Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" Dub Turns 14; Still Unreleased

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by SSJ Electric Fury » Wed Jan 21, 2015 4:52 pm

Super Saiyan Prime wrote:Every time this thread is bumped my heart quivers with anticipation.
Is this concrete news or just another fabrication?
More bickering about dubs of yore?
Or will we finally find out more?
I click on the link with despair to see,
that it's nothing new to little old me.
You should get an award for that.

Yeah, Tockar's Twitter said Ocean Kai is going to see the light of day soon (the tweet is from November 3rd). I haven't heard something of the sort from anyone else. Even if FUNimation already has a comparable product, the Canadian powers that be would not easily let a dub that took so long to be taken care of collect dust, would they? Perhaps they're waiting until they've set up a deal for a home video release, since that's what people demand these days? Ocean Group does have its fans out there.
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by TheBalishChannel » Wed Jan 21, 2015 4:56 pm

Someone over at Ocean Studios might as well come out and say it's cancelled at this point. I've remained optimistic for the past four years, but the fact that it's now 2015 and this dub still hasn't hit the airwaves makes me believe that it won't ever hit the airwaves.

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Wed Jan 21, 2015 4:56 pm

SSJ Electric Fury wrote:Yeah, Tockar's Twitter said Ocean Kai is going to see the light of day soon (the tweet is from November 3rd). I haven't heard something of the sort from anyone else.
That turned out to be wrong. To quote myself from an earlier post...
TheBlackPaladin wrote:I hate to be "that guy" again, but I've got a pessimistic theory going on right now...

I've noticed that Tockar has been retweeting Toonami's announcements of Kai coming back on the network. Does Toonami have any air time in Canada anymore? I don't think they do (but correct me if I'm wrong). So he may just think that he's been given the clear to announce that he's Freeza because he thinks the project is on the verge of airing, what with seeing all this Kai-related activity on Twitter...when in reality, he (innocently) doesn't understand the whole situation, and the Ocean dub is still not going to air in the immediate future.
We have every reason to believe now that that's what happened. It is not Tockar's job to understand the (crazy, weird, unusual) situation behind having two English dubs of this show, so I don't blame him for misunderstanding, but it seems pretty apparent now that it was a misunderstanding. In our excitement, some of us just jumped the gun and assumed that he was announcing the Ocean dub.
A "rather haggard" translation of a line from Future Gohan in DBZ, provided to FUNimation by Toei:
"To think of fighting that is this fun...so, it was pleasant fight, as many as, therefore is a feeling which is good the fight where."

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by 90sDBZ » Wed Jan 21, 2015 7:26 pm

Kakacarrottop wrote:But the FUNi dub for those episodes is a poor man's version as well. I'm sure this is just nostalgia talking, if you grew up with the Westwood dub for the later Z episodes as opposed to FUNi's dub for them then i'm sure you'd look upon that dub in a favorable light. A lot of people who didn't grow up with the original 1999-2003 FUNi dub don't seem to like it much (especially people from non-English speaking countries), well that's what I've seen at least. I grew up with it and looking back i think it was pretty awful, when you take off the nostalgia vision you see it turned DBZ into some stupid cartoon where semi-pro actors scream for 15 minutes and engage in moronic dialogue with techno & metal music in the background. The Westwood dub feels a bit closer to the original Japanese version, although in a saturday morning cartoon sort of way. I only saw a bit of the original 1996-1998 Ocean dub and none of the Westwood dub growing up (i live in Australia) but i still much prefer them over Funi's in-house dubs.
As someone who grew up with the Westwood dub I can honestly say it's dire. I'd take Funi's inhouse dub over that any day of the week, Season 3 and all.

