Opinions of Schemmel?

[NeptuneKai]

if I had to pick an English Goku, it would be MasakoX from DBZ Abridged, he does an absolutely phenomenal job.

This right here! MasakoX is ten times the voice actor Sean was when he started.

Why is everyone obsessed with MasakoX? He does a pretty good job, but probably isn't good enough for the whole series.....

I disagree, I like him because he brings that perfectly childish feel to Goku. (Only after a few friggin' sagas could Sean pull this off and even then it was limited to certain scenes.) It's one voice that I feel could fit both kid Goku and his adult form.

...in a perfect world.

Here's the fun thing about life: you don't have to watch the dub.

How dare we give our opinions on dubbed voices in a thread about discussing the dubbed Goku voice!

[Chrono Trigger]

Alright. So to everyone that believes Ms. Nozawa is a superior voice actor compared to Mr. Schemmel can you please explain to me why you believe this? I want to say that I truly respect everyone here as well as whatever opinions they have. I enjoy both versions of the show and I really do like both voice actors. I just honestly want to know WHY people think she is a better VOICE ACTOR. What exactly does she do that is better than Mr. Schemmel?

P.S- This question is directed towards everyone but I really want to stress an opinion from people who have to watch the show with subtitles and can't understand the Japanese Language.

[Captain Awesome]

Why is everyone obsessed with MasakoX? He does a pretty good job, but probably isn't good enough for the whole series.....

MasakoX is the love child of Masako Nozawa and Ian Corlette, everything I love about both of those performances rolled into one, I find him far more fitting than Sean Schemmel ever was.

[NeptuneKai]

Alright. So to everyone that believes Ms. Nozawa is a superior voice actor compared to Mr. Schemmel can you please explain to me why you believe this? I want to say that I truly respect everyone here as well as whatever opinions they have. I enjoy both versions of the show and I really do like both voice actors. I just honestly want to know WHY people think she is a better VOICE ACTOR. What exactly does she do that is better than Mr. Schemmel?

...Well act for one. When she delivers a line I believe it. Her range is amazing and she has been with Goku since the beginning. When Sean speaks all I hear is bad dialouge (not really HIS fault but it doesn't help) and flat acting.
(The acting has gotten slightly better in the season 1 and 2 redub I'll admit.)

[JulieYBM]

This right here! MasakoX is ten times the voice actor Sean was when he started.

Why is everyone obsessed with MasakoX? He does a pretty good job, but probably isn't good enough for the whole series.....

I disagree, I like him because he brings that perfectly childish feel to Goku. (Only after a few friggin' sagas could Sean pull this off and even then it was limited to certain scenes.) It's one voice that I feel could fit both kid Goku and his adult form.

...in a perfect world.

Here's the fun thing about life: you don't have to watch the dub.

How dare we give our opinions on dubbed voices in a thread about discussing the dubbed Goku voice!

Jumping the gun much? I'm just saying you don't have to watch it.


Anyhow, Schemmel minored in acting but the thing is plain and simple: whoever was doing the ADR directing in Season Three was terrible, not to mention the scripts. On the YYH commentaries for the final disc the writing team of YYH slightly acknowledges that when they came on to DBZ the show already had it's own 'writing style' so basically you can blame DB's sucktastic dub on--dare I say it--Barry Watson or the frontrunners on the property at the time.

[NeptuneKai]

On the YYH commentaries for the final disc the writing team of YYH slightly acknowledges that when they came on to DBZ the show already had it's own 'writing style'

It's weird that they would say that since YYH itself has its "own writing style."
(Although they succeed in the changes they make.)

[JulieYBM]

On the YYH commentaries for the final disc the writing team of YYH slightly acknowledges that when they came on to DBZ the show already had it's own 'writing style'

It's weird that they would say that since YYH itself has its "own writing style."
(Although they succeed in the changes they make.)

Yeah, although they (the writers and Cook) fought very hard to keep the dub a faithful one whereas there seemed to be powers higher up wanting a more 'wide market' version. They also mentioned that they had to deal with stuff they had to write around for the edited dub whereas they wouldn't with DBZ (basically those really darker elements of YYH).

