Is dragonball ruined now?

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

cgi-computer generated imagery. even adobe flash is cgi. look it up on websites. even the part of Wikipedia you cant edit list adobe as an example of CGI. don't just think Pixar when you think CGI. its computer made images. also even if its not cgi ...which it IS! It's still poorly made garbage now. the colors are so saturated. in battle of gods goku's so shiny those white squares on his face look like...well I cant say it here but you know what it looks like. only when he's ssj god with his jersey shore spray on tan does he not look like that. Modern animation is just lazy. give me the RELA animation with cels and DBZ is on the right path,but this....this is a literal eye sore that is disrespectfull as hell.

Please let us know if you are not a native English speaker. If you are, please review the community guidelines - members are expected to type properly. This is borderline-unreadable.

Furthermore, you don't appear to actually be reading and listening to what other members are saying to you. The entire animation process was just outlined, but you've completely ignored that and continued on with your own made-up definitions and explanations.

These types of posts are unacceptable, and additional ones of this nature will be met with strikes lodged against your account. You do not want these.

The reason I'm not responding to each and every post is I don't know how to do that thing where you respond to many people with a single post,and I know doing more then 1 post in a row gets people en-raged,which I'm not out to do. If you can tell me how to reply to like 3 people with a single post that'd be much obliged. As for my English,nothing is wrong other then a few typos,which I said was because my keyboard is garbage.

Also I don't recall the animation process being outlined,my bad. I must have missed it. It's just if I respond to many people I at least double post,which gets people mad for some reason. I don't wanna get people mad,I know this very thread alone s controversial and might make people think I'm trying to bs DBZ or annoy people, which to me seams pointless and is NEVE my intent on here.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

You know what...I just had a conversation in private messages about this and I think I just expressed my stance perfectly, so let me copy it to here. (Apologies in advance to those who hate double posting, this'll just be my 1 time I go out of my way to do this. Don't shoot me.) But in my message said "Nice to see I'm not alone on here. I've had people agree with me a lot on this, but only through xbox and people I talk to face to face. Online forums wise it seams social justice warriors try to make things a big deal over a opinion I'm conveying, from my point of view respectfully. I kinda feel conflicted. Part of me wants to hop off the ship before I see anymore childhood scarring events. Things like the pointless new animation and utter disregard for continuity and everyone being out of character irks me to no end it seams.

However, another part of me WANTS SO BAD to enjoy dragonball. I wanna say "you know what, there's no way to beat around the bush. Toriyama has sold out. There's no getting around it. But he gave me such found memories that I'll give him a free pass from his *sins* if you will".....But it's so hard to do. I just feel like a blind fanboy accepting crap just for being called dragonball. I fell like I'm part of the problem. I'm just so torn that I don't know what to do.

Am I being a brat for wanting to leave the franchise that helped me get through tough times? (parents divorce, brother's suicide, death of pets and friends and MANY other dark times) Yeah they're disrespecting fans with the things they've done sine 2008.....but part of me wans to just accept the cheap games,adobe flash tier coloring on everything they've been releasing and all the other stupid things. It feels like both loyalty and a ridiculous fanboy bias at this point.

On the other hand I feel justified leaving. Watching super has honestly become chore. My inner child yearns for another Goku goes ssj3 moment in my life. I feel like I got Vegeta on one ear saying "leave this crap. It's a disgrace. Where's your pride"...well he's actually screaming that....and Goku on the other ear saying to remember all of what Dragonball's done for me and support it despite what feels like a knife in the back. Just say whatever to the faults,as the man deserves to be as lazy as he wants.

I know all this sounds a bit dramatic ....it's just I'm more attached to this show then I probably should be. It's was always my light in the darkness since I was 3,I'm turning 22 soon. I just want somebody's perspective on this. In fact I think I expressed my thoughts perfectly in this message. I think Ill copy his to the thread. IF you got thoughts to way in on what you think I should do,it'd be much appreciated. I just fell I need the spark/fire/passion for the franchise "re-sparked" if you will. Thanks."

