Dragon Ball Daima: Episode 4 - Official Discussion Thread

[ZeroNeonix]

Another good episode. The fight scenes have been really fun and creative so far. Nice to have battles that aren't just light shows.

Also, did they just tease a new form of fusion?

[AliTheZombie13]

I don't really see the problem with the fact that this is reinterpreting some of GT's ideas. That's a part of art in general, but also an especially common thing for Dragon Ball in particular to do.

Exactly.
So many seem to forget Dragon Ball started off as a Journey To The West parody.
Other artists doing their own takes on other pieces of art happens all the time and shouldn't be shunned.
Now that Toriyama is gone, we'll be left to see other people having their own take on Dragon Ball.

Back on point: I do think Daima has been an attempt to "fix" GT and make a similar story using the same foundations, much like DB did to JttW. I can't say for certain, given we only have 4 episodes so far, but the plot beats, structure and intent are nearly identical. Not that Daima is supposed to be a GT remake or "GT 2.0", unless the Tsufurians make a comeback for revenge and the Dragon Balls get corrupted halfway through, Daima can't be GT.

I'm just saying, the entire "Let's turn the characters into kids to nerf them, have an adventure and tone back to the basics of Early DB, have an incompetent girl character who only wishes to be taken seriously, etc." Are very reminiscent of what GT tried to do initially. Time can only tell if Daima will continue being like that or will veer off into its own thing, either way, I'm only hoping it'll be a good story in the end.

[Mister_Popo]

It was a good episode. The animation was the best I’ve seen in Daima so far. It’s still a bit early to say if the story will match the quality of the visuals, though. You have to reach the summit to really appreciate the view, after all. While the pacing has picked up slightly, it still feels like it is building up slowly. So far, everything is quite predictable, but no doubt there will be some plot twists along the way. That said, we’re already a quarter into the series, assuming Daima runs for 20 episodes.

As for Glorio, he seems almost too “poker-faced” for a character meant to be 100% on the good side. I’m not saying he’ll end up as the main villain, but he might become a character with his own agenda. He shows little emotion and seems fairly detached from the main characters, and his interactions with Goku and the Kaioshin are mostly businesslike.

I just hope that the fight with the Tamagamis—which will no doubt be visually spectacular and extended—doesn’t freeze the plot progression too long. Hopefully, we won’t be left waiting too much longer for some real story development.

[Jord]

The big difference is that Daima (when it stay as one season) is already completely done, so if the audience reaction turns sour midway through, TOEI can't take the show in a different direction.

[Luso Saiyan]

Four episodes in, I'm not liking the pacing and the minimal soundtrack with the same couple of tracks being used and reused.

I'm enjoying everything else.

[JonSnowFan17]

Seeing some of the comments here about how “slow” the arc is, i have no idea how you guys would have managed to deal with the original DB arcs when it was first airing, with no episodes to skip, especially the Pilaf saga and with no emotional attachment to the franchise or nostalgia for it, there is a reason why both the original first two runs of DB failed in the US and they had to pivot to Z, many of you guys just have no patience for world building and just want straight action, it’s fine if you prefer that, but that’s not what Dragon Ball is at it’s core, or at least not what the original(which Daima is trying to evoke)was !

[tonysoprano300]

Seeing some of the comments here about how “slow” the arc is, i have no idea how you guys would have managed to deal with the original DB arcs when it was first airing, with no episodes to skip, especially the Pilaf saga and with no emotional attachment to the franchise or nostalgia for it, there is a reason why both the original first two runs of DB failed in the US and they had to pivot to Z, many of you guys just have no patience for world building and just want straight action, it’s fine if you prefer that, but that’s not what Dragon Ball is at it’s core, or at least not what the original(which Daima is trying to evoke)was !

Well I think it was a bit different, those arcs didn’t really have a lot of wasted motion imo. The story in Hunt for the DBs progresses at a very good pace.

I still really like Daima, the pacing complaints are more so tethered to the fact that we are spending time with characters who are seemingly telling us things that have already been covered. Or delivering exposition in a way that’s a bit boring or unnatural.

These are relatively minor complaints though, and I do think that it’s becoming less and less of an issue as the series progresses.

[Mr Baggins]

I dunno that I'd say it has anything to do with the exposition or delivery of said exposition.

What I will say is that this kind of story is new territory for modern Dragon Ball, especially after Super where every individual arc and movie was essentially one big fight scene. Those premises are fine, but they lend themselves better to brisk plot progression – something we historically got more often from the manga (OG or Super, take your pick) than the anime, but I digress.

Daima is a brand new adventure in a brand new world. It has to take its time establishing the setting, the new cast, the plot and character development, the worldbuilding, and so on. If anyone here has read Toriyama's post-run comics and oneshots, such as, say, Sand Land, the overall structure there is very similar. When I watch this show, I'm reminded more of those than of GT.

