GT and misogyny

[Matches Malone]

So you're mis-gendering people now?

He's mis-gendering himself, as wearing a wig doesn't make him a woman, but it clearly allows him to get away with far more than me or you. That's a fact, whether we like it or not.

[Jord]

Well, what's 'writing the men all out' when a whole story arc or episode to a girl could last months if not years?

Besides, it's good for cis men to learn to emphasize with women and see them as more than just tits and ass. Society asks the many marginalized genders to consume cis male aimed media as the default and norm, why not flip that around and break the cycle of toxic masculinity.

Yeah, because labeling all "cis men" as people that don't emphasize with women at all isn't inherently insulting to a very large group of people. For someone asking for sympathy you're sure going about it the wrong way.

"Society" makes what sells. It's that simple. If enough people like and watch a show it gets renewed. If not enough people watch it, it gets cancelled.

Besides, there's such a thing as a target audience. Since DB is a Shonen, it's target audience consists of male boys. Focusing on a girl arc for months would not work as well. Same as with a Shoujo anime suddenly flipping a switch and focusing on males.

[KBABZ]

So you're mis-gendering people now?

He's mis-gendering himself, as wearing a wig doesn't make him a woman, but it clearly allows him to get away with far more than me or you. That's a fact, whether we like it or not.

Regardless I'm fairly sure dead-gendering someone is against the rules here, not to mention grossly inconsiderate, hence why it's against the rules.

[PurestEvil]

So you're mis-gendering people now?

He's mis-gendering himself, as wearing a wig doesn't make him a woman, but it clearly allows him to get away with far more than me or you. That's a fact, whether we like it or not.

How the fuck would you know shes misgendering herself?

[Shaddy]

Y'all aren't going to logic this guy out of a position he obviously didn't logic himself into. I recommend ignoring and reporting. He can go whine on gab or something about getting "cancelled".

[Cure Dragon 255]

So you're mis-gendering people now?

He's mis-gendering himself, as wearing a wig doesn't make him a woman, but it clearly allows him to get away with far more than me or you. That's a fact, whether we like it or not.

And to think I wanted to defend you before this! Enjoy the ban asshole.

[jjgp1112]

Society asks the many marginalized genders to consume cis male aimed media as the default and norm, why not flip that around and break the cycle of toxic masculinity.

You keep talking about toxic masculinity yet you're by far the most toxic dude on this site. I guess if others here pretended to be women they'd be allowed to be just as toxic you are.

Don't let the doorknob hit you on the ass.

[Jord]

So you're mis-gendering people now?

He's mis-gendering himself, as wearing a wig doesn't make him a woman, but it clearly allows him to get away with far more than me or you. That's a fact, whether we like it or not.

And to think I wanted to defend you before this! Enjoy the ban asshole.

Please don't insult other users. Thank you

Society asks the many marginalized genders to consume cis male aimed media as the default and norm, why not flip that around and break the cycle of toxic masculinity.

You keep talking about toxic masculinity yet you're by far the most toxic dude on this site. I guess if others here pretended to be women they'd be allowed to be just as toxic you are.

Don't let the doorknob hit you on the ass.

Let's keep it civil.

on-topic
While I still stand by that DB as a Shounen series doesn't need to change the focus to a female group, they could of course make a spinoff. Actually I'm surprised that with so many characters we haven't gotten that many spinoffs yet. The Yamcha-manga was a very interesting example on how this could work. Heck, they could do an entire manga series with a similar premise but other characters.

[JulieYBM]

Damn, this is a hell of a way to wake up.

Anyway, here's a selfie that makes me feel like a bad bitch. No makeup since I wear a mask all day.

https://i.imgur.com/zIVFjAs.jpg

Estrogen is magic.
❤❤❤

[DBZAOTA482]

Since I've only loosely engaged with the topic before (apologies to the TC by the way), do you all think there would be backlash if Dragon Ball ever had a cast that consisted of female fighters as the main focus? Do you think that'd be something Toriyama-san would be interested in if the idea was ever presented to him? I noticed some of his previous projects have had female leads.

Oh definitely, there's a huge portion of the fanbase who consider Dragon Ball Z to be very masculine and MANime and would flip THE FUCK out if the fighting cast were to be all women.

