Unpopular DB opinions
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
The criticism that Super is the "Goku show" is baseless and applies tenfold to GT.
Favorite sagas: Tien Shinhan (DB), Frieza (Z), Future Trunks (Super)
Favorite characters: Frieza, Future Trunks, Beerus, Android 17, Zamasu, Gohan
Favorite characters: Frieza, Future Trunks, Beerus, Android 17, Zamasu, Gohan
- SupremeKai25
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
Yeah to be honest it's kind of funny when you think about it. Out of all the DB series, Super is the show with the least amount of Goku wanking. Just look at the arcs:
- BoG: He loses against 10% Beerus.
- RoF: He practically lost really, Whis had to rewind time.
- Universe 6: He lost and Monaka came in clutch at the end.
- Future Trunks arc: Self-explanatory.
- ToP: Goku needed to team up with Frieza to eliminate Jiren; and Android 17 won the Tournament of Power, instead of Goku the MC.
- Broly movie: He couldn't defeat Broly and needed to fuse with Vegeta.
In fact Goku is a big loser in Super, even in the Future Trunks arc in the end it wasn't even him that destroyed Fused Zamasu's body, but Trunks.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
Goku has always been the main character of Dragon Ball, and I don’t understand why anyone would think differently.
With that said, there is an argument to be made that GT does prop Goku up more than usual. He’s practically the only character in that show who’s actually useful in a fight. Everyone else is just fodder whose biggest contributions are giving their ki to Goku. Even Pan, who is undoubtably the deuteragonist of the show, is mostly there for Goku to save her.
With that said, there is an argument to be made that GT does prop Goku up more than usual. He’s practically the only character in that show who’s actually useful in a fight. Everyone else is just fodder whose biggest contributions are giving their ki to Goku. Even Pan, who is undoubtably the deuteragonist of the show, is mostly there for Goku to save her.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
I do wish that other characters in GT (besides Pan) were more effective in the series. But viewing GT through the lens that it's the grand finale, I enjoy it essentially being "Goku's Finest Hour."
The story of DRAGON BALL starts from the moment Goku met Bulma. I don't really mind the Z, so long as it's understood that it's not the true beginning of the story.
I actually prefer the Goku vs Tenshinhan and Goku vs Piccolo Jr. rivalries to the Goku vs Vegeta rivalry.
I actually prefer the Goku vs Tenshinhan and Goku vs Piccolo Jr. rivalries to the Goku vs Vegeta rivalry.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
I think DB doesn't have the greatest track record of knowing what to do with its cast but it's not as simple as giving a supporting character the victory or making it more of an ensemble story.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
You wouldn't believe how commonly this "criticism" was thrown around 12 years ago, people would use that their foundation alone when it came to bashing GT which they sometimes called "Goku Time". Though maybe it comes from the idea that for the most part the other characters weren't as fun to watch in GT as they were in original series so maybe it was frustration from that but even then it was silly then as its silly now to say that Dragon Ball shoudln't be about Goku when he's the main character.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
I like that GT actually has Goku in I believe each episode. If you find Goku getting the spotlight annoying, episodes in which other characters are waiting/stalling for time so Goku can arrive are even more annoying and Z has plenty of those.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
If you think about it, basically every main villain from Z except for Buu was basically this.
Saiyan saga: Everyone keeping Nappa and Vegeta busy until Goku arrives from otherworld
Frieza saga: Everyone keeping Frieza busy until Goku gets healed
Cell saga: Everyone keeping Cell busy until Goku ends his training (as well as androids before that, until Goku awakes)
Although Buu saga in the end turned out to be the same thing, they just didn't know he is going to come.
"I will concede that your feelings are worthy of the mightiest of Saiyans. However, there is more to my power than just this. Before you die, I will show it to you. This is the difference in power, between the primitive Saiyans and the evolved Tsufruians." ~Baby Vegeta
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
If the character usage and focus in GT appears different from the previous two series, it's because the show is trying to do something original and go in an entirely different direction. It's not simply the next installment or the third part of the story. To me it seems like Toei basically decided to disconnect in many ways from the other shows and create something new. Even if only for a limited amount of time.
Re: Unpopular DB opinions
Yup, at least GT doesn't pretend that it's not all about Goku. Other characters help here and there but I'm glad that they retired the "Goku is out of commision" trope. Such a shame too since I really like the beginning of the Namek part of Z, before it turned into "waiting for Goku's spaceship to arrive" followed closely after "waiting for Goku to heal in Freeza's ship"sunsetshimmer wrote: ↑Sun Sep 05, 2021 2:34 pmIf you think about it, basically every main villain from Z except for Buu was basically this.
Saiyan saga: Everyone keeping Nappa and Vegeta busy until Goku arrives from otherworld
Frieza saga: Everyone keeping Frieza busy until Goku gets healed
Cell saga: Everyone keeping Cell busy until Goku ends his training (as well as androids before that, until Goku awakes)
Although Buu saga in the end turned out to be the same thing, they just didn't know he is going to come.
Re: Unpopular DB opinions
Not really no. Vegeta thought he didn’t need Goku and the others just ran with itsunsetshimmer wrote: ↑Sun Sep 05, 2021 2:34 pm
Frieza saga: Everyone keeping Frieza busy until Goku gets healed
Again no. They just were focusing on hiding Goku from the Androids. And Vegeta was just trying to defeat Cell. He wasn’t trying to keep Cell busy until Goku finished his training.Cell saga: Everyone keeping Cell busy until Goku ends his training (as well as androids before that, until Goku awakes)
The Saiyan saga is the only time the heroes trying to stall for time and keep the bad guys busy until Goku arrived was an actual plot point.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
Maskenko, I think you're being a tad pedantic there (I know, the irony) but yes, pretty much everyone is just buying time for Goku to arrive. Sure, Vegeta's not, but everyone else is.