That's it. Sorry for this wall of text. I know I might seam EXTREMELY mellow dramatic to some....many.....everyone....I don't know. I'm the guy who was given the choice between "growing up and stop watching the baby cartoon" by girls or lose them forever...and un-hesitantly chose the show every time. Thousands of dollars spent on dvds,statues,games,ECT.....I could go on,but my point is I LOVE the franchise. More then anyone else in the world in my mind. Which fuels my want to stay,AND my fuel to leave as much as that may make no sense and sound like trolling.

I'm not trying to offend anyone, you wanna like this franchise, do as you will. It doesn't hurt anybody so feel no shame in doing it! I'm not here to mock it,it's just from my point of view....just about everything the franchise had made since 2008 if no everything has felt like another dragonball evolution. Call that a hyperbole, exaggeration to the 11th degree, justified or whatever you will,but that's how I feel. Imagine yourself in that situation and you'll know what I feel like to an extent. Hope I made y point clear,again SORRY FOR WALL OF TEXT!

I don't wanna annoy anyone with this, nor do I want an argument or to be told I'm right or wrong. *******************************************All I want is for someone out there with a good head on there shoulders to give that perspective I need to either rekindle my love of this franchise and see it in a better light so I can no longer feel enraged when seeing new material and love it all again!(Which I think some people of tried, but sadly nothing has hit home)....or say goodbye once and for all to this beloved franchise.*******************************************************

My Love of DragonBall...as crazy as I sound for saying this...both makes me want to stay out of love AND it makes me want to leave out of outrage.

[TheGreatness25]

How an anybody criticize the franchise for being drawn in a different way now? That's the current way of doing things. You wouldn't criticize Toei for doing voice acting with their new technology over what they used in the 80's, would you? That's just how things are drawn. The art suffers a bit, but let's not forget that in the DB/Z/GT (dare I?) anime, the art was REALLY bad for most of the time. Nostalgia will always hold someone back from seeing the truth, but personally, I can only remember a handful of moments where I looked at it and went, "Man, that looks AWESOME!" Because it didn't. The manga art looks great, and I'm not saying that from a nostalgia perspective, I just started reading the manga in the past few years. The art in the manga is very, very good. But once it's translated into moving scenes with all of the various artists who worked on it, DB/Z never really looked amazing. It certainly can't hold up to any anime today. And Dragon Ball Super, while it may look weird, I think it's probably superior in every way to the art in the past. Sometimes they have weird faces now, yeah. Sometimes the CGI for attacks look out of place, sure. But overall, the proportions and consistency is much more solid today than it's ever been.

I think Dragon Ball is being ruined by all of the seemingly useless content being put out now. Maybe Super is great; I'm withholding my opinion until I watch it on Blu-ray (whenever that might be). But I was not impressed at all by the movies. It had nothing to do with the art, it had to do with the story and how I feel it's making the series feel meaningless. But that's just my opinion. I'd prefer they leave it alone until they milk it so much, that it will take away any fond memory I ever had of the series.

But also, look a it from a real perspective. I'm sorry for this, but DBZ the anime was not as great as I always thought it was. To me, I know the entire story and I know all of the intricate details. But an episode can't stand on its own. I popped in several episodes for my girlfriend and she was bored out of her mind. In my mind, I was like, "Here it comes, here it comes!" And I waited and waited through a bunch of wind movement, staring, useless banter and then when THE big moments happened... they kind of didn't pay off.

What I'm saying is that nostalgia is undefeated every single time someone tries to compare new content to the old. I will always love Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z (and even that red-headed bastard step-child, GT), and I might like Super, but I'll never LOVE it like I loved the original. And the story in the original is unbeatable for me. But when I think about it, the old anime was kind of a chore to sit through most of the time. This is creating that feeling that we had back then for a new generation and there's nothing wrong with that. I'd just personally rather they didn't touch my childhood to do it. I mean really, create something new already, can't live off of one series forever. Well, apparently they can.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