Dragon Ball Z was created during a time when females didn't get much representation in shonen (although shonen was becoming more popular with females).

[KBABZ]

Since I've only loosely engaged with the topic before (apologies to the TC by the way), do you all think there would be backlash if Dragon Ball ever had a cast that consisted of female fighters as the main focus? Do you think that'd be something Toriyama-san would be interested in if the idea was ever presented to him? I noticed some of his previous projects have had female leads.

Oh definitely, there's a huge portion of the fanbase who consider Dragon Ball Z to be very masculine and MANime and would flip THE FUCK out if the fighting cast were to be all women.

Dragon Ball Z was created during a time when females didn't get much representation in shonen (although shonen was becoming more popular with females).

Oh definitely. Don't get me wrong, I'm well aware there are lots of women who love Dragon Ball and would love to have some stories that better represent them!

[JulieYBM]

Violent comic battles? Actually very popular among us women.

(Also, some of us want to see the hot guys fuck).

[Gaffer Tape]

He's mis-gendering himself, as wearing a wig doesn't make him a woman, but it clearly allows him to get away with far more than me or you. That's a fact, whether we like it or not.

I'd argue you're free to engage in debate about the fairness of applicability of rules in a forum, but using hateful, transphobic rhetoric to make that "point" is absolutely disgusting and extremely painful to read. That's not okay. Ever.

[WittyUsername]

I’m starting to believe that I made a terrible mistake when making this thread.

[Majin Buu]

I wouldn't say so Witty.

If anything, this is a topic the fandom's needed to have a reckoning with for a while now.

There's always going to be assholes that expose themselves whenever topics like this come up. That's life. Doesn't mean these topics don't warrant discussion.

[JulieYBM]

Yeah, it definitely sucks how much misogyny and transphobia exists in fandom spaces. Dragon Ball isn't the only fandom that suffers from this bullshit but since it's the one where I'm most active it definitely stands out a lot to me and has really underscored how I'm not the same person with the same priorities I used to be and used to have. Fandom is supposed to be fun but the internet really isn't a great place to have that fun, I find.

Anyway, I didn't get much sleep last night and I also don't really have anything new to add to the topic of "GT and misogyny" since I really don't like repeating myself.

As such, I'll just leave this post with this: be cool, stay in school.

[VegettoEX]

Y'all aren't going to logic this guy out of a position he obviously didn't logic himself into. I recommend ignoring and reporting. He can go whine on gab or something about getting "cancelled".

Report and move on, indeed.

(The playbook for this is generally that they immediately email and demand to know which specific rule they've broken, why they were not informed, and to be reinstated. If we’re REAL lucky, they cite free speech. Once they don't receive a reply, they go to their next-preferred discussion board, where they fabricate a story about how they're being personally targeted and how Kanzenshuu has truly turned a corner into irrelevance. In the meantime, they send more emails and add on social media messages. Sometimes they send it to other staff members as well as the @kanzenshuu account, as if they're going to talk to my manager and get me in trouble.)

Besides, there's such a thing as a target audience. Since DB is a Shonen, it's target audience consists of male boys. Focusing on a girl arc for months would not work as well. Same as with a Shoujo anime suddenly flipping a switch and focusing on males.

Dragon Ball came at a time when Jump's demographic was shifting to a fairly even split due in part to the editorial oversight, their experience, and their guidance. I would recommend you check out the "Neo-Shonen" article we asked Daryl Surat to write in our 30th anniversary fanzine. It's not as a simple or or reductivist as "focusing on a girl arc"; there's some real interesting insight and granularity to how things were constructed.

[JulieYBM]

Remember how shoujo comics editor Kondou Yuu took over as the second editor for Dragon Ball, raising its popularity to new heights for the Saiyan, Namek and the first two-thirds of the Artificial Humans arc? Sounds like an appeal to women if I've ever heard one. ♥

[VegettoEX]

Yep, that’s something addressed in the article I just linked!

[JulieYBM]

Yep, that’s something addressed in the article I just linked!

I swear to gosh, I had the idea from remembering the Daizenshuu before I read the article! >_<