Official Unofficial Power Level Discussion Thread

[RandomGuy96]

It has logic behind it and there isn't a reason to disregard it so far so I don't see why people wouldn't accept this multiplier.

Stop saying that your opinion is fact. You think its 4,000 because you think that it's SS3 x 10. That's fine. I question how it makes sense when Golden Ape Baby didn't stomp easily, and why Baby's forms have seemingly random multipliers, but whatever. However, going by the Baby fight, and Baby's forms being compared to the SS forms in the Perfect Files and resembling them, I think that x40,000 makes ten times more sense. That is also fine. I stated my reasoning above.

then the next error is that Kid Buu was not 12 trillion, since base GT Goku ~ Kid Buu ~ Rildo.

No error here. Well, at least not on my part. They weren't equal to Buu, they were stated to be stronger by an unknown amount. Also, that wasn't Baby Saga Goku. Also also, Anime Kid Buu is ridiculously overpowered, and 12 trillion might actually be too low for him.

[Draken]

It has logic behind it and there isn't a reason to disregard it so far so I don't see why people wouldn't accept this multiplier.

Stop saying that your opinion is fact. You think its 4,000 because you think that it's SS3 x 10. That's fine. I question how it makes sense when Golden Ape Baby didn't stomp easily, and why Baby's forms have seemingly random multipliers, but whatever. However, going by the Baby fight, and Baby's forms being compared to the SS forms in the Perfect Files and resembling them, I think that x40,000 makes ten times more sense. That is also fine. I stated my reasoning above.

then the next error is that Kid Buu was not 12 trillion, since base GT Goku ~ Kid Buu ~ Rildo.

No error here. Well, at least not on my part. They weren't equal to Buu, they were stated to be stronger by an unknown amount. Also, that wasn't Baby Saga Goku. Also also, Anime Kid Buu is ridiculously overpowered, and 12 trillion might actually be too low for him.

Goku using your numbers in SSJ3 would be 40 billion. That's 3 thousand times weaker than Kid Buu. How the heck would an Earth spirit bomb kill him at that point? How on earth would either Goku or Vegeta survive a puff of air coming out of his head holes?

[TheMightyOzaru]

When they Hell did I say my opinion was fact !? No need to get defensive. I was merely saying it made sense.

[RandomGuy96]

Goku using your numbers in SSJ3 would be 40 billion. That's 3 thousand times weaker than Kid Buu. How the heck would an Earth spirit bomb kill him at that point? How on earth would either Goku or Vegeta survive a puff of air coming out of his head holes?

Those are my numbers for their manga versions. Kid Buu is suppose to be on a whole different level from every other Buu, which would include Buuhan, who mildly annoyed Vegetto at points. And again, it was never said that they were equal to Kid Buu, it was said that they were stronger by an unknown amount, and Goku was heavily implied to get even stronger than that almost immediately after.

When they Hell did I say my opinion was fact !? No need to get defensive, jeez. I was merely saying it made sense.

You said "SSJ4 is also 4,000x base not 40,000x base" (not "I think that it should be 4,000x base"), indirectly said that my mutliplier was an error (since you said "also" after Draken tried to point out an error), said that 4,000 "makes the most sense" (again, not "I think it makes the most sense"), and said "there's no reason to disregard it so I don't see how anyone could have a different multiplier". So yes, you did say that your opinion was fact. Several times.

[Draken]

So how does a fusion of A*A (assuming Vegeta didn't lose his Majin Boost) get stronger than A*400, when A is greater than 400?

[TheMightyOzaru]

When they Hell did I say my opinion was fact !? No need to get defensive, jeez. I was merely saying it made sense.

You said "SSJ4 is also 4,000x base not 40,000x base" (not "I think that it should be 4,000x base"), indirectly said that my mutliplier was an error (since you said "also" after Draken tried to point out an error), said that 4,000 "makes the most sense" (again, not "I think it makes the most sense"), and said "there's no reason to disregard it so I don't see how anyone could have a different multiplier". So yes, you did say that your opinion was fact. Several times.

I don't have to use the "IMO" line to state an opinion. I didn't say it was an error and it wasn't a follow up to Draken's statement. I merely said I don't know why people wouldn't accept it. I didn't say people have to.