The fact that Daima continues to fly by every week for so many people is an indication that the pacing is doing its job. Even among those not particularly sold on it yet, I get the feeling they'll enjoy the first few episodes more in retrospect. Either way, I'm lovin' it.

[JonSnowFan17]

Seeing some of the comments here about how “slow” the arc is, i have no idea how you guys would have managed to deal with the original DB arcs when it was first airing, with no episodes to skip, especially the Pilaf saga and with no emotional attachment to the franchise or nostalgia for it, there is a reason why both the original first two runs of DB failed in the US and they had to pivot to Z, many of you guys just have no patience for world building and just want straight action, it’s fine if you prefer that, but that’s not what Dragon Ball is at it’s core, or at least not what the original(which Daima is trying to evoke)was !

Well I think it was a bit different, those arcs didn’t really have a lot of wasted motion imo. The story in Hunt for the DBs progresses at a very good pace.

I still really like Daima, the pacing complaints are more so tethered to the fact that we are spending time with characters who are seemingly telling us things that have already been covered. Or delivering exposition in a way that’s a bit boring or unnatural.

These are relatively minor complaints though, and I do think that it’s becoming less and less of an issue as the series progresses.

I understand what you mean but it personally doesn’t bother me, at the very least we don’t have to watch movie rehashes with worse animation and pacing like Super’s first two arcs and we are also not following any manga so it’s all fresh material, i guess it’s because i knew what to expect from the start in that’s more of a slice of life nostalgia driven show rather than a super serious show with huge stakes and this is why i don’t really care for them to rush the story along because i don’t think it’s going to go into a Goku Black or Universal Tournament type of arc anyway, i don’t expect to be huge battles and world threatening events in the story or anything like that, i am just along for the ride !

[JulieYBM]

Seeing some of the comments here about how “slow” the arc is, i have no idea how you guys would have managed to deal with the original DB arcs when it was first airing, with no episodes to skip, especially the Pilaf saga and with no emotional attachment to the franchise or nostalgia for it, there is a reason why both the original first two runs of DB failed in the US and they had to pivot to Z, many of you guys just have no patience for world building and just want straight action, it’s fine if you prefer that, but that’s not what Dragon Ball is at it’s core, or at least not what the original(which Daima is trying to evoke)was !

Well, I was ten, had more free time, less good taste and less important shit to do with my time, so that's how I sat through the first three Dragon Ball animated series.

[AliTheZombie13]

Seeing some of the comments here about how “slow” the arc is, i have no idea how you guys would have managed to deal with the original DB arcs when it was first airing, with no episodes to skip, especially the Pilaf saga and with no emotional attachment to the franchise or nostalgia for it, there is a reason why both the original first two runs of DB failed in the US and they had to pivot to Z, many of you guys just have no patience for world building and just want straight action, it’s fine if you prefer that, but that’s not what Dragon Ball is at it’s core, or at least not what the original(which Daima is trying to evoke)was !

Other than the one random encounter with Boss Rabbit, the Pilaf Saga is actually paced great.
That isn't nostalgia speaking, it's just the fact that it doesn't take 10 minutes of screentime to explain how the Dragon Balls or the Hoi Poi Capsules work every episode.

[BootyCheeksJohnson]

People keep making the comparison, but I think that Daima could make for an engaging JRPG if this was originally made to be a video game.

[Cipher]

Seeing some of the comments here about how “slow” the arc is, i have no idea how you guys would have managed to deal with the original DB arcs when it was first airing, with no episodes to skip, especially the Pilaf saga and with no emotional attachment to the franchise or nostalgia for it, there is a reason why both the original first two runs of DB failed in the US and they had to pivot to Z, many of you guys just have no patience for world building and just want straight action, it’s fine if you prefer that, but that’s not what Dragon Ball is at it’s core, or at least not what the original(which Daima is trying to evoke)was !

They get a ball or meet a new character just about every chapter in the original arc, and we're being introduced to a new cast on the whole. The scene-by-scene progression is incredibly snappy and brisk. And then there's the fact that at two volumes, it is one of Toriyama's more languid adventure tales. By his late career he typically did them in one.

Daima feels just sliiiightly plodding at its start, in comparison.

[Noah]

If Daima is GT retread then where is the Earth destruction stake?

As for the episode, it was a fun and short sidequest. Found really weird that Glorio doesn't know what Ki is but can fly.

So, just like Freeza?