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by NitroEX » Wed Jan 21, 2015 7:47 pm

TheBlackPaladin wrote:
SSJ Electric Fury wrote:Yeah, Tockar's Twitter said Ocean Kai is going to see the light of day soon (the tweet is from November 3rd). I haven't heard something of the sort from anyone else.
That turned out to be wrong. To quote myself from an earlier post...
TheBlackPaladin wrote: I've noticed that Tockar has been retweeting Toonami's announcements of Kai coming back on the network. Does Toonami have any air time in Canada anymore? I don't think they do (but correct me if I'm wrong). So he may just think that he's been given the clear to announce that he's Freeza because he thinks the project is on the verge of airing, what with seeing all this Kai-related activity on Twitter...when in reality, he (innocently) doesn't understand the whole situation, and the Ocean dub is still not going to air in the immediate future.
We have every reason to believe now that that's what happened. It is not Tockar's job to understand the (crazy, weird, unusual) situation behind having two English dubs of this show, so I don't blame him for misunderstanding, but it seems pretty apparent now that it was a misunderstanding. In our excitement, some of us just jumped the gun and assumed that he was announcing the Ocean dub.
I recall Tockar mentioning on Twitter that he'd check with his agent when the dub would be released but after that he went quiet again. I guess either he forgot about it or got some bad news, who knows.

Maybe the NDAs are still a thing for the actors but at this point it's getting ridiculous since this dub is one of the worst kept secrets I've ever seen.

Found the link: https://twitter.com/leetockar/status/530054268313944064 (you need to scroll down and read his replies)

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by ErikB » Wed Jan 21, 2015 7:54 pm

90sDBZ wrote: As someone who grew up with the Westwood dub I can honestly say it's dire. I'd take Funi's inhouse dub over that any day of the week, Season 3 and all.
Ditto. I grew up in Ontario, and my only outlet for Dragon Ball Z on television was YTV (which aired the Westwood dub from "Android Explosion" onward) and I absolutely loathed the Westwood dub when it took over. I warmed up to it very slightly near the end but I still strongly favoured the in-house dub. I'd still take the in-house dub if I had to choose between the two (thankfully I don't).

As for the topic, so turns out Lee Tockar was likely...maybe...possibly (?) mistaken, eh? Well so much for that.
I'm really intrigued by Richard Cox playing Goku. Now if only I could actually see it.

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Wed Jan 21, 2015 9:22 pm

NitroEX wrote:I recall Tockar mentioning on Twitter that he'd check with his agent when the dub would be released but after that he went quiet again. I guess either he forgot about it or got some bad news, who knows.

Maybe the NDAs are still a thing for the actors but at this point it's getting ridiculous since this dub is one of the worst kept secrets I've ever seen.
Or--what I think is the most likely scenario--his agent either didn't know, or did know and told Tockar, "Don't you dare tell anyone."

I agree, keeping this dub a secret and honoring NDAs about the dub at this point is a joke. Too much has been revealed...but at the same time, people can get in major trouble if they're broken. It depends who broke the NDA and how major the break is, but it's very rarely just a slap on the wrist. When it comes to talent agents, maintaining confidentiality is extremely important for their agency to be regarded as reputable. If it leaks that an agent of all people announced the premiere date, it's quite likely that that agency's reputation would be tarnished. Agents only get paid by commission (as in, only if their actors get paid), and if that agency earned a reputation as an info-leaker, casting directors could potentially say, "Don't audition any of this agency's actors, they can't be trusted because they leaked top-secret info."

And again, one of the biggest reasons NDAs exist is because producers often have very specific marketing plans in mind for shows. We've already seen a lot of Kanzenshuuers say that they've "lost interest" in this dub, and it hasn't even aired yet. If news of its production hadn't been leaked, the news would still be fresh, and people would still be interested. One could definitely make a case that this has been a consequence of not honoring NDAs.
A "rather haggard" translation of a line from Future Gohan in DBZ, provided to FUNimation by Toei:
"To think of fighting that is this fun...so, it was pleasant fight, as many as, therefore is a feeling which is good the fight where."

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by Theophrastus » Thu Jan 22, 2015 3:34 am

So do we have any knowledge about who could possibly be funding this production? IIRC, before the actual confirmation from Morrow on that podcast, didn't Sean Schemmel mention something about an "alternative English dub" being produced?

Does that imply that Funimation is funding this for whatever reason, or is it more likely that some other company (does Westwood Media still exist?) came to them and said "hey, sell us a license so we can produce a dub using the Ocean voice actors and air it in Canada and anywhere else outside the US that'll take it"?
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Thu Jan 22, 2015 4:20 am

Theophrastus wrote:So do we have any knowledge about who could possibly be funding this production? IIRC, before the actual confirmation from Morrow on that podcasr, didn't Sean Schemmel mention something about an "alternative English dub" being produced?