[RandomGuy96]

So how does a fusion of A*A (assuming Vegeta didn't lose his Majin Boost) get stronger than A*400, when A is greater than 400?

....did I say that Z Goku was stronger than Vegetto?

Anyway, I have a theory that Goku and Vegeta were allowed to keep some of Vegetto's power after defusing in the anime. It explains seemingly impossible feats and statements, like SS Goku one-shotting Ultimate Gohan in Buu's mind, SS2 Goku fighting on par with someone that he already said was on a whole different level than Buuhan (when Goku was previously trash to Buutenks), and SS2 Vegeta defeating Gotenks in Buu's mind.

[Draken]

So how does a fusion of A*A (assuming Vegeta didn't lose his Majin Boost) get stronger than A*400, when A is greater than 400?

....did I say that Z Goku was stronger than Vegetto?

Anyway, I have a theory that Goku and Vegeta were allowed to keep some of Vegetto's power after defusing in the anime. It explains seemingly impossible feats and statements, like SS Goku one-shotting Ultimate Gohan in Buu's mind and SS2 Goku fighting on par with someone that he already said was on a whole different level than Buuhan.

I must have misunderstood you then. You said Kid Buu was worlds above Buuhan, who could annoy Vegetto, and then Goku could fight Kid Buu, so I took that to mean you said Goku > Vegetto.

[RandomGuy96]

That's what's implied. Not that I go with it. Anyway, the important thing is that Anime Kid Buu is waaaaaaaaaaay stronger than Buuhan, and base GT Goku was a lot stronger than him back in the Black Star Saga. Him being 12,000,000,000,000 is if anything low balling it, I'm just trying to get the SEG and Perfect Files to work together.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Anime Kid Buu doesn't really have to be stronger. I've only seen Goku suggest Pure Buu was the strongest Buu and even then Goku only claims he is on a whole other level than any of the previous Buu's. That doesn't necessarily mean stronger. Yeah Goku follows up with a you're ridiculously strong! But that can easily mean Buu is strong in general not that he stronger than all of the other Buus. I haven't seen anyone else claim Pure Buu was on a whole different level.

[Kamiccolo9]

Anime Kid Buu doesn't really have to be stronger. I've only seen Goku suggest Pure Buu was the strongest Buu and even then Goku only claims he is on a whole other level than any of the previous Buu's. That doesn't necessarily mean stronger. Yeah Goku follows up with a you're ridiculously strong! But that can easily mean Buu is strong in general not that he stronger than all of the other Buus. I haven't seen anyone else claim Pure Buu was on a whole different level.

Kibitoshin and the Narrator both say Pure Buu is the strongest.

[RandomGuy96]

Anime Kid Buu doesn't really have to be stronger. I've only seen Goku suggest Pure Buu was the strongest Buu and even then Goku only claims he is on a whole other level than any of the previous Buu's. That doesn't necessarily mean stronger. Yeah Goku follows up with a you're ridiculously strong! But that can easily mean Buu is strong in general not that he stronger than all of the other Buus. I haven't seen anyone else claim Pure Buu was on a whole different level.

No, he says something like "you're one dense guy, but your power, speed and recovery are all incredible! You're on a whole different level from all the Buus up to now!", basically directly saying that he's way stronger than Buuhan. Even if that statement didn't follow him talking about his speed and strength, it would be incredibly stupid if he meant that Kid Buu was on a whole different level because he was so much weaker. Hence my theory that in the anime, Goku kept a ton of Vegetto's power, because earlier he admitted inferiority to Super Buu and got effortlessly thrashed in 30 seconds by Buutenks.

Kibitoshin and the Narrator both say Pure Buu is the strongest.

Kid Buu is the strongest in the anime, that's undisputed, but what's debated is how much stronger. I think that it's fairly obvious that he was supposed to be many times stronger than Buuhan.

[Kamiccolo9]

Kibitoshin and the Narrator both say Pure Buu is the strongest.

Kid Buu is the strongest in the anime, that's undisputed, but what's debated is how much stronger. I think that it's fairly obvious that he was supposed to be many times stronger than Buuhan.