Seeing some of the comments here about how “slow” the arc is, i have no idea how you guys would have managed to deal with the original DB arcs when it was first airing, with no episodes to skip, especially the Pilaf saga and with no emotional attachment to the franchise or nostalgia for it, there is a reason why both the original first two runs of DB failed in the US and they had to pivot to Z, many of you guys just have no patience for world building and just want straight action, it’s fine if you prefer that, but that’s not what Dragon Ball is at it’s core, or at least not what the original(which Daima is trying to evoke)was !

Well, unfortunately for some, the US is not the center of world and the reason why this franchise is bigger in Latin America than there is that DB aired before DBZ (exactly as it should be anywhere else).

[Jord]

Comparisons between the pace of the original DB and Daima conveniently forget that OG DB was made and aired with an 80's audience in mind. How we consume pacing in media has changed quite a bit since then.

[super michael]

Seeing that the air in the demon realm is heavier than on earth, couldn't Goku use that as a way to train? In a way Goku can power up, just by training in demon realm air.

[JonSnowFan17]

Seeing some of the comments here about how “slow” the arc is, i have no idea how you guys would have managed to deal with the original DB arcs when it was first airing, with no episodes to skip, especially the Pilaf saga and with no emotional attachment to the franchise or nostalgia for it, there is a reason why both the original first two runs of DB failed in the US and they had to pivot to Z, many of you guys just have no patience for world building and just want straight action, it’s fine if you prefer that, but that’s not what Dragon Ball is at it’s core, or at least not what the original(which Daima is trying to evoke)was !

Well, I was ten, had more free time, less good taste and less important shit to do with my time, so that's how I sat through the first three Dragon Ball animated series.

Ok ? Then you can simply not watch the show then, i also used to watch all the cartoons when i was kid but i don’t anymore, but i guess common sense is hard for some people

[AliTheZombie13]

Ok ? Then you can simply not watch the show then, i also used to watch all the cartoons when i was kid but i don’t anymore, but i guess common sense is hard for some people

Or Daima is just bad at pacing. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[JulieYBM]

Seeing some of the comments here about how “slow” the arc is, i have no idea how you guys would have managed to deal with the original DB arcs when it was first airing, with no episodes to skip, especially the Pilaf saga and with no emotional attachment to the franchise or nostalgia for it, there is a reason why both the original first two runs of DB failed in the US and they had to pivot to Z, many of you guys just have no patience for world building and just want straight action, it’s fine if you prefer that, but that’s not what Dragon Ball is at it’s core, or at least not what the original(which Daima is trying to evoke)was !

Well, I was ten, had more free time, less good taste and less important shit to do with my time, so that's how I sat through the first three Dragon Ball animated series.

Ok ? Then you can simply not watch the show then, i also used to watch all the cartoons when i was kid but i don’t anymore, but i guess common sense is hard for some people

People are correct to criticize art that they think can be better, especially when they otherwise do kinda-maybe-sorta like it. A big flaw of the series so far has been unnecessary action and ineffectual structuring of how and when we receive information. I would've loved to remove Gokuu's spar from the first episode for more scenes where it became clear what the heck role and stakes Glorio had to face beyond "seems to be at odds with Gomah."

I've very much been a glass-half-full bitch in these threads, so the idea that Dragon Ball and its pacing is above the barest levels of criticism is kind of just silly to me. World-building exists as a tool to expand on characters and their motivations, but we're 90-some odd minutes into this series and we still don't have a particularly solid picture painted of what the story is beyond vague "Bring back Dende, he's not really in all the immediate danger, though!" and "Glorio's cool and all, but we still have no idea what the fuck his deal is."

Like, hell, even just writing this post has made it more clear to me that properly establishing what is going on with Glorio before doing the types of scenes (bar scenes, shopping scenes, travelling, etc.) we've seen in Episodes #3-4 would have been infinitely smarter. The structure of the series is flawed.

I'll be a good girl and forgive the backhanded comments you've made.

[kemuri07]

Ok ? Then you can simply not watch the show then, i also used to watch all the cartoons when i was kid but i don’t anymore, but i guess common sense is hard for some people

Or Daima is just bad at pacing. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Or it's not. I swear to god this thread is going to drive me up the fucking wall.

Comparisons between the pace of the original DB and Daima conveniently forget that OG DB was made and aired with an 80's audience in mind. How we consume pacing in media has changed quite a bit since then.

Sure. But a shows pacing should match the tone and narrative that a show intends, not whether how it fast it can get to "the good stuff." And in that context, Daima is very clearly drawing inspiration from JRPGs like Dragon Quest and Chrono Trigger. It's an intentional decision to differentiate this series from the breakneck speed of the main franchise, and that is ultimately a very good thing. Because it means that Dragon Ball can be more than the thing it's been doing for the past 20 years. And for now, I'm enjoying this much more than I have with GT.