How an anybody criticize the franchise for being drawn in a different way now? That's the current way of doing things. You wouldn't criticize Toei for doing voice acting with their new technology over what they used in the 80's, would you? That's just how things are drawn. The art suffers a bit, but let's not forget that in the DB/Z/GT (dare I?) anime, the art was REALLY bad for most of the time. Nostalgia will always hold someone back from seeing the truth, but personally, I can only remember a handful of moments where I looked at it and went, "Man, that looks AWESOME!" Because it didn't. The manga art looks great, and I'm not saying that from a nostalgia perspective, I just started reading the manga in the past few years. The art in the manga is very, very good. But once it's translated into moving scenes with all of the various artists who worked on it, DB/Z never really looked amazing. It certainly can't hold up to any anime today. And Dragon Ball Super, while it may look weird, I think it's probably superior in every way to the art in the past. Sometimes they have weird faces now, yeah. Sometimes the CGI for attacks look out of place, sure. But overall, the proportions and consistency is much more solid today than it's ever been.

I think Dragon Ball is being ruined by all of the seemingly useless content being put out now. Maybe Super is great; I'm withholding my opinion until I watch it on Blu-ray (whenever that might be). But I was not impressed at all by the movies. It had nothing to do with the art, it had to do with the story and how I feel it's making the series feel meaningless. But that's just my opinion. I'd prefer they leave it alone until they milk it so much, that it will take away any fond memory I ever had of the series.

But also, look a it from a real perspective. I'm sorry for this, but DBZ the anime was not as great as I always thought it was. To me, I know the entire story and I know all of the intricate details. But an episode can't stand on its own. I popped in several episodes for my girlfriend and she was bored out of her mind. In my mind, I was like, "Here it comes, here it comes!" And I waited and waited through a bunch of wind movement, staring, useless banter and then when THE big moments happened... they kind of didn't pay off.

What I'm saying is that nostalgia is undefeated every single time someone tries to compare new content to the old. I will always love Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z (and even that red-headed bastard step-child, GT), and I might like Super, but I'll never LOVE it like I loved the original. And the story in the original is unbeatable for me. But when I think about it, the old anime was kind of a chore to sit through most of the time. This is creating that feeling that we had back then for a new generation and there's nothing wrong with that. I'd just personally rather they didn't touch my childhood to do it. I mean really, create something new already, can't live off of one series forever. Well, apparently they can.

I disagree, I feel it holds up and no modern anime has good animation to me besides DXD. The main problem is the COLORING. It all is so bright and looks "THE EXACT SAME" as a fan animation. Look up a DBZ fan animation like absolon or multiverse on youtube. Compare that to the old animation and the new. It looks just like the new animation, because they are both cheap digital colored examples of animation. I can excuse the fans who have no means of doing high class animation, it's impressive for fans to make stuff like that, however you can see a clear downgrade in coloring when you go from movie 13 to say yo son goku and friends or an even better example-plan to eradicate the saiyans vs the remake. The remake looks awful, like it wasn't made by an official company, yeah I know digital coloring is how things are done now, but that doesn't excuse it. They have to make a conscious choice to say "screw the fans, I don't care if we can afford this vastly superior animation. They'll buy this crap no matter how bad we color it!" Also Just because your girlfriend doesn't like the episodes on there own doesn't mean they don't I mean I get it's subjective, I won't attack you for an opinion but I can't see how any of the episodes of Ball/Z/GT could be seen as boring. Some boring next to others by comparison, yeah but they all aren't great because of nostalgia, they have their own quality. While battle of gods and ROF...yeah I agree, while I do hate the new animation, I also hated how boring they were for me. I could od a 1 hour rant on how flawed battle of gods was, at least the newer film was not as bad. That t least shows improvement on both toei and funi's ends. Gotta give credit where it's due.

[Doctor.]

Absalon actually looks really dark, even more than GT, in terms of colors, not sure what you're talking about.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

Absalon actually looks really dark, even more than GT, in terms of colors, not sure what you're talking about.

I mean the colors. They're all digital. Digital coloring hurts my eyes honestly. Unless it's done properly. I'm not apposed to digital animation, just BAD digital animation. High school DxD looks good an it's colored digitally. But in the new art style everyone looks so slimy. It's grouse.