Does that imply that Funimation is funding this for whatever reason, or is it more likely that some other company (does Westwood Media still exist?) came to them and said "hey, sell us a license so we can produce a dub using the Ocean voice actors and air it in Canada and anywhere else outside the US that'll take it"?
'Tis a mysery. We have no clues as to who's producing the Ocean dub or why.

Sean Schemmel was the first "official" person to mention the Ocean dub. He said on his Facebook that the (then unreleased) FUNimation dub of Kai was going to be great (which--side note--it was!), and a Facebook user calling himself "Subzero Ice"--who also happens to be a Kanzenshuuer--mentioned that he thought the Ocean dub would be good as well.

Schemmel then elaborated that yes, there would be an Ocean dub, and that he thought it would be bad. He said that he didn't think it would be bad because of the actors, but because the soundtrack was going to be replaced with "crappy Canadian music," and that even the sound effects were going to be modified. He mentioned one particular moment that stuck out to him where Bulma casually turns her head, and an over-the-top "whoosh" sound was added in for no apparent reason. Interestingly enough, that implies that he may have seen some of the dub...and this was back in 2010.

He then asked Subzero Ice how he even knew about the Ocean dub, as it was supposed to be strictly internal FUNimation info. Subzero Ice did not elaborate, and has not elaborated since. I'm curious as to whether or not he'll reveal who he is once the Ocean dub airs. Either way, if he can't reveal his true identity, it's a safe assumption that there's job security concerns, so I don't blame him. Revealed identity or no, it hasn't stopped him from dropping a few interesting nuggets of info here and there. Apparently, the UK channel that's airing Kai now was aware of the existence of the Ocean dub, but Toei did not give them the option to air it, telling them that they had to use FUNimation's dub.

Our last clue is that, in the credits of the Nicktoons-edited version of Kai, "Ocean Studios" was listed as being responsible for helping with the edits. My takeaway from that is that there's no way this dub was ever going to be anything other than a TV-only dub, so Ocean was likely involved with both recording an alternative dub and creating a "TV-safe" version.

Too many voice actors and behind-the-scenes people have said that this dub was recorded for it to be a hoax. I 100% believe that voice actors were brought in and recorded their dialogue. However, I'm no longer 100% certain that we'll see it. I suspect that there's some kind of (possibly unforeseen) technical or legal difficulty we don't know about that's keeping it from being released. The thing to keep an eye on is Canadian TV. This dub is being recorded in Canada, and I have a hard time believing it's a coincidence that Kai hasn't aired on Canadian TV yet.
A "rather haggard" translation of a line from Future Gohan in DBZ, provided to FUNimation by Toei:
"To think of fighting that is this fun...so, it was pleasant fight, as many as, therefore is a feeling which is good the fight where."

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by Bananape » Wed Jan 28, 2015 8:22 pm

TheBalishChannel wrote:Someone over at Ocean Studios might as well come out and say it's cancelled at this point. I've remained optimistic for the past four years, but the fact that it's now 2015 and this dub still hasn't hit the airwaves makes me believe that it won't ever hit the airwaves.
You know what I think? I think the producers had a fit against the FUNimation dub and decided to destroy the tapes master copies of the dub just to stick to all the people who were looking forward to the release.

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by Kakacarrottop » Wed Jan 28, 2015 8:51 pm

Man they sure are taking their "sweet time", we've been waiting 5 years (half a decade) for this dub, which i find ironic considering their previous Dragon Ball related dub was at a frantic pace with nearly half the series getting dubbed in just 1 or 2 years. This dub really needs to happen so Ocean can prove themselves to all the rabid haters out there. All their Dragon Ball related dubs have been plagued by problems out of their control, their 90s DB/DBZ dubs had rampant censorship (thanks to Saban & BLT) and awful scripts (thanks to FUNi), their later Z dub was rushed (so they could keep up with FUNi's dub) and presumably had a low budget (thanks to AB Groupe & Westwood) and GT got handed over to the crappy Blue Water dubbing studio due to cheapness on AB Groupe's part.
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by Kamiccolo9 » Thu Jan 29, 2015 1:51 pm

