Wow, the Japanese soundtrack is horrible!

[xzero]

Since we're on the topic of Menza, what else has he done besides GT? I've always wondered that.

I know he did 6 of the DBZ movies (definitely 6-9, probably 10-11 as well).

Here's some other stuff he's done:

Television
The Ant Bully - Composer & audio post, 7 interstitials, DNA Productions/Warner Bros./Playtone, Cartoon Network
Jimmy Neutron - Boy Genius Composer 13 interstitials. DNA Productions, Nickelodeon Networks
The Adventures of Jimmy Neutron - Nickelodeon Networks - audio post supervisor, season one
Wishbone - PBS/Lyrick Studios composer 4 various episodes
Compromising Situations - Main Title Theme, Showtime Networks
Mikeal & Mikeal 2 - composer, Christmas Specials, CBN Int’l
Positively Texas - Show theme music package, CBS-KTVT
Bucky And Vinny Do Hollywood - Show Open, Showtime Networks

Animation
Jimmy Neutron - Runaway Rocketboy, The Pilot, DNA Productions
Beet:The Vandal Buste - Illumitoon Productions 26 episodes
SuperBook - CBN animated Pilot audio post, music editor
Jingaroo Children’s’ series - Beckett Entertainment composition, sound design, & audio post production
David & Goliath - Bible Quest animated show, composer, audio post supervisor
Nanna and Lil’ Puss Puss - DNA Productions, composer

SOURCE: http://www.menzamusic.com/credits.html

[Piccolo Daimaoh]

I know he did 6 of the DBZ movies (definitely 6-9, probably 10-11 as well).

Movies 10, 12 and 13 were done by Nathan Johnson.

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com.au/ency ... p?id=21841

[xzero]

I know he did 6 of the DBZ movies (definitely 6-9, probably 10-11 as well).

Movies 10, 12 and 13 were done by Nathan Johnson.

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com.au/ency ... p?id=21841

That makes sense. He did the redubbed movies and episodes as well, though he's not credited for it on the site.

[Piccolo Daimaoh]

That makes sense. He did the redubbed movies and episodes as well, though he's not credited for it on the site.

I kind of liked Johnson's redubbed score. It was at least better than the original seasons 1 and 2 score.

[mystic trunks]

A good example is this particular scene that has always stood out for me; Goku finally beating Majin Boo.

Japanese
English

Boo's death feels boring and you don't get the sense of "It's finally over!" from the dub's music as you do from the original. Especially when you have the non-stop talking going on in the dub. There's not even a moment of silence within that part of the dub. It's as if the music just keeps going.

LMAO! Why are they playing that peaceful music when people are getting their asses kicked?! Great example of the JPN BGM not fitting the action. Thank you.

[VegettoEX]

LMAO! Why are they playing that peaceful music when people are getting their asses kicked?! Great example of the JPN BGM not fitting the action. Thank you.

Really? I mean, really?

Something I posted in another thread:

One anime-based comparison that had a similar "controversy" was the Chun-Li vs Vega/Balrog fight in the Street Fighter II anime movie. In the original Japanese version, the music played was a very ambient and laid-back tune that happened to be playing on Chun-Li's stereo. It set the mood in an incredible way because of the contrast of this seductive music transposed against the horrible violence taking place. Over in the English dub of the scene, it cuts in and gets swapped out for a KMFDM tune that goes for the same over-the-top "GGRRR!!! HARDCORE VIOLENCE!!!" that FUNimation went for a lot. Does it "fit"...? Well, sure. I guess...?

I'm struggling to think of one specific example off the top of my head, but haven't any of you ever seen a Hollywood movie with the same situation? Where these absolutely atrocious acts of violence are taking place with a backdrop of sullen and contrasting music? I mean, it's a standard trope. Kikuchi's and Tokunaga's scores do this often. Does Menza have anything like that? Anything at all in terms of artistic contrast and dynamics? A sense of place?

You've basically defined the scene as "VIOLENCE OF ANY KIND NEEDS LOUD MUSIC THAT HAS THIS EXACT TEMPO AND NUMBER OF BASS BEATS", which is laughable.

Whether or not you like that particular music or not is one thing, but to say it's out of place? When there's precedent and artistic vision that showcases exactly why you're wrong...? For modern examples, look at a lot of the ways music was used in the Watchmen movie, and somehow tell me that it wasn't effective.

[mystic trunks]

Actually no. If you watch the American version of the clip he posted, during the recap scene,(which is what I was referrring to) the music is not loud and in your face at all.