[MCDaveG]

Absalon actually looks really dark, even more than GT, in terms of colors, not sure what you're talking about.

I mean the colors. They're all digital. Digital coloring hurts my eyes honestly. Unless it's done properly. I'm not apposed to digital animation, just BAD digital animation. High school DxD looks good an it's colored digitally. But in the new art style everyone looks so slimy. It's grouse.

Well, that is because of the additive colour mixing. Unless they will paint the colours again, you won't be able to watch anything new.

[irreality]

The colors in DBZ were all extremely 80's/early 90's and super bright, too. Only GT and some movies have non-saturated colors. Color saturation in my mind is a plus, not a minus, but I can see how people feel differently. It is something I always associated with Dragon Ball/DBZ, to be honest. (and for that matter, now that I think about it, something much of the animation I like has in common, vibrant colors). Not disputing that it hurts your eyes or you don't like it, but it is an issue of personal preference, not something that "ruins everything forever".

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

The colors in DBZ were all extremely 80's/early 90's and super bright, too. Only GT and some movies have non-saturated colors. Color saturation in my mind is a plus, not a minus, but I can see how people feel differently. It is something I always associated with Dragon Ball/DBZ, to be honest. (and for that matter, now that I think about it, something much of the animation I like has in common, vibrant colors). Not disputing that it hurts your eyes or you don't like it, but it is an issue of personal preference, not something that "ruins everything forever".

I wouldn't call the colors saturated. The colors in the buu saga for example were bright yes, but you can see a CLEAR difference between the buu saga's coloring and battle of god's colors. The digital coloring makes it look like a fan made product is a big problem.
Also isn't weather or not something's quality is bad to the point it's ruined forever...always a matter of personal opinion? I don't think it's 2 different things.

[Hellspawn28]

Dragon Ball is supposed to look colorful. I hated the color shame in GT because it didn't had the colorful look that draws the viewer's eyes of the world of Dragon Ball in my opinion.

[irreality]

I wouldn't call the colors saturated. The colors in the buu saga for example were bright yes, but you can see a CLEAR difference between the buu saga's coloring and battle of god's colors. The digital coloring makes it look like a fan made product is a big problem.

It isn't clear. Check out this images:

Spoiler:

If anything, many of the colors in Buu Saga are *more* saturated, not less. Look at Bulma's hair, even Buu's pink (or Namek green, wowza!). I'm not sure what you even mean by the colors looking "fanmade" -- it is just shading, and I know many extremely excellent fanartists.

Also isn't whether or not something's quality is bad to the point it's ruined forever...always a matter of personal opinion? I don't think it's 2 different things.

Maybe? … but I never thought the different color pallete of GT ruined anything forever even though I find it too unwatchable. It alone doesn't affect the legacy of previous series since it is a stylistic choice. I don't think it affects the overall story being told, is what I mean, and nobody who is an outside observer is going to judge DBZ based on the coloring of Super. It doesn't change anything about DBZ, even in retrospect.

[LSSJGODSSJ4Gogeta]

I agree GT was a drop down in animation from the buu saga. Some stuff looked better but it was a little too dark. However GT looks a HELL of a lot better then super. To me anyways. I think super would look amazing if they animated it the same way Z was.

And I think I'm done with this post. I got responses, thanks to those who tried helping me rekindle my love of dragonball,and I got my answer. I hate the half-assed things the franchise has been doing but I'm going to try to enjoy it for what it is. Thanks to those who tried to help,sorry if my perspective annoyed people, I know it did. My apologies.

[OWmyDragonBallz]

Dragon Ball has been ruined since Yo Son Goku/Friends Return. The only exception I would give is Kai for manga fans who want a faster paced Z with an accurate English dub despite some of the crappy redrawn scenes.

[Draconic]

The two new movies are the most financially and critically succesful Dragon Ball material ever. Just because a handful of youtube commenters dislike them for not being DE BEE ZEEE it doesn't mean the majority of people don't like them. It is also too early to call anything based on Dragon Ball Super, even though, of the three series, it has the best first 11 episodes.

