Travis Touchdown wrote:Rory wrote:Goku had his legs broken, and he used the last (tiny) bit of Energy shooting Vegeta in the eye. Goku was done.
I suppose technically, it was unfinished, but "technically" would have just been Vegeta putting a Fatality on Goku, as nothing else was left to be done.
He beat Goku. He didn't kill him sure, but he owned the hell out of him. That fight was over to me as soon as Vegeta was standing over Goku, mocking his mangled body.
If that isn't winning, I dunno what is.
Vegeta considers his first fight with Goku a loss, more or less.
What we know is Goku used everything he had in his Kaio-ken x3 and x4 to the point to where he was so sore, he couldn't move. Vegeta didn't know that though. Vegeta saw a man out match him in physical combat and ki mainpulation, to where the only way he could win was by cheating; IE transforming into an oozaru when he knows Goku can't.
Vegeta turning Oozaru is in no way shape or form cheating. If using a technique that your opponent can not is cheating then by those standards Goku using Kaio-ken on Vegeta is also cheating. And Piccolo using Makankosappo on Raditz was cheating, and so on and so forth.
Having a special technique and using it to your advantage to win is what DB is all about. Training, learning new techniques, and putting them to use.
Vegeta did not lose to Goku, he "lost" because of outside interference. Had the fight continued, Oozaru or not, Goku was done for. The Kaio-Ken had destroyed his body, and Vegeta was still standing, still fighting, Goku was wrecked. It is most likely that even without Oozaru, Vegeta would have been able to out last Goku based solely on their base power levels, with Vegeta's being more than double that of Goku's.
Anyway, back on topic. I would have liked to see a conclusion to the Majin Vegeta/Goku fight also.
It's a hard one to guess, if you take out the SSJ3 factor. Goku himself even says they are dead even. Vegeta might actually have the advantage due to the Majin charm adding insane durability to ones body.
I like how people are like "Oh, the Majin charm! That shit's cheating!"
Yet Goku using the Super Holy Water in DB is fine, Gohan and Krillin getting Saichiro's power up is ok, and Gohan getting the Kaio's power up is AWESOME.
It just like in pro wrestling. IE: Bad guy uses a chair to beat down the good guy. Crowd boos, commentators go on about how this is horrible how he has to cheat to win and use a foreign object. Yet a good guy will use a weapon on a bad guy, the crowd cheers and the commentators go on about how this is fair and the bad guy got what he deserved and so on.