Unpopular DB opinions

[TheGmGoken]

Vegeta got hit by a fucking Genki Dama, a KAioken x4 Kamehmeha, and a Kaioken x3 beatdown. I think that's reasonable to get beaten by weaker people and STILL put up an epic fight. Raditz got hit with ONE attack stronger than himself and it led to his death. When have Boo been taken down by someone weaker? Do you mean the Genki Dama?

Raditz got hit by several powerful attacks, and likely had either a bruised or cracked sternum making it difficult to dodge an attack he evaded earlier. Buu fought three people that were weaker than him (goku, vegeta, and fat buu). It took three people and a wish from Porunga to stop him. You won't get an argument that Vegeta is a tough bastard, but Raditz is by no means a pushover. In comparison to where the heroes ended up, sure, but not when we first meet him.

Raditz got hit by Goku and Piccolo....that actually hurt? WHEN!? Not counting Makkospaonan(Special Beam cannon ) Gohan hit him with a rage attack that led to his death. That's a pushover. Vegeta took 3 powered up attacks(Genki Dama and Kaioken attacks) and still kicked ass. Boo did not get beat by 3 people. He got beat by the entire Earth.

[Kamiccolo9]

Vegeta got hit by a fucking Genki Dama, a KAioken x4 Kamehmeha, and a Kaioken x3 beatdown. I think that's reasonable to get beaten by weaker people and STILL put up an epic fight. Raditz got hit with ONE attack stronger than himself and it led to his death. When have Boo been taken down by someone weaker? Do you mean the Genki Dama?

Raditz got hit by several powerful attacks, and likely had either a bruised or cracked sternum making it difficult to dodge an attack he evaded earlier. Buu fought three people that were weaker than him (goku, vegeta, and fat buu). It took three people and a wish from Porunga to stop him. You won't get an argument that Vegeta is a tough bastard, but Raditz is by no means a pushover. In comparison to where the heroes ended up, sure, but not when we first meet him.

My biggest issue with Raditz was when Nappa showed up, and grew five of him. Even in the story, he's treated as something of a joke.

[Gaffer Tape]

Really? Nappa grew five Raditzes? Hmm, that must have been some filler episode I haven't seen. I do remember him growing six Saibaimen, though.

In all seriousness, though, I don't really see how this is a problem, or, if it is, how it's a problem exclusive to Raditz. Tenshinhan beats up Jackie Chun. Goku beats up Tenshinhan. Trunks slices Freeza into pieces effortlessly. The story consistently plays up new threats by comparing them to old threats. Saibaimen being comparable to Raditz is not the story saying, "Man, that Raditz is such a loser. You should all think he's pathetic." It's the story saying, "Oh, shit. That guy who was so tough that Goku died trying to beat him is so miniscule compared to these new guys that they make fun of him and can grow multiple minions EACH of whom are as strong as him! Watch out!" In fact, Kuririn pretty much does express that exact sentiment.

[ABED]

Vegeta got hit by a fucking Genki Dama, a KAioken x4 Kamehmeha, and a Kaioken x3 beatdown. I think that's reasonable to get beaten by weaker people and STILL put up an epic fight. Raditz got hit with ONE attack stronger than himself and it led to his death. When have Boo been taken down by someone weaker? Do you mean the Genki Dama?

Raditz got hit by several powerful attacks, and likely had either a bruised or cracked sternum making it difficult to dodge an attack he evaded earlier. Buu fought three people that were weaker than him (goku, vegeta, and fat buu). It took three people and a wish from Porunga to stop him. You won't get an argument that Vegeta is a tough bastard, but Raditz is by no means a pushover. In comparison to where the heroes ended up, sure, but not when we first meet him.

Raditz got hit by Goku and Piccolo....that actually hurt? WHEN!? Not counting Makkospaonan(Special Beam cannon ) Gohan hit him with a rage attack that led to his death. That's a pushover. Vegeta took 3 powered up attacks(Genki Dama and Kaioken attacks) and still kicked ass. Boo did not get beat by 3 people. He got beat by the entire Earth.