Kakacarrottop wrote:Man they sure are taking their "sweet time", we've been waiting 5 years (half a decade) for this dub,
If I'm not mistaken, it hasn't even been "officially" announced yet.
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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Thu Jan 29, 2015 7:40 pm

Kamiccolo9 wrote:
Kakacarrottop wrote:Man they sure are taking their "sweet time", we've been waiting 5 years (half a decade) for this dub,
If I'm not mistaken, it hasn't even been "officially" announced yet.
You're not mistaken, and that's a very important thing to remember. There has been nothing in the way of an official announcement. All of the info we've found out about the Ocean dub of Kai thus far has come from people who shouldn't have revealed what they did.
A "rather haggard" translation of a line from Future Gohan in DBZ, provided to FUNimation by Toei:
"To think of fighting that is this fun...so, it was pleasant fight, as many as, therefore is a feeling which is good the fight where."

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by sangofe » Fri Jan 30, 2015 3:08 pm

TheBlackPaladin wrote:
Theophrastus wrote:So do we have any knowledge about who could possibly be funding this production? IIRC, before the actual confirmation from Morrow on that podcasr, didn't Sean Schemmel mention something about an "alternative English dub" being produced?

Does that imply that Funimation is funding this for whatever reason, or is it more likely that some other company (does Westwood Media still exist?) came to them and said "hey, sell us a license so we can produce a dub using the Ocean voice actors and air it in Canada and anywhere else outside the US that'll take it"?
'Tis a mysery. We have no clues as to who's producing the Ocean dub or why.

Sean Schemmel was the first "official" person to mention the Ocean dub. He said on his Facebook that the (then unreleased) FUNimation dub of Kai was going to be great (which--side note--it was!), and a Facebook user calling himself "Subzero Ice"--who also happens to be a Kanzenshuuer--mentioned that he thought the Ocean dub would be good as well.

Schemmel then elaborated that yes, there would be an Ocean dub, and that he thought it would be bad. He said that he didn't think it would be bad because of the actors, but because the soundtrack was going to be replaced with "crappy Canadian music," and that even the sound effects were going to be modified. He mentioned one particular moment that stuck out to him where Bulma casually turns her head, and an over-the-top "whoosh" sound was added in for no apparent reason. Interestingly enough, that implies that he may have seen some of the dub...and this was back in 2010.

He then asked Subzero Ice how he even knew about the Ocean dub, as it was supposed to be strictly internal FUNimation info. Subzero Ice did not elaborate, and has not elaborated since. I'm curious as to whether or not he'll reveal who he is once the Ocean dub airs. Either way, if he can't reveal his true identity, it's a safe assumption that there's job security concerns, so I don't blame him. Revealed identity or no, it hasn't stopped him from dropping a few interesting nuggets of info here and there. Apparently, the UK channel that's airing Kai now was aware of the existence of the Ocean dub, but Toei did not give them the option to air it, telling them that they had to use FUNimation's dub.

Our last clue is that, in the credits of the Nicktoons-edited version of Kai, "Ocean Studios" was listed as being responsible for helping with the edits. My takeaway from that is that there's no way this dub was ever going to be anything other than a TV-only dub, so Ocean was likely involved with both recording an alternative dub and creating a "TV-safe" version.

Too many voice actors and behind-the-scenes people have said that this dub was recorded for it to be a hoax. I 100% believe that voice actors were brought in and recorded their dialogue. However, I'm no longer 100% certain that we'll see it. I suspect that there's some kind of (possibly unforeseen) technical or legal difficulty we don't know about that's keeping it from being released. The thing to keep an eye on is Canadian TV. This dub is being recorded in Canada, and I have a hard time believing it's a coincidence that Kai hasn't aired on Canadian TV yet.
Must be frustrating to be one of the voice actors of the dub, not knowing if their work will ever be available... (And all that wasted money for whoever hired all these actors!)

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by JEFFMAN219 » Sat Jan 31, 2015 12:55 am

I don't get it, why does DB Kai need another English dub for? Funimation already did a fantastic job with their dub of Kai.