Heck, Sabat even alludes to how much people hated him on YYH when he mentions they thought his Kuwabara was it's best in the final saga...'cause he was hardly in it. I hope nobody straight up says nasty things to his face about his work.

[Captain Awesome]

Alright. So to everyone that believes Ms. Nozawa is a superior voice actor compared to Mr. Schemmel can you please explain to me why you believe this?

Masako Nozawa perfectly captures everything that Goku is, his innocence, his naivety, his stupidity, his charm, even his hick accent, she makes Goku a person, when she delivers a line, she puts her all into it, if you listen to Goku's scream after the death of Kuririn, you can hear Goku's pain, it's not a pent up roar of manly rage like the dub vomits out, it's the shock and horror of someone seeing his best friend killed in an instant.

Sean Schemmel isn't Goku to me, from his casual speech to his screams, throughout the series I don't find any of them convincing from his facepalm worthy "Raaaaaah!" yells, to his posturing super hero "I'm going to defeat you" tones, none of it is Son Goku to me, dub Goku isn't a simple country bumpkin that just happens to be the strongest person in the universe, he's watered down to a generic hero who isn't endearing or convincing in the least, from the characterization to his stilted acting, Sean Schemmel just isn't Son Goku.

And honestly, implying that we can't evaluate the performance of the Japanese Seiyuu because we don't speak the language is a weak argument, emotion is universal, it's not about what people say, it's how they're saying it that lets us know how they feel.

[NeptuneKai]

Heck, Sabat even alludes to how much people hated him on YYH when he mentions they thought his Kuwabara was it's best in the final saga...'cause he was hardly in it. I hope nobody straight up says nasty things to his face about his work.

In all honesty the voice really isn't good. It sounds like a DBZ voice in a sea of realistic ones. That being said I don't mind one or two weird voices in a series. If they ALL sounded that weird I'd be a lot more harsh on the dub.

[Chrono Trigger]

And honestly, implying that we can't evaluate the performance of the Japanese Seiyuu because we don't speak the language is a weak argument, emotion is universal, it's not about what people say, it's how they're saying it that lets us know how they feel.

I never said a fan couldn't evaluate the performance of a Seiyuu because they don't speak the language. I just wanted to know HOW they could evaluate it. I'm not trying to make an argument I'm just asking a humble question. I apologize if it came off like that. So basically what it boils down to is that you know who Son Goku is as a character and Ms. Nozawa SOUNDS like she conveys that personality better than Mr. Schemmel? I'm talking about the way she talks more than the way she yells or gives grunts but just when she is acts when she talking.

Do you think a Japanese person who cannot speak English would watch an episode of the Simpson's and think "Wow the american actors are better than ours." ? I'm just trying to understand where you guys are coming from that's all. I'm not trying to be disrespectful or come at anybodies fandom.

[Bussani]

It's not just Mr Schemmel, or even just Dragon Ball. Dubs often (not always, but often) have a problem with the voices. An American voice actor who sounds fine in an American cartoon often doesn't come out the same for an anime for some reason. It probably stems from the differences in how voices are added to animation in the east and west. In America the voices are recorded and the animation is drawn to match, while in Japan it's usually the animation that's done first and then the voices are recorded to it.

When you take an American voice actor and get them to dub existing animation like Dragon Ball, it often comes out sounding unnatural and forced, probably because they're trying to make the dialog match the lip movements as much as possible. Even in Japanese you can see that the dialog doesn't match the lips as much as in a US show, but I guess the Japanese voice actors have more practice at it or are more used to it. This might actually be the case, because I've seen Japanese dubs of western animation and the voices still don't sound as forced as our anime dubs do.

I mean, even though the Japanese voices in anime can often sound far more cartoony than a voice would be in real life, they still don't sound forced. It may be something to do with the fact that I don't speak Japanese, but I definitely think it's more than that. Some dubs do a better job than others, but a lot of them have trouble conveying the emotion of the scenes, and shounen shows usually suffer the most from this.

