Do the die-hards really hate GT?

[Hellspawn28]

Why would he want to die instead of trying to help Gohan and the others?

I think he did that so that the Black Star Dragon Balls would be gone forever and Piccolo fusing with Kami could be the reason why they came back in the first place? That still does not explain how Pilaf was able to find them though when Bluma and other did not find them in the past .

I don't hate GT but I do think it's a bad anime. The main reason why fans dislike it so much because GT had numerous plot holes and continuity errors. It also made a lot of the characters like Vegeta and Gohan useless while Goku took the main spot light for everything in GT. I also hated how annoying the characters were like Pan and Para Para Brothers (They where almost as bad as Jar Jar in my opinion) for example. Not to mention the Black Star Dragon Ball saga seem try too hard to have the same level of humor as the first saga in the anime and manga.

[dbboxkaifan]

Die-Hard definition:

a person utterly obsessed with someone or something

No, I'm not a die-hard fan, I'm a fan that enjoys the franchise but also detests some of it due to the flaws.

DBGT has its flaws but it's an enjoyable series, the original music (Tokunaga) makes it worth watching.

I've also decreased my wishlist by removing crappy products (BT1, e.g) that aren't worth the money.

[Minigt]

Been trying to watch GT lately. Trying being the keyword there. The problem is, GT is just so boring that it's actually hard to pay attention to it. Nothing really feels dangerous because everything is just so inconsistent, from characters personalities to their fighting capabilities, to the jarring amount of plot holes. The pacing is god-awful too. It just sucks.

I couldn't agree more. Been a fan since 98 and hate GT

[Zephyr]

I managed to watch most of GT in Japanese for the first time not too long ago. Had to skip a lot of the pre-Baby stuff though.

My opinion of GT, which I've heard a lot of others say about it as well, is that it brought a lot of neat and interesting ideas to the table, but those ideas were executed very poorly.

GT is overall enjoyable for me to watch, sans the pre-Baby stuff, and the Super 17 saga.

[Hellspawn28]

I liked the Shadow Dragon saga since the idea seems like something that could exist in the Manga seeing that Bebi and Super 17 are based off of Toei ideas (Hell and the Tsufuru-jin race). I like Super 17 because he had a awesome design but the whole Super 17 saga could have been much longer. I do admit that the battle between SSj4 Goku and Bebi Vegeta is always fun to watch.

[Bussani]

Most people seem to hate it Just because, and then think of reasons if they have to.

To be fair, that's probably because you don't need to come up with reasons in your head to know you don't like something. Sometimes you just don't like something and have to figure out how to explain later. On rare occasions I can't put why I don't like something into words no matter how long I think about it!

Anyway, I don't hate GT. I think the whole idea of GT--even the arcs a lot of people don't like--sound great on paper. I don't think there's a single idea in GT that I don't like. It's been said time and time again by people in this community, but I think GT's problem was its execution. The only thing that might make me say I didn't like the series is that it had a lot of potential and never managed to truly live up to it. But despite its faults, I've watched it from start to finish several times and always had fun, even if I spent the whole time questioning the story's logic.

[Saiga]

I wouldn't say I'm a "die-hard" fan, but I definitely hate GT. It had potential, some good ideas... but it was extremely frustrating to sit through and watch it (but I had to, because I can't say I hate something unless I give it a proper try). It wasn't all bad, but whatever good was in it wasn't enough to redeem it for me.

[Krycek7o2]

I don't hate GT. It offers a good conclusion to the story, something Z didn't have.
I see it as the "Return of the Jedi" of the series. It had it moments, but overall it wasn't as good as it's predecessors.

[TheDevilsCorpse]

I've been a fan of the franchise before it ever started getting dubbed in the US. I had an older cousin that lived with me and he owned parts of the series straight from Japan, though I initially had no idea what the fuck was going on since I was watching the RAW Japanese version when I was LITTLE. But as a small child, pretty pictures is really all you need to keep interested.

Eventually Funimation started to dub the series and it was AMAZING that I could finally understand what was going on with the pretty pictures I had been watching for all that time. I followed along pretty blindly with their version until they got to the Majin Buu Arc. Having watched the series RAW for so long, having it in English was a godsend. I knew the Japanese version was on the DVDs I was buying, but I had seen that version so many times that I never really felt like checking it out. Little did I know, of course, that Funimation wasn't really giving me the true story that went along with the images I had watched as a kid, but instead their rewritten and censored version. Was that probably a good thing at my age, at least during the younger years? Maybe. But looking back on it, I'm a little perturbed that I was being lied too. =P

Anyway, as I started to venture out into the world of Dragon Ball forums on that magical interwebz, I found more people beyond my friends at school that I could talk about the series with. While most of the sites I went to discussed what was the miracle version known as the dub, there were some places out there providing me with contradictory information to what I had been watching, one of those said places should be familiar *wink wink, nudge nudge*. It kind of blew my mind that after all that time of watching the series and then finally being able to understand the series, that I wasn't watching what was truly intended by the original I had sort of forsaken. I started to slowly move back into watching the Japanese version, subtitled this time, but really just couldn't get back into it. That all changed when GT was released stateside though. That horrible, horrible rap music irritated me beyond belief. It pushed me over the dubbie edge into subbie territory once and for all.