[Bussani]

Watchmen is a good Hollywood example. My friend actually said to me that it sounded to him like the songs had just been randomly applied to scenes, but I felt that it worked. There's also that one scene from Reservoir Dogs (warning: violent content). For non-Hollywood examples, Evangelion (especially the movies) probably has quite a few.

Actually no. If you watch the American version of the clip he posted, during the recap scene,(which is what I was referrring to) the music is not loud and in your face at all.

I think you're missing the point.

Personally, the Japanese music there gets more of an emotional reaction and sense of it being over from me. Not just the fight, but the whole series in a way.

[jjgp1112]

I'm just gonna say what I said before and say that subtlety just for the sake of subtlety is stupid. Most of DBZ's fighting scenes are over-the-top, cliffs being destroyed, explosions-filled, bodies flying everywhere fighting. There's not much "subtlety" you can get out of it, and if you try, it will sound forced as hell. I'm sorry, but seeing Gohan flying up to and killing a bunch of Cell Jrs and having slow placed, repetitive music just comes off as fucking dull to me. Sure, the song fit when it was originally used at the beginning of Movie 7, but in that scene and the billion other scenes that it was slapped onto (particularly the scene where Gohan owned the hell out of Cell with the Super Kamehameha) it just sounded horribly off.

[mystic trunks]

Exactly. They seemed to have tried to just make it fit.

[Taku128]

How is peaceful music subtle? It's pretty obvious that the peaceful music doesn't match the un-peaceful visuals.

[Kaboom]

When it's used right, that contrast of the violent imagery vs the peaceful music it what makes it work. It's used to raise tension and emotion, rather than just "WAAAAARGH HARDCORE THINGS ARE HAPPENING."

[jjgp1112]

The problem is that few DBZ fights are like this and require emotions to be raised.

Like, Frieza torturing Goku by firing a bunch of beams at him, or doing the same to Piccolo. Yeah, I can see slower-paced music to THOSE scenes. But Goku and Vegeta knocking each other into cliffs or Gohan slaughtering Cell Jrs (well, this possibly could work if the scene was done the same way it was in the manga)? Not so much.

[JulieYBM]

I'm just gonna say what I said before and say that subtlety just for the sake of subtlety is stupid. Most of DBZ's fighting scenes are over-the-top, cliffs being destroyed, explosions-filled, bodies flying everywhere fighting. There's not much "subtlety" you can get out of it, and if you try, it will sound forced as hell. I'm sorry, but seeing Gohan flying up to and killing a bunch of Cell Jrs and having slow placed, repetitive music just comes off as fucking dull to me. Sure, the song fit when it was originally used at the beginning of Movie 7, but in that scene and the billion other scenes that it was slapped onto (particularly the scene where Gohan owned the hell out of Cell with the Super Kamehameha) it just sounded horribly off.

That piece contrasts the beauty of Cell's perfect power with the horrifying reprocussions it will have, as well as the terror the others (barring Gohan) are experiencing.

[mystic trunks]

When it's used right, that contrast of the violent imagery vs the peaceful music it what makes it work. It's used to raise tension and emotion, rather than just "WAAAAARGH HARDCORE THINGS ARE HAPPENING."

You didn't watch the english clip did you? Beacuse if you did, you would realize it is not like that at all.

[Piccolo Daimaoh]

That piece contrasts the beauty of Cell's perfect power with the horrifying reprocussions it will have, as well as the terror the others (barring Gohan) are experiencing.

LOL

The beauty of Cell's power?

If someone is experiencing extreme terror in a movie then there's not going to be slow paced music to accompany that scene.

[JulieYBM]

That piece contrasts the beauty of Cell's perfect power with the horrifying reprocussions it will have, as well as the terror the others (barring Gohan) are experiencing.

LOL

The beauty of Cell's power?

If someone is experiencing extreme terror in a movie then there's not going to be slow paced music to accompany that scene.

Yes, the beauty of his supposed 'perfection' as he expresses it (by revving up to full power), but not even fellow martial artists can find beauty in it, at least none present at the time.

[Kaboom]

You didn't watch the English clip did you? Beacuse if you did, you would realize it is not like that at all.

No, but I figured that if I made a generalization, there was about a 90% or so chance I'd be right.

[UristtheGreat]

If someone is experiencing extreme terror in a movie then there's not going to be slow paced music to accompany that scene.

I beg to differ.

[Piccolo Daimaoh]

If someone is experiencing extreme terror in a movie then there's not going to be slow paced music to accompany that scene.

I beg to differ.

What? When she was getting stabbed? That was pretty fast paced.