[HybridSaiyan]

The reason the new modern art and animation ruins Dragon Ball is because of how terrible the battle choreography is. It feels nothing like the original, the old atmosphere isn't there anymore. Injury inflicts aren't really impactful anymore, the violence is lost and it's just became a cheesy series since 2009+
The entire Goku and Beerus fight in Super was lame imo. Vegeta vs Pui Pui stomps all over it.

[sintzu]

The reason the new modern art and animation ruins Dragon Ball is because of how terrible the battle choreography is.

The only way we'll see that type of choreography is either in the movies or if they give Super the same amount of drawings DB&Z had which were 3500 unlike Super which has 2500-3000.

[buutenks]

Allot of complaints about things that existed in dbz and db.Allot of filler went in there also.

I have no complaints,the only time when animation was a bit off was ep 5,since i noticed it.But other episodes animation was fine.

As for the long drawn fights,i like them to be long drawn.Why i enjoyed dbz and still do.What i disliked about BOG was the short time goku fought beerus.I am glad super will have like a 1 hour and half+ fight.In the movie it was a measly 11 minutes.

Freeza vs goku was a total of 5 hours fight hehe.

Hope in ROF saga,goku and vegeta vs freeza will be 3-4 hours long haha ^^

[SylentEcho]

Yep. It's ruined. Burned to the ground, reduced to ashes, and scattered into the wind. A mere shell of it's former self. An empty husk where there was once a live body. An affront to the senses. A plague on all our houses. It may have actually murdered my future children and swallowed my soul.

Been listening to a lot of Metal lately, haven't you?

It's not DBZ. It's Dragon Ball Super.

Rest assured, DBZ is still its own thing. =)

This.

You can complain all you want, we all have our complaints. But to say DBZ is "ruined" right now is an outrageous claim my friend.

He's saying Dragon Ball is ruined for him. I don't share his opinion, but I get where he's coming from and a lot of my friends feel that way, too. Sometimes, I feel like only the die-hards can enjoy Super. People who actually "get" the characters and especially Toriyama's style, sense of humor, and storytelling way. They've made the show a lot less serious, but Beerus is kind of hilarious and I really enjoy him being a spoilt child-like character. He's actually worse than Boo!

About the whole CGI/animation thing, I agree completely with the following comment:

If we're gonna judge whether the quality of the animation has ruined Dragon Ball, Dragon Ball would have been ruined a long time ago.

Personally, I'm kind of liking the new animation. It's an updated look and that's needed. Sure, they're not drawn in as much detail as Z, but as long as the fights look like the way they did in episode 11, I have no complaints. It's modern and good looking in my opinion.

As for the long drawn fights,i like them to be long drawn.Why i enjoyed dbz and still do.What i disliked about BOG was the short time goku fought beerus.I am glad super will have like a 1 hour and half+ fight.In the movie it was a measly 11 minutes.

I couldn't agree more. When Goku and Beerus had that long stare-down in the latest episode, I had such a broad smile on my face. That was my good old DBZ right there.

It's not ruined but I understand the disappointment.
Even the games do a better job than Super in catching the DragonBall feel.

I hear this a lot, but Ball had a different feel than Z, the movies had a slightly different feel than both of them and GT was something else entirely. The only thing consistent for the most part was the animation. What fun would Super be if were just a copy of Z? People need to welcome a little change.

[HybridSaiyan]

The reason the new modern art and animation ruins Dragon Ball is because of how terrible the battle choreography is.

The only way we'll see that type of choreography is either in the movies or if they give Super the same amount of drawings DB&Z had which were 3500 unlike Super which has 2500-3000.

Well that's Toei's own fault. The Goku vs Beerus fight was really terrible on episode 12 due to the 2500-3000 drawings and slow pacing.

[Doctor.]

Vegeta vs Pui Pui stomps all over it.

You talk about choreography and then you say this, this one is better? How, in any way, shape, or form, is it better? Pui Pui tries to land a flurry of punches while Vegeta dodges. That's 95% of the fight right there, the rest is Vegeta killing Pui Pui, which is admittedly impressive, but nothing that could top Goku vs Beerus' best moments.