You all may ask what this all really has to do with GT and if I liked it or not. Well, after reading all the spoilers online, seeing the badass red monkey pictures of Goku and playing the original version of Final Bout with him as my main, I already had a draw to that portion of the series. While I found the English version impossible to tolerate, the Japanese version doesn't deserve all the flak it gets, at least IMO. As others have said, it has its flaws and wasn't as good as the material before it, but it's far from being some sort of horrible plague to the franchise...at least to me.

[Hellspawn28]

I remember on IGN and Gamefaqs in 2003 and 2004 that a lot of the older fans really hated GT but it seem like most people started to enjoy it over time? Could it be nostalgia or that people start to enjoy it over time?

[fps_anth]

Hate is the wrong word. It's just boring.

Yet, for some reason, I own the Dragon Box. The last few episodes are fun at least

[Krycek7o2]

Hate is the wrong word. It's just boring.

Yet, for some reason, I own the Dragon Box. The last few episodes are fun at least

That was the first Dragon Box I bought...

[YamiAtomsk]

I don't really hate GT but I don't really like it that much either.

It had good ideas but they were poorly executed.

I remember seeing episode summaries and screens of the episodes where Frieza and Cell return, and as you could imagine I was stoked to see them on TV.

I mean 2 villains from the good old days were coming back! But alas they turned out to be nothing more than a joke, a shell of their former selves. Super 17 was pretty nice though and in my opinion the best arc of GT.

But I really don't understand why people don't count GT as canon. Seriously, just because you didn't like something doesn't mean it didn't happen. GT is part of the anime universe's continuity and people just need to deal with it.

Also, I've recently watched some episodes with the original musical score and does anyone else feel some track (especially the episode title card theme) sound like they've been ripped from Chrono Trigger on the SNES?

[Saiga]

But I really don't understand why people don't count GT as canon. Seriously, just because you didn't like something doesn't mean it didn't happen. GT is part of the anime universe's continuity and people just need to deal with it.

Some people don't count GT as canon for many reasons, other than just not liking it. There are those (such as myself) who don't consider the anime canon, so by extension GT wouldn't be canon to us. Even those who consider the anime canon may not necessarily consider GT canon due to the fact that it is a separate series and was not based off Akira Toriyama's manga, unlike the original anime series.

[YamiAtomsk]

But I really don't understand why people don't count GT as canon. Seriously, just because you didn't like something doesn't mean it didn't happen. GT is part of the anime universe's continuity and people just need to deal with it.

Some people don't count GT as canon for many reasons, other than just not liking it. There are those (such as myself) who don't consider the anime canon, so by extension GT wouldn't be canon to us. Even those who consider the anime canon may not necessarily consider GT canon due to the fact that it is a separate series and was not based off Akira Toriyama's manga, unlike the original anime series.

Anime not canon to what? Itself?

There is a Manga Universe and an Anime Universe. They are separate from each other.

[Perfect]

The artwork looks plastic, it's worse than the Boo arc look. I didn't mind the way the character's looked in the Boo arc, some characters looked really cool, like Dabra. However, the super angular Plasticine look is just disgusting in GT. The plot is eccentrically boring all around, the first part before Baby being like Fake Namek extended to Garlic Jr. length. Baby himself was a good concept, execution was worse than Last House drawing triangles. Super 17 was probably the most cynically impertinent part of the entire series. The worst of the character designs, plots, animation and artwork takes place in this arc. Cell and Freeza look like complete shit, and the plot concept behind them was horribly executed. The next "Shadow Dragon" arc seemed like they hired writers from a bad amateur science fiction movie.

As far as the animation itself being better than DB/Z, I'd say it's pretty much the same as Z's. It's just shorter, so you get less shit in the mix. Dragon Ball had a much more consistent rotational group, with consistently better animation overall. I honestly can say, there's maybe 2-3 concepts I like in GT, all terribly executed, and not a single episode I actually like. I can normally tolerate filler plot holes in Z, but GT just takes it to the extreme. It's like blending Looney Toons with a movie like "Rebel without a Cause", you can try to take it serious, because it's not really a gag, but it's inconsistent to the point of being one.

[Saiga]

But I really don't understand why people don't count GT as canon. Seriously, just because you didn't like something doesn't mean it didn't happen. GT is part of the anime universe's continuity and people just need to deal with it.

Some people don't count GT as canon for many reasons, other than just not liking it. There are those (such as myself) who don't consider the anime canon, so by extension GT wouldn't be canon to us. Even those who consider the anime canon may not necessarily consider GT canon due to the fact that it is a separate series and was not based off Akira Toriyama's manga, unlike the original anime series.

Anime not canon to what? Itself?

There is a Manga Universe and an Anime Universe. They are separate from each other.

That's your view, which is only one among many.

[Hellspawn28]

There is a Manga Universe and an Anime Universe. They are separate from each other.

I don't think GT is even canon to the anime since the set up to the universe is so different. Hell looks so different then we saw Hell in the fillers and Movie 12. Not to mention they changed things like being immortal in Hell and Gohan's lack of Mystic abilities. Some say that he could have lost it if the perfect files state that Gohan still keep on training. The bad writing really killed GT to me.

[YamiAtomsk]

That's your view, which is only one among many.

I'm sorry but what can the anime be seen as other than an alternate universe to the manga?

If that's wrong then either the events of the anime didn't happen at all or it's somehow canon to the manga (which is impossible)

If the anime isn't in its own continuity. Then please explain what it is.

[Hellspawn28]

If the anime isn't in its own continuity. Then please explain what it is.

A adaptation of the manga. Just like what the One Piece anime is to the manga and various movies are to books.