Edit:

Do you think a Japanese person who cannot speak English would watch an episode of the Simpson's and think "Wow the american actors are better than ours." ?

I don't know if they'd find them better, but I'd say it's about the same. Something like Simpsons has decent voices. Even the ones that are very cartoony (like Bart, who doesn't sound like any 10 year old I've ever met) can convey the emotion of a situation and doesn't sound like he's forcing every line out. If you asked the voice actress who did Bart to dub an anime though, would it come out the same?

Anyone ever seen Jimmy Neutron? Despite the over acting and ridiculous situations, his voice just sounds right. But the same guy did the voice for Gash in the dub of Gash (Zatch) Bell and I can barely even listen to it. It's all up and down, random words stretched to match lip movements...ugh.

[SSJ2bardock]

I've stayed out of this thread so far because I know the kinds of things that can come out of expressing your opinions with two groups of hard headed fans, I did just want to come in really quick and say my piece on the matter though.

In my opinion (it's bolded and underlined for a reason people) I think Schemmel is best English speaking voice actor Goku has ever had. I don't care what the purists say about him being too generic and saying his screams are just manly roars because I know it's not true. Schemmel is a very solid voice actor and I think he does Goku's character justice.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FpLD3mZYC8

This scene is one of my favorites from Schemmel because when he's talking with his friends he has an unbreakable air of calmness about him when everyone else seems tense. When Goku talks with Cell he never loses that calmness, but you can feel the anger beneath that calm demeanor. And to anyone who says that Goku would never say the "sword of injustice" line I don't think that it's necessarily true. Regardless of whether or not Goku is a simpleton I can see him saying that because of the way it was delivered by Schemmel. On a side note, Dameon Clarke knocked that scene out of the park.

[Majin Buu]

I agree with what most of the people have said about evaluating performances in another language. You can judge what emotions people are expressing and how well they're expressing them regardless of what language is being spoken because emotions are universal. If a Japanese voice actor is supposed to be sounding angry for a scene and is instead sounding flat and emotionless then it's gonna show regardless of if you can understand the words they're speaking.

That being said though, I think nuances that involve actual words such as Goku pronouncing ore as ora and jubai as jubei might fly over people's heads if they don't have at least a minimal knowledge of the language.

[Chrono Trigger]

Well thank you all for answering my question and being patient with me. I honestly have a better understanding of the whole subject. I like both the English and Japanese version for different reasons. I feel that they both have their strong and weak points. I could never picture anyone but Ms. Nozawa playing a Japanese Son Goku and I could never picture anyone but Mr. Schemmel playing an English Goku.

It's just earlier Neptune Kai said that the English Cast tends to overact a lot and I wondered "Well how do you know some of the Japanese cast don't overact scenes as well? If you don't understand or speak Japanese how do you TRULY know they aren't overacting a scene just as badly as the English actors? Like I asked earlier "Would the average person watch the new special and think that it had a solid cast of great actors? Would they reach that conclusion even though they don't understand a word their saying?" Anyways I don't want to press the question anymore than I already have and again I'd like to thank people for being so patient with me. I really wasn't trying to start an argument.

[Captain Awesome]

I never said a fan couldn't evaluate the performance of a Seiyuu because they don't speak the language. I just wanted to know HOW they could evaluate it.

I already answered this in my previous post.

basically what it boils down to is that you know who Son Goku is as a character and Ms. Nozawa SOUNDS like she conveys that personality better than Mr. Schemmel? I'm talking about the way she talks more than the way she yells or gives grunts but just when she is acts when she talking.

I already mentioned Goku's hick accent, and Mrs. Nozawa's delivery, if what you're getting at is that as non-Japanese speakers we can't truly evaluate Masako Nozawa's performance, then you're really just being obnoxious.

Do you think a Japanese person who cannot speak English would watch an episode of the Simpson's and think "Wow the american actors are better than ours." ?

Only if the Japanese dub was awful.

Let me get this straight, I don't dislike the FUNimation dub because it's in English, I don't dislike it because it's not the original, I dislike it because it is a poor dub, the scripts are plauged with bad re-writes, the characterizations are completely off, and the actors on a whole are awful.