I didn't say they hurt him. He got hit. Anyone else on Earth at the time would've either been killed or even injured. In comparison to Vegeta he wasn't anywhere as strong, but he was not weak.

That's not a pushover, why does it matter if it's a rage attack? It was incredibly powerful. It gave Raditz an injured sternum. I'm not arguing who's stronger than whom or who's tougher. I'm merely pointing out that Raditz is plenty tough. He was tougher than Goku and Piccolo had been up to that point.

Buu got beat by 3 people, one of which uses an attack that can take it's power from entire planets, and even then that wasn't enough, but ultimately someone weaker than him prevailed. The fact that someone weaker than another wins doesn't make him/her a pushover.

Forget what I just said, Gaffer said it far better and more succinctly.

[TheGmGoken]

Tien dominated Master Roshi?

[Kid Buu]

Really? Nappa grew five Raditzes? Hmm, that must have been some filler episode I haven't seen. I do remember him growing six Saibaimen, though.

Yeah, its kind of like saying Dr. Gero basically made multiple Mecha Freezas from scraps then?

[MediaFanGirl93]

- I think Goku and Chi-Chi are okay parents because they at least try to do what's best for their kids. They may not be getting any Parents of The Year awards, but they are far from being bad (how the fandom makes them out to be). They won't win "Worst Parents of the Year" either (you know "worst parents" as in the parents who are so bad, social workers have to come and take away their kids).

I think you should read this post then

But we need to agree that Ethan Mars is the WORST Parent ever.

Don't watch his son
Let his son disobey him
NEVER taught his kids to look BOTH ways before crossing the Street(Which leds to a death).
Got K.O at playground.
Have to save his son(This is where he becomes a hero) with 2 other people helping.
And when his son has only 18 hours LEFT to live.

Ethan Mars is having sex with a girl he met 2 days ago .

Ethan Mars = Definition of what a true Parent should be (Wish I thought of this when we had Goku parenting threads)

And yet Vegeta is portrayed as a perfect father, and fans ignore his harsh treatment of Future Trunks in the Cell Saga.

[Saiga]

To me, mocking Raditz would be similar to mocking Piccolo Daimao. They're not pathetic because the series moved on after them.

However, maybe one thing that makes Raditz different is that he was quite a bit weaker than Nappa and Vegeta, who were sort of his 'co-villains'. But there's a far bigger gap between Nappa and Vegeta than Raditz and Nappa, so I don't know.

[Kamiccolo9]

Really? Nappa grew five Raditzes? Hmm, that must have been some filler episode I haven't seen. I do remember him growing six Saibaimen, though.

In all seriousness, though, I don't really see how this is a problem, or, if it is, how it's a problem exclusive to Raditz. Tenshinhan beats up Jackie Chun. Goku beats up Tenshinhan. Trunks slices Freeza into pieces effortlessly. The story consistently plays up new threats by comparing them to old threats. Saibaimen being comparable to Raditz is not the story saying, "Man, that Raditz is such a loser. You should all think he's pathetic." It's the story saying, "Oh, shit. That guy who was so tough that Goku died trying to beat him is so miniscule compared to these new guys that they make fun of him and can grow multiple minions EACH of whom are as strong as him! Watch out!" In fact, Kuririn pretty much does express that exact sentiment.

Damn it, I always forget about the one Tien kills. Six is good
Jackie Chun and Tien weren't just discarded though. Roshi managed to put up a fight against Tien, and managed to help convince him to stop following the Crane Hermits orders. Tien was used to play up Goku, true, but later saves everyone else when Piccolo destroys the arena. As for Freeza, I'm not a fan of how that was handled. Personally, I feel that bringing Freeza back was unnecessary, and the same purpose could have been served by Cold going to Earth alone, but that could be a whole other topic by itself. After the Saiyan Arc, Raditz is only mentioned once (by Freeza), and he's the main protagonist's brother!

