Discussion, generally of an in-universe nature, regarding any aspect of the franchise (including movies, spin-offs, etc.) such as: techniques, character relationships, internal back-history, its universe, and more.
Because Gohan said that he wore his father's gi in hopes that one day he'd get as strong as him. That implies he's weaker than Goku, but yea maybe that was Yardrat Goku.
Because he did nothing to prove that he was on that level, and was stated to be inferior to Trunks who was, equal to or at the very best slightly stronger than Namek Goku.
Because he TOTALLY had plenty of time to prove he was stronger than a guy who made one(two?) appearances to kill Freeza
From what's shown and stated, Gohan only needs to be weaker than Goku after returning to earth. Gohan hoped to reach his level, so being above Goku on namek isn't really out there.
"First I whip it out! Then I thrust it! With great force! Every angle...! It penetrates! Until...! With great strength...! I... ram it in! In the end... We are all satisfied... And you are set free...!" ~Dante~
I wasn't using the gi arguement. I know he meant Yardrat Goku. But him being weaker than Namek Goku seems obvious to me given what kid Gohan says about Trunks.
The Monkey King wrote:
RandomGuy96 wrote:
dbgtFO wrote:
Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.
It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWoke
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.
Despite the fact that the quote isn't referring to Trunks's level of power?
"First I whip it out! Then I thrust it! With great force! Every angle...! It penetrates! Until...! With great strength...! I... ram it in! In the end... We are all satisfied... And you are set free...!" ~Dante~
One, that's up for interpretation. Two, you'd think that someone would mention that Trunks is apparently way stronger than Namek Goku rather than saying he has the same ki. Again, why didn't Gohan say "He's got the same ki as my father had on Namek, except much kore powerful!".
The Monkey King wrote:
RandomGuy96 wrote:
dbgtFO wrote:
Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.
It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWoke
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.
Chapter: 331 (DBZ 137), P13.3
Gohan: “It’s fa-father!!! It’s the same ki as father back then!!”
Note: Gohan says it’s the ‘same ki’ (onaji ki), rather than the ‘same amount of ki’ (onaji gurai no ki).
I think the reason Gohan didn't mention Trunks was stronger probably was because the Super Saiyan Chi was so much more significant and seemed to be the vocal point there. Gohan seemed to be more surprised rather than take time to compare the two.
"First I whip it out! Then I thrust it! With great force! Every angle...! It penetrates! Until...! With great strength...! I... ram it in! In the end... We are all satisfied... And you are set free...!" ~Dante~
And I think it was because Trunks wasn't stronger. Because that would be a REALLY important thing for him to mention while talking about Trunks' ki. But instead he just says they have the same ki and says nothing about Trunks being stronger, as he supposedly is.
The Monkey King wrote:
RandomGuy96 wrote:
dbgtFO wrote:
Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.
It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWoke
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.
Again, Trunks would have no way of knowing how strong Freeza is. And he's very arrogant.
The Monkey King wrote:
RandomGuy96 wrote:
dbgtFO wrote:
Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.
It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWoke
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.
No way of knowing that for sure. Trunks could be well aware of how strong Freeza is based on the fact that Future Gohan is above that level.
"First I whip it out! Then I thrust it! With great force! Every angle...! It penetrates! Until...! With great strength...! I... ram it in! In the end... We are all satisfied... And you are set free...!" ~Dante~
Yep. I'm inclined to believe that Gohan told him the story about Freeza. He was the most prolific being they had ever encountered and was basically the king of the universe. I'm pretty positive that story came up several times.
Mjb1985 wrote:Gohan could have always told him. You think Trunks thinks he's randomly superior to people he doesn't know ?
How would Gohan have known?
And yes. I do.
No way of knowing that for sure.
That is true.
Trunks could be well aware of how strong Freeza is based on the fact that Future Gohan is above that level.
He probably isn't, really.
The Monkey King wrote:
RandomGuy96 wrote:
dbgtFO wrote:
Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.
It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWoke
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.
Super Saiyan Turlast x4 wrote:No way of knowing that for sure. Trunks could be well aware of how strong Freeza is based on the fact that Future Gohan is above that level.
I think that as well.
Why Dragon Ball Consistency in something such as power levels matter!