I was answering MightyOzaru's post. I agree with you.

I've only seen Goku suggest Pure Buu was the strongest Buu and even then Goku only claims he is on a whole other level than any of the previous Buu's. That doesn't necessarily mean stronger. Yeah Goku follows up with a you're ridiculously strong! But that can easily mean Buu is strong in general not that he stronger than all of the other Buus. I haven't seen anyone else claim Pure Buu was on a whole different level.

[RandomGuy96]

Oh, must have missed that.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Anime Kid Buu doesn't really have to be stronger. I've only seen Goku suggest Pure Buu was the strongest Buu and even then Goku only claims he is on a whole other level than any of the previous Buu's. That doesn't necessarily mean stronger. Yeah Goku follows up with a you're ridiculously strong! But that can easily mean Buu is strong in general not that he stronger than all of the other Buus. I haven't seen anyone else claim Pure Buu was on a whole different level.

No, he says something like "you're one dense guy, but your power, speed and recovery are all incredible! You're on a whole different level from all the Buus up to now!", basically directly saying that he's way stronger than Buuhan. Even if that statement didn't follow him talking about his speed and strength, it would be incredibly stupid if he meant that Kid Buu was on a whole different level because he was so much weaker. Hence my theory that in the anime, Goku kept a ton of Vegetto's power, because earlier he admitted inferiority to Super Buu and got effortlessly thrashed in 30 seconds by Buutenks.

Different level of what? Power, speed, tenacity, recovery, what? Goku's statement is fairly vague. If he said: "You're stronger than all the other Buu's up to this point" I would agree that the anime Pure Buu is stronger but that isn't necessarily the case. Pure Buu has proven that his tenacity is definitely on a whole different level than all the Buu's up to this point. I don't see why diffusing would give Goku more power. If it had simply been Vegeta and Goku getting their respective halves of Vegetto's power, SSJ Goku could thrash Evil Buu yet he didn't.

Anime Kid Buu doesn't really have to be stronger. I've only seen Goku suggest Pure Buu was the strongest Buu and even then Goku only claims he is on a whole other level than any of the previous Buu's. That doesn't necessarily mean stronger. Yeah Goku follows up with a you're ridiculously strong! But that can easily mean Buu is strong in general not that he stronger than all of the other Buus. I haven't seen anyone else claim Pure Buu was on a whole different level.

Kibitoshin and the Narrator both say Pure Buu is the strongest.

Where. I keep seeing people claim this yet they never show me anything.

[Kamiccolo9]

If he said: "You're stronger than all the other Buu's up to this point" I would agree that the anime Pure Buu is stronger but that isn't necessarily the case.

Again, you have both the Old Kaioshin and the Narrator saying that Pure Buu is the strongest Buu in the Anime. There aren't that many ways to interpret a clear statement like that.

[TheMightyOzaru]

Again where?

[RandomGuy96]

...are you serious?

Him directly saying that Kid Buu is on a whole different level than any other Buu (a statement that is ALWAYS used to say "way stronger"), including Buuhan, right after saying that his power is incredible isn't enough? Honestly, you're reaching reaaaaaaaaalllllyyyyyy far now. You'd have to disregard basic sentence structure to deny this one.

Also, a god and the omniscient narrator both also said that Kid Buu was the strongest Buu. In the anime.

[Draken]

...are you serious?

Him directly saying that Kid Buu is on a whole different level than Buuhan (a statement that is ALWAYS used to say "way stronger") right after saying that his power is incredible isn't enough? Honestly, you're reaching reaaaaaaaaalllllyyyyyy far now. You'd have to disregard basic sentence structure to deny this one.

Also, a god and the omniscient narrator both also said that Kid Buu was the strongest Buu. In the anime.

Ima have to stop you there, the Narrator has shown stupidity far too many times to be considered omniscient

[Kamiccolo9]

Again where?

You know the line in the manga where the Old Kaioshin says that Pure Buu is the "original, most troublesome one?" It's the same line, except that in the anime he adds powerful on the end of it. The Narrator says it at the end of the episode where Goku goes SSJ3 in the Pure Buu fight, I believe.