline despite having plenty of opportunity to murder Freeza in those timelines.

That and Freeza even being that invested in a low class Saiyan is also weird.

The whole thing feels both force and undercook.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Brikikoz » Fri May 03, 2019 3:52 pm

HeroR wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 2:48 pm

This entire panel is eye rolling dumb since it takes Cooler killing some random Saiyan baby for him to go, ‘fuck it, I’ll take over everything, KILL EM’ ALL’. He literally didn’t do this in another timeline despite having plenty of opportunity to murder Freeza in those timelines.

That and Freeza even being that invested in a low class Saiyan is also weird.

The whole thing feels both force and undercook.
Seems fine to me. Multiverse is all about how single decisions change everything. Cooler simply lost his temper and impulsively acted. Just like Vegetto decided not to drop his shield in Buu or how Krillin didn't listen to Goku before killing Vegeta.

As for Freeza, he was lying to save face in front of his brother.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Kanassa » Fri May 03, 2019 4:27 pm

Brikikoz wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 3:52 pm
Seems fine to me. Multiverse is all about how single decisions change everything. Cooler simply lost his temper and impulsively acted.
It doesn't matter if multiverse is about how single decisions change everything, there has to be some reasoning to those decisions and why the character made this different choice. Cooler making the decision to kill Frieza here makes no sense because if it was so damn easy for him, as a character, to go ahead with deciding to kill Frieza, why hadn't he done so already and why didn't he do this in other timelines? The animosity has been made pretty clear between the two, so this scenario should have played out already if it was so damn easy.
When Super apparently shoves Goku down our throats:


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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Marco Polo » Fri May 03, 2019 4:39 pm

Kanassa wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 4:27 pm
Brikikoz wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 3:52 pm
Seems fine to me. Multiverse is all about how single decisions change everything. Cooler simply lost his temper and impulsively acted.
It doesn't matter if multiverse is about how single decisions change everything, there has to be some reasoning to those decisions and why the character made this different choice. Cooler making the decision to kill Frieza here makes no sense because if it was so damn easy for him, as a character, to go ahead with deciding to kill Frieza, why hadn't he done so already and why didn't he do this in other timelines? The animosity has been made pretty clear between the two, so this scenario should have played out already if it was so damn easy.
He did do that in other timelines. He also didn't do that in some other timelines.

And no there isn't necessarily a reasoning to the changes. It's all about quantic variations and random fluctuations. Remember that in one world the sky could be blue and in another the same sky could be red:

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by HeroR » Fri May 03, 2019 5:13 pm

Brikikoz wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 3:52 pm
HeroR wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 2:48 pm

This entire panel is eye rolling dumb since it takes Cooler killing some random Saiyan baby for him to go, ‘fuck it, I’ll take over everything, KILL EM’ ALL’. He literally didn’t do this in another timeline despite having plenty of opportunity to murder Freeza in those timelines.

That and Freeza even being that invested in a low class Saiyan is also weird.

The whole thing feels both force and undercook.
Seems fine to me. Multiverse is all about how single decisions change everything. Cooler simply lost his temper and impulsively acted. Just like Vegetto decided not to drop his shield in Buu or how Krillin didn't listen to Goku before killing Vegeta.

As for Freeza, he was lying to save face in front of his brother.
There is a big different between 'Of What of a Nail' vs forcing a narrative. If Cooler was always this trigger happy to kill Freeza, then this shouldn't be the only timeline that Cooler put a Death Beam in Freeza's head.

Actually Freeza isn't lying since one Special actually has Freeza assigning Goku to Earth. So Freeza's line matched up to that if all things remain the same, which it should since everything was similar up to that point.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by HeroR » Fri May 03, 2019 5:19 pm

Marco Polo wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 4:39 pm
He did do that in other timelines. He also didn't do that in some other timelines.

And no there isn't necessarily a reasoning to the changes. It's all about quantic variations and random fluctuations. Remember that in one world the sky could be blue and in another the same sky could be red:

Image
Aw, there is. In most Butterfly Effect stories (at least the good ones), there is always a clear reason why things went off the rails from one small event, not just 'things are just different, because this one event happened'. In this case, Cooler killing Freeza comes off as random and forced since he could literally do this at any time, yet for some reason he just didn't in other timelines. Honestly, it makes one wonder why he just didn't strangle Freeza when he was younger and pass off the death as an 'accident'.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Marco Polo » Fri May 03, 2019 6:26 pm

HeroR wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 5:19 pm
yet for some reason he just didn't in other timelines.
Except he did. Remember, in DBM there are at least 5 trillion universes (by the way it's parallel universes not timelines) but we only barely see 20 of them.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Regarder » Fri May 03, 2019 11:16 pm

Something "out of character" isn't infinitely improbable, just merely unlikely, and if you have trillions beyond trillions of alternate universes with tiny adjustments of what can happen, you can always select that ridiculously improbable case. That's sort of the crutch for multiverse; nothing is out of character because it can always be justified as "Yes, but this is the Universe where Cooler had a different personality".

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Fionordequester » Sat May 04, 2019 1:24 am

HeroR wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 5:13 pm
There is a big different between 'Of What of a Nail' vs forcing a narrative. If Cooler was always this trigger happy to kill Freeza, then this shouldn't be the only timeline that Cooler put a Death Beam in Freeza's head.
Alright, here's a good reason: Cooler wasn't expecting Freeza to be stupid enough to confront him in a reduction form. So because he didn't shoot down the ship in most continuities, he never stared Freeza down aboard his ship. And since he never stared Freeza down aboard his ship in any other timeline, he never saw just how dumb Freeza actually was.