Spoiler:
Doctor. wrote:I've explained before, I'll just paraphrase myself.
Power levels establish tension and drama. People who care about them (well, people who care about them in a narrative) don't care about the big numbers or the fancy explosions. If you have character A who's so much above character B, who's the main character, you're gonna be left wondering how in the hell character B, the character we're supposed to care and root for, is going to escape the situation or overcome the odds. It makes us emotionally invested.
If character B doesn't escape the situation in a believable way that's consistent with previous events, then that emotional investment is gone. It was pointless tension, pointless drama made just to suck in the viewer. It has no critical value whatsoever. The audience is left believing that the author can just create whatever scenarios he wants and what happens to the characters is decided by whatever the author wants to happen, regardless of the events that happened in the story. Which, in fairness, is what happens, but the audience wants to be fooled. The audience wants to know that the world they're following has rules. That the world they're invested in isn't going to bend to external factors that are irrelevant to them.
An author can do whatever he wants with the characters, that's not false. But the author should also have the responsibility to make sure it fits in cohesively with the other events in the narrative he has created.
That's pretty much how I see it. I even see some of the dialogue going like this:
Trunks: "This guy sounds like an unbelievable foe. Whatever happened to him?!
Gohan: "As powerful as this Freeza was, father was better. He became a Super Saiyan and eventually defeated him!
Trunks: "That easily?"
Gohan: "Unfortunately not. It was only a matter of time before Freeza would come back to prove he's still the most powerful being in the universe. He came to earth with his father, who was also incredibly powerful. No one on earth was a match for either of the two, and a battle with them looked inevitable---until father arrived. He was able to defeat both Freeza and his father before any harm was done to the earth. I've grown considerable enough to defeat a being of Freeza's level...but father, he's always been on a whole other level."
Dat fanfic mind going in-depth
"First I whip it out! Then I thrust it! With great force! Every angle...! It penetrates! Until...! With great strength...! I... ram it in! In the end... We are all satisfied... And you are set free...!" ~Dante~
Again, Goha would have no way of knowing how strong Freeza is. To me Future Gohan is at best Freeza's equal.
Last edited by RandomGuy96 on Sun May 19, 2013 5:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
The Monkey King wrote:
RandomGuy96 wrote:
dbgtFO wrote:
Please elaborate as I do not know what you mean by "pushing Vegeta's destruction"
He's probably referring to the Bardock special. Zarbon was the one who first recommended destroying Planet Vegeta because the saiyans were rapidly growing in strength.
It was actually Beerus disguised as Zarbon #StayWoke
Herms wrote:The fact that the ridiculous power inflation is presented so earnestly makes me just roll my eyes and snicker. Like with Freeza, where he starts off over 10 times stronger than all his henchmen except Ginyu (because...well, just because), then we find out he can transform and get even more powerful, and then he reveals he can transform two more times, before finally coming out with the fact that he hasn't even been using anywhere near 50% of his power. Oh, and he can survive in the vacuum of space. All this stuff is just presented as the way Freeza is, without even an attempt at rationalizing it, yet the tone dictates we're supposed to take all this silly grasping at straws as thrilling danger. So I guess I don't really take the power inflation in the Boo arc seriously, but I don't take the power inflation in earlier arcs seriously either, so there's no net loss of seriousness. I think a silly story presented as serious is harder to accept than a silly story presented as silly.
Trunks already knows that Goku easily defeated Mecha Freeza. He knows who Freeza is. It is a simple A to B conversation to see how Trunks learned he was Freeza's superior.
I just don't see any other option for me personally. Trunks and Goku ( Yardrat ) are on a different level than Goku was on Namek. It's been a year later so that makes sense as well.
I just feel that's the best approach. I think the Trunks being "arrogant" stems from the confidence he had in his Grade 3 form against Cell. Other than that, I always saw Future Trunks as being more cautious than arrogant. I think his confidence against Freeza speaks volumes. I don't think he would suggest that Freeza use his full-power if he wasn't already aware he'd be able to handle him on some level.
"First I whip it out! Then I thrust it! With great force! Every angle...! It penetrates! Until...! With great strength...! I... ram it in! In the end... We are all satisfied... And you are set free...!" ~Dante~