Raditz considered himself to be an elite warrior, a member of the strongest race in the universe, while the whole time his partners could literally pull comparable beings out of their pockets. And seeing as it's implied that Saibaimen had been used before, he even knew that his strength was nothing special. He thought that Vegeta would bring him back to life, while in actuality, Vegeta considered him to be a joke.

Personally, I think Vegeta just kept him around to humor Nappa, who at least seemed to have some kind of camaraderie with him, seeing as he suggested bringing him back to life. Granted, that is entirely speculation on my part.

Vegeta calls him "pitiful."

Chapter: 204 (DBZ 10), P10.1
Context: Vegeta talking about Raditz losing to Goku and co.
Vegeta: “"Geez, what a pitiful guy... To be killed by guys with battle powers slightly over 1,000 at most...”

And when suggested that they revive Raditz, Vegeta replies that they are better off without him.

[Kid Buu]

Vegeta trash talks everyone though, including people that kick his ass!

Also, I'm assuming Raditz is more useful as unlike the Saibaman he gets ten times stronger when Vegeta makes a moon.

[RandomGuy96]

Jackie Chun and Tenshinhan weren't just discarded though. Roshi managed to put up a fight against Tenshinhan, and managed to help convince him to stop following the Crane Hermits orders. Tenshinhan was used to play up Goku, true, but later saves everyone else when Piccolo destroys the arena. As for Freeza, I'm not a fan of how that was handled. Personally, I feel that bringing Freeza back was unnecessary, and the same purpose could have been served by Cold going to Earth alone, but that could be a whole other topic by itself. After the Saiyan Arc, Raditz is only mentioned once (by Freeza), and he's the main protagonist's brother!

Having Cold come to Earth without Freeza would kind of kill the whole point of that scene in the first place. Which I'm fine with, because Trunks is an awful fanfic character.

[Ringworm128]

No a fanfic character would be Hulk Hogan or The Rock going shopping after writing some poetry. That or SSJ10 Omega Broli who is the strongest in the hypermegarockmanmultiverse.

[Saiga]

Trunks had those common OC traits before fanfic writers were spamming them anyway.

[Kamiccolo9]

Trunks had those common OC traits before fanfic writers were spamming them anyway.

Sorry if I'm missing something obvious, but what does "OC" mean?

[Storm]

Having Cold come to Earth without Freeza would kind of kill the whole point of that scene in the first place.

Not necessarily. Establish that he's Freeza's father and that he's in Freeza's weight class (or stronger?), and the audience and characters will have the same reaction to Trunks.

[Saiga]

Trunks had those common OC traits before fanfic writers were spamming them anyway.

Sorry if I'm missing something obvious, but what does "OC" mean?

Original character donut steel.

[Kamiccolo9]

Trunks had those common OC traits before fanfic writers were spamming them anyway.

Sorry if I'm missing something obvious, but what does "OC" mean?

Original character donut steel.

Gotcha. Thanks!

[RandomGuy96]

Having Cold come to Earth without Freeza would kind of kill the whole point of that scene in the first place.

Not necessarily. Establish that he's Freeza's father and that he's in Freeza's weight class (or stronger?), and the audience and characters will have the same reaction to Trunks.

I guess killing someone in Freeza's general tier (moderately weaker, in Cold's case) would be impressive, but it would lose the obvious "wow!" factor Toriyama was going for when he brought back Freeza specifically.

[Kid Buu]

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[ABED]

Having Cold come to Earth without Freeza would kind of kill the whole point of that scene in the first place.

Not necessarily. Establish that he's Freeza's father and that he's in Freeza's weight class (or stronger?), and the audience and characters will have the same reaction to Trunks.

I guess killing someone in Freeza's general tier (moderately weaker, in Cold's case) would be impressive, but it would lose the obvious "wow!" factor Toriyama was going for when he brought back Freeza specifically.

I never thought it had a wow factor, but even so, not having Freeza there saves the audience having to see the most powerful evil in the universe reduced to a punchline and it also gets rid of the ridiculous leap in logic that after having all his limbs cut off, taking Goku's blast head on, and Namek's explosion, he somehow survived.