And it's pretty much a repeat with Cell. Sure they would like to defeat their enemies without Goku but they spend a good amount of time hoping Goku wakes up so he can save the day.
And it's pretty much a repeat with Cell. Sure they would like to defeat their enemies without Goku but they spend a good amount of time hoping Goku wakes up so he can save the day.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
This. I don't see how this is a bad thing according to many. I mean execution? Okay, had flaws for sure. But saying GT is bad because it made Trunks and Pan main characters and not Vegeta is just silly. This is basically what DBS is, keeping everything the same from Z, the same cast with barely any changes to their designs either, just look at Goten and Trunks. Even DBZ wasn't the same as DB, so why would GT be like DBZ? People expected it to be just another DBZ season i guess, well it's not and never meant to be. I will always appreciate a fact we got female fighter as main protagonist for the first and only time so far. Even if she didn't do much as a fighter it was still refreshing. I like that they tried something different with series even if results weren't always satisfying.MyVisionity wrote: ↑Sun Sep 05, 2021 3:18 pm If the character usage and focus in GT appears different from the previous two series, it's because the show is trying to do something original and go in an entirely different direction. It's not simply the next installment or the third part of the story. To me it seems like Toei basically decided to disconnect in many ways from the other shows and create something new. Even if only for a limited amount of time.
"I will concede that your feelings are worthy of the mightiest of Saiyans. However, there is more to my power than just this. Before you die, I will show it to you. This is the difference in power, between the primitive Saiyans and the evolved Tsufruians." ~Baby Vegeta
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
Goku being taken out of the action, while the rest of the characters are left wondering what to do without him, is an infamously common trend in Dragon Ball that more or less began with the Piccolo Daimao arc. Toriyama used that plot point as a crutch for much of the story.
Re: Unpopular DB opinions
It's an easy way to build tension but it's indeed overused. When it's used to much you shift your mindset from "will the currently active heroes beat the bad guy" to "Will Goku arrive in time?" which devalues the current fight.WittyUsername wrote: ↑Mon Sep 06, 2021 11:01 pm Goku being taken out of the action, while the rest of the characters are left wondering what to do without him, is an infamously common trend in Dragon Ball that more or less began with the Piccolo Daimao arc. Toriyama used that plot point as a crutch for much of the story.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
I don’t get how people prefer Movie 10 over Movie 11. Yeah, neither of them are all that good and both should have had someone other than Broly as the villain. However, Movie 10 is so DULL and uninteresting, the epitome the DBZ films’ substancelessness and action for its own sake. At least Movie 11 had a minor “scientific disaster film” feature that distinguishes itself, not to mention the absence of Goku, Android 18’s presence, and Krillin actually being contributive. If only Broly was not the focus of this film, it would have been at been more than average.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
DB doesn't have much in the way of substance so I don't see the issue.PurestEvil wrote: ↑Sun Sep 12, 2021 12:10 pm I don’t get how people prefer Movie 10 over Movie 11. Yeah, neither of them are all that good and both should have had someone other than Broly as the villain. However, Movie 10 is so DULL and uninteresting, the epitome the DBZ films’ substancelessness and action for its own sake. At least Movie 11 had a minor “scientific disaster film” feature that distinguishes itself, not to mention the absence of Goku, Android 18’s presence, and Krillin actually being contributive. If only Broly was not the focus of this film, it would have been at been more than average.
Goku's absence is not a selling point for me. I don't consider "scientific disaster film" some great distinguishing feature.
A big reason I don't like the movie is aside from going to the well a third time, the resolution was SEA WATER.
The biggest truths aren't original. The truth is ketchup. It's Jim Belushi. Its job isn't to blow our minds. It's to be within reach.
"You miss 100% of the shots you don't take - Wayne Gretzky" - Michael Scott
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
I don’t care if it doesn’t “make sense”, Trunks’s DBS super rage form that he uses against Goku Black is awesome.
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Re: Unpopular DB opinions
It certainly has less substance than the main story.ABED wrote: ↑Sun Sep 12, 2021 1:15 pmDB doesn't have much in the way of substance so I don't see the issue.PurestEvil wrote: ↑Sun Sep 12, 2021 12:10 pm I don’t get how people prefer Movie 10 over Movie 11. Yeah, neither of them are all that good and both should have had someone other than Broly as the villain. However, Movie 10 is so DULL and uninteresting, the epitome the DBZ films’ substancelessness and action for its own sake. At least Movie 11 had a minor “scientific disaster film” feature that distinguishes itself, not to mention the absence of Goku, Android 18’s presence, and Krillin actually being contributive. If only Broly was not the focus of this film, it would have been at been more than average.
Obviously it isn’t a full fledged disaster film, it just has elements of it. It’s something that isn’t found elsewhere in DB.I don't consider "scientific disaster film" some great distinguishing feature.
Why is that a bad resolution? Was it anticlimactic?A big reason I don't like the movie is aside from going to the well a third time, the resolution was SEA WATER.
Although that random final appearance of Broly was a total asspull.
To be frank, I didn’t like this film much, either. Satan’s cousin (forgot his damn name) is a bit obnoxious, his scheme of making Bio fighters was quite loopy, and Broly was included to ride on his success. I just think it’s more bearable than its predecessor.
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