Or perhaps he wasn't even thinking about the possibility of killing him until Freeza forced his hand. He panics about him potentially telling Cold... Then realizes "wait a minute, he's in a reduction form... I can just kill him right now!". And then acts upon that impulse.

Or, perhaps he was surprised at just how disrespectfully Freeza was treating him. In that moment, he was even angrier than normal, and did something he wouldn't have otherwise done had Freeza not threatened him.

Are any of those reasons true? I don't know... But I don't feel like this is that out-of-character for him. We all know how badly Cooler had been wanting to kill him in every timeline. He just happens to be fairly pragmatic and cautious most of the time, that's all.
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Brikikoz » Sat May 04, 2019 5:11 am

It's weird to see people arguing over a character who has expressed desire to kill someone...killing someone at a slightly earlier time.

It'd be OUT of character for Cooler to ignore Freeza being a disrespectful brat.

Do people live in worlds where no one has ever lost their temper or acted impulsively even once?

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Kanassa » Sat May 04, 2019 7:23 am

Brikikoz wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 5:11 am
Do people live in worlds where no one has ever lost their temper or acted impulsively even once?
Do you? Because that's the only way Cooler not killing Frieza before makes any sense.
When Super apparently shoves Goku down our throats:


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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by TheOverlyMadHatter » Sat May 04, 2019 11:27 am

I don't think Coola offing Freeza at this juncture is too far-fetched. It's shown in this series that Forst Demons live for centuries; Coola could have easily just wait 40-50 years to off Freeza and it wouldn't have been that much time for him. We do know he hasn't been anywhere near him since Vegeta's destruction. Here, we have Freeza summoning Coola to chew him out. Yes, Coola was said (yes, said, not shown) in his first movie to be more methodical than Freeza, but his sense of superiority toward him always came off as petty. In his weakest from no less; he's practically serving Coola an opportunity to usurp him on a silver platter. Therefore, killing his mouthing off, disrespectful little brother doesn't seem like too far of a stretch.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by HeroR » Sat May 04, 2019 9:04 pm

Fionordequester wrote:
Sat May 04, 2019 1:24 am
HeroR wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 5:13 pm
There is a big different between 'Of What of a Nail' vs forcing a narrative. If Cooler was always this trigger happy to kill Freeza, then this shouldn't be the only timeline that Cooler put a Death Beam in Freeza's head.
Alright, here's a good reason: Cooler wasn't expecting Freeza to be stupid enough to confront him in a reduction form. So because he didn't shoot down the ship in most continuities, he never stared Freeza down aboard his ship. And since he never stared Freeza down aboard his ship in any other timeline, he never saw just how dumb Freeza actually was.

Or perhaps he wasn't even thinking about the possibility of killing him until Freeza forced his hand. He panics about him potentially telling Cold... Then realizes "wait a minute, he's in a reduction form... I can just kill him right now!". And then acts upon that impulse.

Or, perhaps he was surprised at just how disrespectfully Freeza was treating him. In that moment, he was even angrier than normal, and did something he wouldn't have otherwise done had Freeza not threatened him.

Are any of those reasons true? I don't know... But I don't feel like this is that out-of-character for him. We all know how badly Cooler had been wanting to kill him in every timeline. He just happens to be fairly pragmatic and cautious most of the time, that's all.
Didn't feel like, 'you forced my hand'. Felt more like, 'You rude SOB, die!'. Which is why this felt really forced.

That and Freeza is always in his reduced form. He could kill him at any time, dumped the body into the sun, and say 'an accident happened'. The conditions of Freeza's death wasn't something oddly unique in this timeline since this should have happened dozens of times like 17 killing Gero.

I also never said it was OOC. I'm not shocked that Cooler killed Freeza, I'm put off by how it happened.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by coola » Sun May 05, 2019 2:33 pm

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That last panel...I need an adult?
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by FoolsGil » Sun May 05, 2019 3:05 pm

Why is he hiding though?

Also...Mentioning this follows U3 on Earth, I wonder if this means U9 will follow U3 to the release of King Piccolo. If they do, I wonder where the divergence was. I would love a reality where there's superpowered humans and the Saiyan army.
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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by TheOverlyMadHatter » Sun May 05, 2019 3:22 pm

FoolsGil wrote:
Sun May 05, 2019 3:05 pm
Why is he hiding though?
I mean, she's walking through his door uninvited with a gun in her hand. Safe to assume she isn't up to any good.

Martial arts master or not, it's probably best to ambush an armed would-be burglar before any shot could be fired, rather than face them head-on.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by HeroR » Sun May 05, 2019 6:57 pm

coola wrote:
Sun May 05, 2019 2:33 pm
Image
That last panel...I need an adult?
Is this the same artist? What happened to the faces? Bulma looks like a man in the second to last panel.
Kanassa wrote:
precita wrote:Goku will still be around but take a Buu saga approach backseat.
Goku barely took a backseat in the Buu saga, at best he took a leisurely stroll round back while everyone else cried for him to come back.

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Re: Fanmanga - DB Multiverse

Post by Fionordequester » Sun May 05, 2019 7:00 pm

HeroR wrote:
Sun May 05, 2019 6:57 pm
Is this the same artist? What happened to the faces? Bulma looks like a man in the second to last panel.
Nope. This special was a fairly turbulent one. The average artist would only submit a few pages before dropping it :P .
Kataphrut wrote:It's a bit of a Boy Who Cried Wolf situation to me...Basically, the boy shouldn't have cried wolf when the wolves just wanted to Go See Yamcha. If not, they might have gotten some help when the wolves came back to Make the Donuts.
Chuquita wrote:I liken Gokû Black to "guy can't stand his job, so instead of quitting and finding a job he likes, he instead sets fire not only to his workplace so he doesn't have to work there, but tries setting fire to every store in the franchise of that company".

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