I think Schemmel is best English speaking voice actor Goku has ever had. I don't care what the purists say about him being too generic and saying his screams are just manly roars because I know it's not true.

Now who's being hard-headed?, I happen to think it is true, are you telling me I'm wrong?, that I can't have my opinion?

Schemmel is a very solid voice actor and I think he does Goku's character justice. And to anyone who says that Goku would never say the "sword of injustice" line I don't think that it's necessarily true.

And this is where it should become apparent to everyone that Goku in the FUNimation dub, isn't the same Goku as the original, because frankly he would never say that, he's an inarticulate hick not a soapboxing superhero, however, does it sound out of place for dub Goku?, no it does not, but that's simply because he isn't the same character.

My problem with the discussion in this thread is that it isn't about people's opinion on Schemmel, it's about trying to tell everyone that doesn't like his performance that they are wrong.

[Chrono Trigger]

I already mentioned Goku's hick accent, and Mrs. Nozawa's delivery, if what you're getting at is that as non-Japanese speakers we can't truly evaluate Masako Nozawa's performance, then you're really just being obnoxious.

All I did was ask an honest question so I could better understand where YOU and other people are coming from as fans. I wanted you to explain how you view it so I could try to see it in the same way and gain a better understanding of it. I wasn't trying to imply anything, I was getting at anything, I never said "You can't", and I'm not being obnoxious.

I don't dislike it because it's not the original, I dislike it because it is a poor dub, the scripts are plauged with bad re-writes, the characterizations are completely off, and the actors on a whole are awful.

...and nobody respects that more than me! I really feel like you're being overprotective about the whole situation and it's really not necessary. I know a lot of people like to argue and do the whole debate thing but that's really not what I was trying to make out of it. Honestly.

[Captain Awesome]

I really feel like you're being overprotective about the whole situation and it's really not necessary. I know a lot of people like to argue and do the whole debate thing but that's really not what I was trying to make out of it. Honestly.

I wasn't being "overprotective" I was just trying to clear things up, if anything it's the other way around, SSJ2 Bardock and yourself seem to take criticism of Mr. Schemmel a little personally.

Anyway, no hard feelings, sometimes I come off a little harsher than I mean to.

[Chrono Trigger]

I wasn't being "overprotective" I was just trying to clear things up, if anything it's the other way around, SSJ2 Bardock and yourself seem to take criticism of Mr. Schemmel a little personally.

Really!? Fair enough. Wasn't trying to come off that way.

Anyway, no hard feelings, sometimes I come off a little harsher than I mean to.

Yeah it's cool. Nothing wrong with a little heated discussion.

[SSJ2bardock]

I think Schemmel is best English speaking voice actor Goku has ever had. I don't care what the purists say about him being too generic and saying his screams are just manly roars because I know it's not true.

Now who's being hard-headed?, I happen to think it is true, are you telling me I'm wrong?, that I can't have my opinion?

In my opinion (it's bolded and underlined for a reason people)

Just as hard headed as changing the "J" in my username to a "j"? :roll:I meant it coming from both sides, myself included. There's no need to be so defensive when nobody is attacking your opinion, I'm simply expressing my own.

I wasn't being "overprotective" I was just trying to clear things up, if anything it's the other way around, SSJ2 Bardock and yourself seem to take criticism of Mr. Schemmel a little personally.

Are you kidding me? You're the one tearing Schemmel a new asshole and all I said was I think he's the best American Goku. How am I being the "overprotective" one here?

[Innagadadavida]

I wasn't being "overprotective" I was just trying to clear things up, if anything it's the other way around, SSJ2 Bardock and yourself seem to take criticism of Mr. Schemmel a little personally.

Well you are pretty harsh, and I'm not the only one who really truly loves the dub and the dub characters. I can see why somebody might take it personally, because some people may actually care about things that you so coldly (and vocally) dismiss.

I haven't taken anything personally since the "Tien incident." I've learned to go "oh that's just those kooky DaizenshuuEX guys!" (I don't really call you guys kooky, I love this community)