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Sat Jan 31, 2015 1:10 am

JEFFMAN219 wrote:I don't get it, why does DB Kai need another English dub for? Funimation already did a fantastic job with their dub of Kai.
Well, even taking quality out of the equation, DBZ didn't need another English dub besides the FUNimation one either...and yet, the Westwood dub was made nevertheless. I'd have to imagine it's a legal thing. Perhaps something about FUNimation not having the rights to air their dub on TV in certain territories.
A "rather haggard" translation of a line from Future Gohan in DBZ, provided to FUNimation by Toei:
"To think of fighting that is this fun...so, it was pleasant fight, as many as, therefore is a feeling which is good the fight where."

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by eledoremassis02 » Sat Jan 31, 2015 1:47 am

JEFFMAN219 wrote:I don't get it, why does DB Kai need another English dub for? Funimation already did a fantastic job with their dub of Kai.
It's nice, especially when some of the older voice actors return. I'm still not a fan of the in-house FUNi voices or their acting (some I like, some I dont mind, and some I dont really care for), so I'm looking forward to it.

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by Kakacarrottop » Sat Jan 31, 2015 2:04 am

JEFFMAN219 wrote:I don't get it, why does DB Kai need another English dub for? Funimation already did a fantastic job with their dub of Kai.
Perhaps because people like the Ocean cast and want them to dub more Dragon Ball related stuff? Trust me, not everyone out there loves FUNi's in-house cast, a lot of English speaking people (eg UK & Canadian fans) mainly grew up with the Ocean cast instead.
"I will literally dress as Goku and walk around jumping up and down, pretending to fly, in public if this ever gets an official release"

- ShadowDude112 on Ocean's Kai dub

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by TheBlackPaladin » Sat Jan 31, 2015 2:54 am

Kakacarrottop wrote:
JEFFMAN219 wrote:I don't get it, why does DB Kai need another English dub for? Funimation already did a fantastic job with their dub of Kai.
Perhaps because people like the Ocean cast and want them to dub more Dragon Ball related stuff? Trust me, not everyone out there loves FUNi's in-house cast, a lot of English speaking people (eg UK & Canadian fans) mainly grew up with the Ocean cast instead.
Oh, absolutely, I have no doubt that some fans want an Ocean dub--I want one myself, after all--but the question is more so why there is a need for one.

A legal technicality is the only explanation that I can see that makes sense. This is further evidenced by what Subzero Ice said, that the UK network (I want to say "Kix"?) that's airing Kai on UK TV was aware of the Ocean dub, but Toei did not give them the option to air it. Since the Ocean dub of Kai is clearly going to be a TV-only dub without any kind of home video release, all signs seem to point towards some weird legal technicality involving Kai's TV broadcast rights for being the reason why there's a need for an Ocean dub.
A "rather haggard" translation of a line from Future Gohan in DBZ, provided to FUNimation by Toei:
"To think of fighting that is this fun...so, it was pleasant fight, as many as, therefore is a feeling which is good the fight where."

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Re: Ocean Studios' "Dragon Ball Kai" dub seems to be coming.

Post by Kakacarrottop » Sat Jan 31, 2015 3:15 am

TheBlackPaladin wrote:
Kakacarrottop wrote:
JEFFMAN219 wrote:I don't get it, why does DB Kai need another English dub for? Funimation already did a fantastic job with their dub of Kai.
Perhaps because people like the Ocean cast and want them to dub more Dragon Ball related stuff? Trust me, not everyone out there loves FUNi's in-house cast, a lot of English speaking people (eg UK & Canadian fans) mainly grew up with the Ocean cast instead.
Oh, absolutely, I have no doubt that some fans want an Ocean dub--I want one myself, after all--but the question is more so why there is a need for one.

A legal technicality is the only explanation that I can see that makes sense.
Does there even need to be an answer? An alternative English dub for Kai obviously isn't going to harm anyone other than perhaps FUNimation who'll probably be losing out on TV/DVD revenue if the dub is released in Canada/The UK which is the supposed plan. Having more English dubs in the end means there is more stuff for fans to watch and discuss, which is a good thing. I mean i'm very glad there are a wide range of English dubs for this franchise like the Big Green dub, the Blue Water dub, the Ocean dub(s) and the Speedy dub, having just one consistent dub by the same cast (FUNimation) would be very boring and stale imo.
"I will literally dress as Goku and walk around jumping up and down, pretending to fly, in public if this ever gets an official release"

- ShadowDude112 on Ocean's Kai dub

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